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Originally Posted by Batou of Nine
For general purposes, i stick with Faithful so i can concentrate on other skill usage, battle progression, team/enemy actions
Aha. So basically you agreed with what i typed under #6.
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Being able to save 5e pre-battle is invaluable
If you're casting it pre-battle you should have no problems investing 10e instead of 5e. It is pre-battle after all is it not?
And once battle starts, Faithful is far less useful than Watchful.
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Being able to cast a prot on teammates as a Dervish is not practical. One, you have a very limited max energy. Two, as melee you should concentrating on taking down targets ASAP which also fulfills the same reason as protecting others.
Whether or not something isnt practical is a matter of personal skill here. I can very well attack someone and still observe my teammates health bars, and do 1-sec-emergency-cast on someone who is almost dead, and thus save him. Happened already in GvG.
Sure i have limited max energy. I didnt say im casting it randomly on teammates. I merely said that when there's an emergency i can do it. I have an option to do it.
Taking down targets asap? Oh yea i lose 1 second to save someone.. I agree with you that attacking also means protecting, but one should weigh cons and pros. Sometimes it's more beneficial to drop Watchful, and sometimes more beneficial to smack the guy.
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Admittedly one obvious difference is 25% trigger vs 50% trigger. One will temporarily save you from eminent death, while the other just helps you stay alive longer. Oh, wait isn't that the same thing?
No it's not. In practice, in battle, whether the skill trigger on 25% of 50% is huge. Try GvG for instance, and you'll understand what i mean. I'll clarify it a bit.
Your monks are there to heal. Your health can get to 50% quite often but they will heal you back, using their own energy. Watchful will be still active, in case your health goes to 25% which means alert mode, the possibility of you dying, or you would die, but Watchful triggers and heals you, at the right moment, not too soon.
Faithful on the other hand triggers as soon as you get a bit of dmg. Yes it heals you back, but it doesnt heal you when you really need it (aka to prevent spike/death). Once Faithful triggers in the middle of the battle, you spend the rest of the battle without it, or you have to recast it back, which is impractical because it's too long, and besides you also risk getting interrupted. I know this thread is mostly about PvE so interrupt wont really happen more likely, but it still leaves the fact that in those 2sec you couldve done almost 2 swings with a scythe, killing someone off.
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In the long run 1 sec cast vs 2 sec cast will not make any difference for a melee class in middle battle.
Maybe not for you. For me, that means around 100dmg less.
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The last sentence in YOUR point #6 contradicts EVERYTHING you previously say for this whole point
No it doesnt contradict. You just didnt read it carefully.
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Using Faithful over Watchful will NOT make a player lazy or absent minded concerning teammates, battle, or self.
Yes it will. You can bet that when Faithful Intervention player gets to RA, i'll wait 40 sec till he notices im dead and rezes me. Watchful Intervention player will rez me within 5sec.
To me, it's a huge difference.
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And, uh PvP?? Hasn't anyone told you? We are in the PvE forum section!
My comments were more or less aimed at PvP.
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You have to dedicate 2 skills to mitigate the Weakness from Wearing Strike
Yeah, except that Wearying has 4sec recharge, and Reapers 8sec recharge, which means you need more attack skills than i do. Which means that "dedicate 2 skills" is still less than what you will dedicate. Plus, i dedicate 2 elite-level skills, and you dedicate 1 elite + 1 normal. Do the math.
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Why is that a bad thing?
Because of the speed at which enemies die in PvE, and because of the 8sec recharge. I already commented on both. And because it's simply put conditional. Unconditional Wearying > conditional Reapers.
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First of all, why would i wait to use this skill? And can't utilize the +dmg? Its unconditional!
Then it's even worse.
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And you think foes constantly die in under 8 seconds in PvE eh? I am assuming you have been to Realm of Torment yes? Even if a foe went down that fast, you still got between 3 and 7 more foes to dispatch who have been taking dmg.
Im sure u'll be very busy TABing first to see which enemy is under 50% health, and then going to him n smacking him. Yeah..
Yes i've been to Realm of Torment. If i use Melandru+Wearying i bet they'll die under 8sec. Besides, Torment is like what, a small portion of PvE in Nightfall.
Now, im not saying Reapers never does nice kill with DP + dmg. Yes, often you can smak the guy below 50% health BUT how often do you smack someone below 35% health? You're forgetting that. For Reapers Sweep to be effective, you need to hit a target with rougly estimated 15-50% health. If you hit someone under 15% health, you wasted your elite, because Wounding Strike would be better. There's no need for extra dmg, target would die anyway. So, for Reapers sweep to achieve full potential, you need to hit it while at 15-50% health which does not happen often, and with 8sec recharge on your elite, how often does it happen? And how often does it not happen?
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MY point is, as Anet has designed it, there are counters and comparable skills matched to just about EVERY skill in this game
Yeah, find me comparable skill to Attacker's Insight. It's utterly useless.
Just so you know, ANet isnt doing perfect skill balancing, not nearly close. Sure, it's not really possible to make perfect balance, but many of their skills are indeed that bad.
If you dont believe me, why not ask some mods here, like Ensign?
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You cannot say "no, your build is rubbish cause i say these skills are better".
No, i said exactly what i had to say. I said there are good elites, there are fun and ok elites, and there are crappy elites. So yes, i can say there are crappy elites. Wow i just did 
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It is based on opinion, condition, situation and ability
It's based on math, more math, practice, and yes, situation. And so far Otyugh's Cry sucks in all these categories.
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lets not keep talking in absolutes and condemning everyone else for creating new and different builds...
Look, i really dont "condemn" anyone.. as far as im concerned people can even use Otyugh's Cry. I also do like seeing diversity. Hell, if only few people used Mending i would be even ok with that 
Still, this is a forum thread, one of those threads where people are more interested in effectivness of the skill, than in how cute it is. I use many many combos, and have used em before, which would be consider sub-par by a lot of people. I've used them because i had fun with it. That's pretty much it But, if i make forum thread asking for oppinion on the build, then i expect others to do some math, or tell me what worked for them from experience. I dont expect them to tell me "look, everything is good" or "just do what you find fun" | | | | | | |
