Does Anet listen to PVE or PVP players more?

Who do you feel that Anet listens to more when making descisions on game changes?

I don't think there's been a PvE related skill balance since the release of Nightfall. Almost all skill balances have had PvP origins.

Soul Reaping.

There was a PvE related skill balance.

Otoguh's Cry

PvE and its not even close. The bulk of the content in this game is PvE related. PvP gets some much needed skill balances and in about 1 million threads, this being one of them, PvEers begin to moan about how anet doesn't love them. Please, we don't need yet another one of these threads can't we just join the discussion elsewhere or merge this with something else like,

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10139655

Because PvE does not need more buff. You can bring mending and Cyclone axe and still get the same results with or without them.

PvE only needs nerfing because players always find a way to play the game easier and faster (farming builds like 55 monk).

And to say SR was a PvP origin is only half right.

It has been known for a while - since MM was introduced that it was broken - especially for PvE since you can just blow through a mission with 3-4 players instead of 8.

ANet just looked the other way because PvErs NEVER complains about imba skill. Actually, PvE LOVES broken mechanics in the game. They can exploit it for faster loot drop. They will complain about underpowered skills but never imba.

SR was only nerfed because hexes and other Necro builds finally made PvP stagnant and flawed.

It depends what you're getting at. If you're talking about skill balances, then it's PvP. Skill balances make or break PvP gameplay, while it has less of an impact in PvE, so it's natural that they need to listen to the PvP community.

Whether the devs actually listen to the players is another topic.

They listen to both. I don't think they prefer a group of players. At the moment they focus on PvP-Players, but with the Hard-mode, this focus will change.

Yes, it does matter what you are talking about, when it comes to skill adjustments its PvP and rightly so. Everything else its PvE, and in general PvE is the main focus for content.

Having been here since original release, I'd say they listen to both equally. There are times when the focus has been PvP, and then times where it's PvE. Nowadays it seems like PvE is getting the most focus; but I so remember the times where the PvE players were feeling left out in the cold, especially during the long draught leading up to and for many months after Factions was released. It comes and goes, like the seasons.

pvp obviously.

Members of top pvp guild knew that this soul reaping nerf was coming, because they were consulted about the change and/or alphatested the change.

No PvE player has that kind of input.

Anet listens to PvPers more on skill balances - otherwise, Mesmer PvE play would have been fixed in the Betas.

My question is who really pays the bills - PvP or PvE players? All anet needs to do to keep PvP alive is release a Developer Pack and allow people to make their own PvP maps and host their own servers - then the community would take care of itself (see Counter Strike).

Pve is often rated as much easier. Like was mentioned, you can complete most of the game with Mending (PRO SKILL!) on you. Some people might insult you and call you a noob, but you can do it. In PvP, you would get laughed out of whichever arena you were in.

So it's clear that, if ANet want to keep the PvPers going, they should listen to them. Afterall, most of the nerfs they make "accidentally" to popular PvE skills are "loopholed" around, or beaten, pretty fast.

A quick example is the changes to Spirit Bond, and even Shield of Absorption. Both changes made these skills hard to use, but they are still in use for farming or general healing/protection in BOTH PvP and PvE game types, although it is pretty clear both were modified for their over-poweredness in PvP (the cast time on SoA, the effectiveness on SpiritBond)

This topic could get nasty for flaming...

I personally believe they cater more toward the PvP aspect of the game. PvE is without a doubt easier than PvP because you aren't facing real people. There is less of a need for balance.

*Puts on flame shield*

NOTE: I am more of a PvE player btw

Um... no it's not.

The only nerfs that were made because of PvE since the launch of GW are:
1. Prot bond
2. Spirit bond
3. (possibly) Minion cap

It takes a lot more for a build to be labelled as "abused" in PvE because PvE inherently has a much wider acceptability bracket. The threshold for success is low - you can complete all missions + bonuses, etc with mending and riposte on your bar. (Hell, you can probably do it with no skills on your bar at all.) At the same time the threshold for abuse is high. Efficient builds are merely efficient... all they do is let you complete the mission faster than you would with a mending wammo. Abusive builds from anet's point of view are ones that let you farm absurd amounts of money with no skill or effort involved - riversite tengu farming, 55 prot bond monk, PS/SB harvest temple farming. Out of these the tengu build didn't even result in a skill nerf: anet simply fixed mobs and drops in the area to make it unattractive.

Basically, imbalance does not hurt PvE until it becomes extreme, destroys the economy, or becomes so widespread that the game turns into a joke even for the lower-end players. Imbalance hurts PvP because you get to feel the imbalance, rather than the monsters. When an unfair build is used against monsters, it's not a problem. Against players it is.

As for the minion cap, I said "possibly" because MMs were nerfed in response to their abuse in AB, not in PvE. They were retardedstupidbroken in PvE since release and weren't touched until factions, which is when AB came out. Although a case can be made for PvE here, it's not a very strong one IMO.

Wrong. There are many PvEers in alpha, probably a huge majority since anet purged most of the pvpers because of whining.

As for game balance, of course they listen to the pvp community more and specifically the high end gvg community. The pvp community cares about balance and knows what it means. Heck, the whole reason people become a part of the pvp community is by demonstrated skill (and presumably understanding) at the game.

90% of pvers don't give a damn about balance as long as they get their shiny drops. The pve community is why dev time gets allocated to worthless diversions like minipets, weekend events, and doa instead of balancing the game or adding content with any depth.

If they added jumping, elves, ultima, and epic mounts most pveers would be good for another several thousand hours of grinding. PvPers, on the other hand, won't be happy until GW reaches its potential as a balanced, skill based competitive game.

When talking about balance concerns, definitely, the focus is un PvP. As far as content development goes, though, PvE gets the vast majority of the budget.

Peace,
-CxE

Completely pointless topic. It's pointless to point fingers at who is responsible for what. Especially when the game is BOTH PVE and PVP. Anyone who bought the game knew the game was PVE and PVP. Getting ticked off at how one or the other gets affected by the other is also pointless.

Do you really think ANET could possibly have a complete bias for one side? GW is their baby. You can be damn sure they'll make all aspects of it as good as possible.

I believe that they listen to both sides equally. Regardless if skill balances throws some PvE builds out of whack or the Hall of heroes controlling PvE endgame areas. Both sides are heard.

What I find interesting about this (comment of which I've heard many times before), is that aftering playing the game for over 1 1/2 years I rarely have seen 3-4 person PUG blowing through missions because of a MM. And I mean rarely, especially since the minion cap last summer (or spring?).

I don't know, perhaps your refering to specific builds like Sorrow's Furnace 5man farming groups that require a MM. I know I only represent a very small fraction of the player base, but it's my experience that this doesn't happen much. Actually, one of the reasons I quit running MM build in favor of Blood/Curses is that when I PUG'd a mission/quest the groups would move to fast from kill to kill not allowing me enough time to raise minions and I'd constatntly be playing catch-up.

Oh yeah, and back to the topic. I do believe Anet listens to both sides, but it would seem that most of the buffs/nerfs/changes are applied as "fixes" to PvP builds that get over-used and abused moreso than PvE.

I understand that there is specific team builds for farming and such that utilize the MM and perhaps exploit things to a degree, but it's just my experience that most PvE usage of a MM doesn't just simply blow through stuff.

When it comes to the balancing of skills and attributes, pretty much PvP for the most part.

Everything else?
PvE.