Guild Wars Guru

Clumsiness nerf 06. Feb - why not damage to adjacent foes as well?

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Longasc
Longasc
Forge Runner
• #1
I misread the change to clumsiness and *thought* it would now damage adjacent foes as well.

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Clumsiness

But I totally misread that.


PvE Mesmers would have greatly benefit from clumsiness dealing small area aoe damage. A 2 seconds cast is no problem with only 7 fast casting either.

But now? Now it is really bad in PvP and PvE as well.



Sorry, was it really necessary to nerf this skill because of Sineptitude builds? Mistral Edge won the Tournament with "Sineptitude", but the SAD & BAD tradition of nerfing the build of he winner unfortunately continues...
Miska Bow
Miska Bow
Krytan Explorer
• #2
Wandering Eye: For 4 seconds, the next time target foe attacks, that attack is interrupted and all nearby foes take 10...76...92 damage.

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Game_...:February_2008
Lishy
Lishy
Forge Runner
• #3
Common Anet, why not just give mesmer the stuff they deserve?
Just make it do AoE damage instead.
While your at it, give mesmer a lot of easy to apply damage.

They are unique because they can strike through defense.However, very few skills do decent damage at all.
A
Ajank3r
Frost Gate Guardian
• #4
I personally don't see the mesmer as a damage class to start with.
I see the damage spells that ARE present in their library of skills as a bonus and a good way to coordinate in spikes etc (eg. Shatter Enchantment).

Mesmer damage spells also generally come with another effect, this helps to further the primary use of a mesmer as a shutdown for a specific class/attack style (eg. Ineptitude is blind).
Lishy
Lishy
Forge Runner
• #5
Quote: Originally Posted by Ajank3r
I personally don't see the mesmer as a damage class to start with.
I see the damage spells that ARE present in their library of skills as a bonus and a good way to coordinate in spikes etc (eg. Shatter Enchantment).

Mesmer damage spells also generally come with another effect, this helps to further the primary use of a mesmer as a shutdown for a specific class/attack style (eg. Ineptitude is blind). Yes,however, they have a very long recharge and ineptitude was nerfed a LOT(Ouch!)
Why not make the skills we normally don't use and give it better damage?

Idea for wastrels worry:
You deal 10..30 damage to your target.After 2 seconds, if target hexed foe does not use a spell, that foe and all nearby foes take 10..70 damage.
(Yes, a spell)

Think about it a bit.This could really revive mesmers and it will still feel like Wastrels worry.You say its overpowered?Eles deal about 100+ aoe damage with each hit.Surely this can be equal,though.
A
Ajank3r
Frost Gate Guardian
• #6
Would you be keeping the condition of wastrels that it would remove itself if the hexed player used a skill?
I like this specific idea alot but I don't think that the mesmer should be adapted to fit any specific want/need such as AoE damage (although it would be great ^^)

PS -- I don't think that the mesmer was ever really alive for anyone but people who loved the class devotedly =(
Miska Bow
Miska Bow
Krytan Explorer
• #7
Revive Mesmer ?

I never go anywhere whithout Gwen. Ele boss ? no prob, she"ll make it commit suicide. As for Ineptitude with the right set of wand /focus and good energy manegement doing 114/135 dmg for 12/15 points in Illusion is nasty enough for me.

I dont play mesmer but i got 2 mesmer heroes that can be really painfull to any foes in NM or HM when combine with the right team. They'll suck up their mana, constantly interupt, they'll cause dmg will doing both and will rarely run out of energy.

/sarcasm on
So how about this for a new skill:

Gaze of defeat. All foes on the map instantly die upon casting this spell. Mana cost: 5; casting time: 1/2 sec; recharge: unnecessary
/sarcasm off
Div
Div
I like yumy food!
• #8
Quote: Originally Posted by Longasc
But now? Now it is really bad in PvP and PvE as well. PvErs shouldn't comment on what it's like in PvP. Just as PvPers should not comment on PvE affairs. People still run an ineptitude mesmer in the sinsplits with clumsiness and wandering eye.

As for the thread in general, QQ less, think of alternatives more. I thought everyone's heard of the phrase "learn to adapt" at one point or another? Sounds more like a rant than actual discussion.
Dr Strangelove
Dr Strangelove
Furnace Stoker
• #9
If you ignore all the doom and gloom crap, there actually is a valid point here.

According to the skill description, it should be AoE, and should deal damage to all enemies. It doesn't. This is more of a bug than a ZOMG DEY NERFED MA MESMA!
Arkantos
Arkantos
The Greatest
• #10
Hex Spell. For 4 seconds, the next time target and any adjacent foes attack, the attack is interrupted and target foe suffers 10...76...92 damage.

