Curse

lyra_song · Dec 27, 2006, 03:21 PM // 15:21

Getting better. ^_^

Still feels kinda pasted on the background though.

The "spotlight" and the source of light from the glowing runes and lightning is giving contradictory shading to the background and character.

Look at the books for example. They retain the shadows from the spotlight but make zero recognition of the light from the runes/ligthning with secondary shadows/reflections.

greyf0x_f0x · Dec 27, 2006, 05:56 PM // 17:56

After a little more lighting work, along with some input by 84-175 himself, here's the (probably) final version:

As you rightly point out Lyra, I've got plenty to learn and practice about lighting, but one of my goals with this image, was to have a less "pasted on" feel to the image. It's not perfect certainly, but I think it's an improvement over the lighting on some of my other works. Just for comparison, take a look at the "unlit" version:

greyf0x_f0x · Dec 28, 2006, 06:22 AM // 06:22

The bird has been tamed!

Now he just needs a background

**Marty Silverblade** · Dec 28, 2006, 06:28 AM // 06:28

Wow. I wish I could draw like that... you muct be rich by now...

Just one thing though, at the bottom of the rangers foot there are lines... they look like they shouldn't be there... Oh well, I suppose I'll have to farm my fingers off to get one of these done... Hmmm...

greyf0x_f0x · Dec 28, 2006, 06:44 AM // 06:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marty Silverblade

Wow. I wish I could draw like that... you muct be rich by now...

Just one thing though, at the bottom of the rangers foot there are lines... they look like they shouldn't be there... Oh well, I suppose I'll have to farm my fingers off to get one of these done... Hmmm...

Aye, the image is far from done, there are still sketch lines all over the place

his waist is rather muddy looking too. There's lots more to be done yet, not least of which is a background.

I just wanted to show the progress on the bird, mostly ^_^

And, I wish I were rich, saddly, my storage is below 100k again, never a comfortable place to be.

Having 10 PvE characters, all wanting their armour upgraded, and craving the all new nightfall skills, is proving a costly afair >_>

Sword Liger · Dec 28, 2006, 10:48 AM // 10:48

Are the moa birds legs long enough? I could swear they are longer ingame, anways great work Fox!

ravensong · Dec 28, 2006, 10:58 AM // 10:58

yeah they are not long enough and not very natural!
I suggest studying bird anatomy at least how legs bend and stuff beore you draw one!

Hypernecrofear · Dec 28, 2006, 11:12 AM // 11:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by ravensong

yeah they are not long enough and not very natural!
I suggest studying bird anatomy at least how legs bend and stuff beore you draw one!

And i suggest you be a little nicer when you critque someone... or how about you draw a moa bird from scratch and color it. Then we will see how you do.. and what it feels like to be rudely criticized by someone.

RotteN · Dec 28, 2006, 12:42 PM // 12:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by ravensong

yeah they are not long enough and not very natural!
I suggest studying bird anatomy at least how legs bend and stuff beore you draw one!

tbh they don't look that bad, the leg pointing forward looks a bit odd at the top, but for the rest it's ok for a drawing. And yes, i have studied bird anatomy, more than i actually wanted...

Shanaeri Rynale · Dec 28, 2006, 01:00 PM // 13:00

Love the ranger picture. Awesome.

It's a made up bird(thankfully) so I don't care - lol. Should have been a Chocobo tho

BSSuperman · Dec 28, 2006, 01:40 PM // 13:40

Hi GreyFox
That elemantist is looking better with the more dramatic lighting. One thing you may take into consideration is that adding shade isn't simply a question of mixing a little black into the area in question. The black swamps the vividity of the other colours and you'll end up with a 'grey' skin. Also a colour that isnt in harmony with the initial colour tone that you have decided to use. One of the hardest colours that you have to mix is 'skin' be it black, white, yellow or green(>

). This is because it is a unique colour that appears no where else in nature. Try to visualise your shading as an absence of light rather than adding black. Use a mixture of blue and red to darken down the skin tone and harmonising it with the rest of the area that is being shaded. You may find it easier to apply the colour first, hen apply the highlights then add the shading last to make sure that the shades are harmonised together. Im expressing advice from a classical fine arts education and mixing paint and I dont have any experience in PS so I dont know how mixing colours in PS works.
Going back to the picture (obviously you have to decide to stop at one point

) The girls left arm should be underlit from the runes on the floor, this will greatly underline (no pun intended) the 3d aspect of the member and help place the arm in the field of space. Her right armpit should almost be white with that much lightening right next to it and remember that light travels in straight lines. There is no light source in front of her torse and in keeping with the general 'ambience' of the background the shading between her breasts should be almost black (mixture of colours until its the darkest it gets)Her right buttock should have an almost a hard line of white just on the edge of her clothes to emphasise the circle of runes behind her (unless of course the intensity of light is less at the back of the circle) and her feet should be similiarly 'halo'd' The picture would greatly be improved with more attention directed at the reflections and shading of her hair. Black hair reflecting the stark light of lightening would have far greater defined highlights. You've really given yourself a challenge with the legs. With that much light source around them you'll have a hard time making sure that the light sources are brought together. Do the runes on the floor direct light simply straight up as is implied with the light rays or does the light splash onto the elmentalist as well?

Of course Im saying this in the spirit of offering constructive criticism - you have good imagination and a decent grasp of drawing the human body - its one of the hardest things there is to draw - ESPECIALLY when you are not drawing from a model. Please note that where I say should, would or could its just because I cant think of another word and its just my personal opinion. Keep up the good work and keep practising. Best Regards. Paul.

greyf0x_f0x · Dec 28, 2006, 04:53 PM // 16:53

Quote:

yeah they are not long enough and not very natural!
I suggest studying bird anatomy at least how legs bend and stuff beore you draw one!

