Dervish update effects on GW

There really needs to be a Ranger Update.

Pet Scythe was the only reason why I didn't suck, but now with the update...

Agh...

Hard to imagine a better IAS than HoF, a 4 adrenaline 25% IAS with no downsides... at all. And in the primary attribute line. Which reduces VoS cost, and grants extra armor.

It's an exaggeration. But I would not be surprised if there was a lot of truth to it.

Heart of Fury is actually worse than it used to be, believe it or not.

It used to be a 2/3 maintainable 33% IAS (which is slightly better than permanent 25%).

Now it's a permanent 25% which requires adrenaline. That's a slight nerf.

So, it's up to 3 times better than Hundred Blades, except that it can be stripped and is better utilized by dervish secondaries?

In other words, it's exactly what I feared it would be. Well, at least they moved Mystic Sweep to mysticism. The leaked version was basically Whirlwind Attack, only energy-based. o_o

Given that the Scythe's attack speed was lowered to 1.5, and the increased ability of the Dervish to generate adrenaline (and Burning lol) I can't really see it being a nerf at all.

Having a 3 derv hero team is an almost cluster-mess-you-up kinda team. Even the most stubborn of healers in the Thunderhead Keep mission (HM) got owned. Badly.

I've been reading that Derv heroes don't utilize flash chants very well and that their AI seems to still work off old build styles.

Are you having better success with new builds?

The krewe team must not know much about Guild Wars.

The dervish has taken on a different role, which is fine and dandy, except 2 things rule Guild Wars, high DPS and insane protection.
Having frontline support is utterly pointless, the only profession you want in the frontline is the one with the most DPS, which is the Assassin.

It was a good idea, a crowd control frontliner, almost like the Guardian, but in a game where full DPS is better than crowd control and all you need is a monk to keep you alive. It's not going to work.

Intensity is lol stupid. Elementalists need higher damage not more AoE. If I hit 10 foes with 30 damage, it still won't compare to the killing prowess of Rits, Necros and any other profession with high DPS.

Asuran Scan is a lolwut factor as well. It was a good skill, but other skills come to mind that needs nerfing hmm?

"By Urals Hammer!" an AoE Vengeance, players might like it if it affects all allies *hint, hint ArenaNet!!*

Who is Shirley?

And I agree that this was a painful hit for rangers in HM; Asuran Scan made damage builds possible for the ranger.

It's more of an inconvenience to the other martial professions.

Its an old pun, probably made famous by Leslie Nielsen on Airplane!

I rarely ran AScan, but a thought occurs to me. If you cannot miss target foe due to any in-game mechanic, such as blindness, blocking stances/chants, etc. does that mean one could AScan Abaddon and continue to hit him even when he's technically not vulnerable? Would be amusing...

Flail has a negligible downside (easily negated with a cancel stance), +33% IAS.

That doesn't sound like much, but that 8% more is quite significant.

EDIT -

Not necessarily "better utilized", it's just easily abused by secondaries. +33% IAS can make up for the lower attribute without runes.

Primary Dervishes can run MoP in their bars, while secondaries can't, even tough I've observed similar results when playing W/D with just Flail+Whirlwind.

So is having to carry a cancel stance.

Not really, when the cancel stance can provide advantages by itself, like an improved adrenaline flow when compared to the Primary Dervish.

FGJ + Enraged + Flail. Sure, that's three skills, but the outcome is well worth it.

When the cancel stance is on a 20 second cycle and not canceling means that you're inflicting 0 damage for the remainder of the stance, it's kind of a big deal.

Besides, Heart of Fury benefits greatly from the fact that Mysticism is also making IMS flash enchantments cheaper, and you don't have to cancel out of your IAS to have a speed buff.

And no, the 8% difference in IAS is hardly noticable.

Your reasoning makes no sense.

You're arguing that the marginal utility of 8% extra IAS is worth a second skill, or even third skill in your example, given the other benefits of said skills.

But you're ignoring that the Dervish, with HoF who does NOT have to carry a cancel stance has a higher marginal utility for the simple fact that the second and third skill you mention can be chosen without regard to the IAS skill, and ALSO carry benefits, just like your warrior's supporting skills.

Try not to muddy the issue by tacking on unecessary irrelevancies. The simple fact of the matter is that HoF is maintainable 25% IAS with no drawbacks. Other IAS (such as Flail) come with disadvantages that require other skills to compensate for.

In my opinion, this tradeoff works very much in the Dervish's favor, especially considering that the 8% IAS difference has less effect on a faster weapon, which the Scythe now is.

Yup, I am, since a popular matching with VoS is Whirlwind Attack. A boost in adrenaline and a faster IAS (ready on hit, which is not the case with HoF) are all useful in this case.

Debatable. It's as hardly noticeable as its downside is significant.

Whatever, VoS looks too easily usable by secondaries to me, with little to nothing to loose in the process.

So what do you do when the enemy has charged past you, you need to cancel flail, and your other stance is on cooldown?

The argument here is whether 8% difference is more significant than having to cart along two extra skills to support an IAS stance, in addition to the 33% movement penalty if your cancel stance is on cooldown.

Lets not forget that Flail is in Strength, and doing a VoS build on a Warrior means your e-management will be pretty terrible, not to mention that Strength's AP doesn't apply to VoS's bonus damage. Or that one of those tertiary skills a Dervish could take is Extend Enchantments, making VoS maintainable.

To make it useful you have to spec into Earth Prayers, which for a warrior begins to spread points pretty thin between Strength, EP and Scythe. With the Derv's Mysticism line, rather than having to spec heavily into Scythe Mastery, one can instead take PBAoE skills to complement VoS due to superior energy management now. Or skills like Mirage Cloak or Mystic Regeneration which would be impossible given a Warrior's energy pool and lack of options for energy management with VoS as the Elite.

use sandshards/whirling charge, since it doesn't need any sort of brain to use.

They tend to try to maintain things and recast when they go down.

So will a Dervish, who will have to spread points between Earth Prayers, Scythe Mastery and Mysticism.

Three attributes are sustainable, and playing VoS like a longer lasting, scythe-requiring 100b works perfectly fine. If anything, it works better than 100b itself thanks to the inherent ability of the Scythe to hit multiple targets at once, and its near-mantainability with just an enchantment mod.

I never, ever said secondaries are better at VoS, like you seem to imply. I just observed that VoS is so powerful that it works wonderfully even on secondaries. Even when it comes to the Warrior, it's easily better than 100b, which is paradoxical.

I don't see how PBAoE skills complement VoS that well.

Dervish seems to be more viabile than a Warrior now in all forms from damage aspect to tanking. Dervish has now became Guild Wars Paladin class.

Not necessarily, see below.

It does seem more powerful than 100B to be sure.

I never, ever implied secondaries are better at VoS, in fact I think quite the opposite, given the Dervish's new e-management capabilities. You seem to imply that VoS is easily abuse-able, and while it may prove to be, ANet did something wise, decrease critical to stop Sin abuse, and not have to do anything with the Warrior because lack of WE will hurt the Warrior badly.

Because with Mysticism and Earth Prayers, a Dervish can swing a Scythe even at 0 SM, and do massive damage, and STILL make use of skills like Mirage Cloak, Mystic Twister, Mystic Sandstorm and various other Flash chants and teardowns that a Warrior or Sin would be unable to use due to energy concerns. Perhaps with this, R/Ds and P/D get a small buff?