I can see why you'd think all adjacent foes would take the damage, but it also states target foe suffers damage, not the adjacent foes.

Either way you look at it, the skill description should be changed so less people get confused.
LightningHell
LightningHell
(????????????)???
• #11
When you carefully read it, it means that whenever any foe attacks within range of that foe, that foe takes damage. Confusing wording.
Avarre
Avarre
Bubblegum Patrol
• #12
Quote: Originally Posted by Kain Fz
Think about it a bit.This could really revive mesmers and it will still feel like Wastrels worry.You say its overpowered?Eles deal about 100+ aoe damage with each hit.Surely this can be equal,though. Ele's are meant to be a damage dealing class.

Mesmers are meant to be an offensive support class.

They have no reason to have equal damage capability, unless you think Eles should have equal shutdown capabilities.
Longasc
Longasc
Forge Runner
• #13
I just tested it again.

The wording totally confused me, and I SWEAR it worked differently yesterday!!!
Because today it triggered not only on the target, but all foes around it as well!


It is now an AoE Hex. So you have the target and adjacent foes, and each of them gets a 4 second timer and you see the numbers popping up once they use a skill.

It is now a bit like Wandering Eye on individual basis with less aoe radius. And it works quite well this way together with the two mesmer pve skills.

Actually not bad in PvE - even very good, it is pure armor ignoring damage, after all!
Stormlord Alex
Stormlord Alex
Grotto Attendant
• #14
Quote: Originally Posted by Longasc
Actually not bad in PvE - even very good, My exact thoughts when I read the skill updates. It's a skill that, now - instead of rewarding spamming on recharge - rewards battlefield awareness and punishes mobbing and training.

Careful use and timing can stop a pair of assassins mid-spike, or simply catch a whole mob of Jotun pounding on that retard ele who thinks a Sup EStorage rune is the way to go.

The 'old' Clumsiness was bad for the game by rewarding retards who spam, the 'new' Clumsiness is better for rewarding cleverer usage.
A
Ajank3r
Frost Gate Guardian
• #15
I agree with you on that, the updated clumsiness requires some finesse to use, although, you can still just randomly throw it on a melee character still it has alot more utility than the unupdated clumsiness had.
Lishy
Lishy
Forge Runner
• #16
Quote: Originally Posted by Avarre
Ele's are meant to be a damage dealing class.

Mesmers are meant to be an offensive support class.

They have no reason to have equal damage capability, unless you think Eles should have equal shutdown capabilities. Mesmers are meant to punish for foes' actions.
It doesn't say anything about not having any offense.
Even the monk, the team's HEALER can fight when it isn't healing.
The mesmer should also have some offense, but keeping the "punishing foes for their actions" theme.

Back on topic:
I think that clumsiness should at least be an aoe hex.This would make it a lot cooler and would add some more indirect aoe damage to the mesmer while keeping the "punish foes for their action" theme.
Its not like mesmers have a decent amount of damage skills in pve(At least, in my opinion.)
Pyro maniac
Pyro maniac
Desert Nomad
• #17
oh I misread the description as well, thought it was an AoE hex that triggers individually on every foe.
Div
Div
I like yumy food!
• #18
Quote: Originally Posted by Kain Fz
Even the monk, the team's HEALER can fight when it isn't healing. I chuckled a bit. If you think the monk's damage is anywhere near good, then there's something wrong with your judgment.
D
DRGN
Krytan Explorer
• #19
Quote: Originally Posted by Kain Fz
Mesmers are meant to punish for foes' actions.
It doesn't say anything about not having any offense.
Even the monk, the team's HEALER can fight when it isn't healing.
The mesmer should also have some offense, but keeping the "punishing foes for their actions" theme.

Back on topic:
I think that clumsiness should at least be an aoe hex.This would make it a lot cooler and would add some more indirect aoe damage to the mesmer while keeping the "punish foes for their action" theme.
Its not like mesmers have a decent amount of damage skills in pve(At least, in my opinion.) I herd frenzy wanding wuz gud.

Also, I guess Clumsiness is actually kinda nice in PvE with the mobs of HURAUTOATTACK monsters, even the casters will trigger it. In PvP, eh, not enough GvG experience to really speak to it.
T
Torqual
Lion's Arch Merchant
• #20
I like the new Clumsiness. Have tested it in PvE. Great for stopping a mob of 4 assassins spiking one of your squishies. Love watching all the big yellow numbers appear instead. Absolutely right above where someone says it's about tactical awareness now, instead of spam. With fast casting, the 2 sec activation doesn't even hurt primary Mesmers either.

By the way, who says that the Mesmer isn't a damage class in PvE? Maybe your builds don't do much damage but I am doing loads of it. Hint: max the Sunpear track and buy Cry of Pain and Necrosis.