And i suggest you be a little nicer when you critque someone... or how about you draw a moa bird from scratch and color it. Then we will see how you do.. and what it feels like to be rudely criticized by someone.

First up, the legs do look a bit odd, and will likely go through a few more changes before the image is done (they've already been lengthened from the initial concept sketch). Secondly, I have been doing nothing BUT stuying bird anatomy since I started work on the Moa: ostriches, in game screens, chocobos - my temp working folder is FULL of images :P. And finally, I'm big enough and ugly enough to take criticism, but if you want to criticise my work, then do so constructively. If you want to see how this is done, simply read BSSuperman's wonderful post

Quote:

Hi GreyFox
That elemantist is looking better with the more dramatic lighting. One thing you may take into consideration is that adding shade isn't simply a question of mixing a little black into the area in question...

...Of course Im saying this in the spirit of offering constructive criticism - you have good imagination and a decent grasp of drawing the human body - its one of the hardest things there is to draw - ESPECIALLY when you are not drawing from a model. Please note that where I say should, would or could its just because I cant think of another word and its just my personal opinion. Keep up the good work and keep practising. Best Regards. Paul.

Your insight and help are much appreciated ^_^ I'll see what I can do

ravensong · Dec 28, 2006, 05:28 PM // 17:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hypernecrofear

And i suggest you be a little nicer when you critque someone... or how about you draw a moa bird from scratch and color it. Then we will see how you do.. and what it feels like to be rudely criticized by someone.

First of all i wasnt rude at all,you obviously dont know that one cannot improve himself without positive criticism.
Most of the people on this forum are not objective when judging other people works.
You should go to www.conceptart.org and see professionals work and see what criticism really is!

Gray Fox really has talent and with little practice and studies he could be really great!

(that doesnt work for me im lazy ^^,and you want my moa bird? you`ll get it)

[DE] · Dec 28, 2006, 07:41 PM // 19:41

Raven you're digging yourself a pretty deep hole here.

GL getting out of it

ShadowsRequiem · Dec 28, 2006, 09:40 PM // 21:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by ravensong

yeah they are not long enough and not very natural!
I suggest studying bird anatomy at least how legs bend and stuff beore you draw one!

please share to the class this information you are hiding!!

his comment wasnt that rude..... >_>

ravensong · Dec 28, 2006, 11:57 PM // 23:57

information? what information?... :P
and hole? is that a threat? ^^

Since my post obviously became "a big skandal" (right...) i shall now make non-rude version of it...or at least how it supposed to look like by your standards:

"Hey,nice drawing there Grey Fox,id just like to point out few details. You should pay attention to how those legs bend and the angle so they would look more like in running pose. Try to do some bird studies,if you like,to see the bone structure so you could make them more realistic. Anyways great stuff,keep up!"

I think you understand now what i meant to say...all happy?
...but if you are used to only nice words and "wow"s and get angry on a small crit you wont make it far. Sometimes in life a nice, even harsh, criticism is esential for you improvement so you can fix your flaws and eventually become better. Becouse if you are not aware of your mistakes,my friend,you wont move on!

*edit* typos

greyf0x_f0x · Dec 29, 2006, 04:14 AM // 04:14

Receiving criticism, and more importantly, listening to it, is one of the things that makes someone a good artist, of that there is no doubt; however, there is also an art to being a good critic. My Major at university was in Art Criticism, so I'm certainly aware of what absolute [insert derogatory phrase here] art critics can be when talking about other people's work. However, in my opinion, the best critics offer not only insights into the flaws of a piece, but also, offer solutions in a positive light.

Your first post was not especially rude, it probably just got a few folks miffed because of the negative tone to it (a final sentence that implies the work should not have even been started due to lack of artistic study). That may not have been your intention, but that’s how it might be read. Your second post on the other hand, whilst being slightly over-nice, was positive (implying that the work had merit and that should the artist improve upon the flaws you see within in it, it would be better). Manners cost little, yet are worth much; In my opinion, there are no excuses for being rude, even whilst wearing an art critic's hat.

Having said all that, you are completely justified in your criticisms. The bird's legs do look unnatural (though I'm still not sure they are too short myself, I'll have to see) and are in need of attention, and I’ll certainly be going back to my small library of flightless fowl for reference.

I’m still surprised nobody has complained that the ranger only has one leg >_>

Stalker Haras · Dec 29, 2006, 04:39 AM // 04:39

The ranger only has one leg!!!!!

Actually, to me it looks like the leg is simply just hidden on the other side of the Moa, so it looks good.

I'm amazed of the work in skill of these Images. I am still patiently waiting for commissions to be re-opened, for I've got a rather large project that I may ask you to do.

greyf0x_f0x · Dec 29, 2006, 07:16 AM // 07:16

I've had one more bash at the lighting on 84's ele.

I totall re-lit it this time, with two seperate light sources (spot light and electric light). The joys of photoshop, and it's layers, is that you can mess around with them after the fact. Here's a quick test sheet, along with the "final - no really... it is... probably" version:

[Edit]

oh and if you're wondering (which you probably aren't) the flashy/glowy runes all over the floor and pillars, weren't removed because I wasn't up to the excruciating thought of that many light sources. They were deemed "too matrix-y" by the commissioner >_> (WOOT!... ahem)

BSSuperman · Dec 29, 2006, 09:33 AM // 09:33

Bravo Greyfox

Now about her eyes......

Thats very good work.