Curse

Kurow · Sep 20, 2005, 04:54 PM // 16:54

Hmmm I suppose youre right.

Divinitys Creature · Sep 20, 2005, 05:37 PM // 17:37

This threads need some diagrams or pictures

SOT · Sep 20, 2005, 06:33 PM // 18:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kurow

Hmmm I suppose youre right.

LMAO. I didn't wanna win a 'right' from ya, just curious why you say some things you say. Now I know - get attention, then not respond when that attention is gained. LOL my mistake.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Divinitys Creature

This threads need some diagrams or pictures

LMAO. Agreed.

Kurow · Sep 20, 2005, 10:35 PM // 22:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by SOT

LMAO. I didn't wanna win a 'right' from ya, just curious why you say some things you say. Now I know - get attention, then not respond when that attention is gained. LOL my mistake.

Well you are right about curiosity i think. But i think that curiosity is the only realm in which you can derive actuall pleasure or feelings directly from rational thought.

Xiaxhou of Trinity · Mar 17, 2006, 05:04 AM // 05:04

When you say neither rational nor emotional thought may lead to pleasure alone or overexerted, but only a right balance, I think there is one flaw. Is pleasure not an emotion? An emotion produced from action performed through rational meditation? Pure rational thought cannot give someone pleasure, for with pure rational thought there is no such thing as pleasure in one's mind.

Depending on what you believe to be pleasurable (your logical thinking and identification of this) surely must, in some sense, contradict that a balance of logical and emotional thought brings happiness. Pure impulsive emotional thought based actions can bring "happiness" if it appeals to that person's sense of pleasure. A person may feel content from having many secual relations and affairs in their lifetime, and a person may also feel content on loving one person for all their life. A 'rational decision' must not truly exist if it depends on a person's logic, of which many have different levels of.

Ok I think I'm contradicting myself, I've lost my train of thought.
Question: What is pleasure?

I think that the theory of balanced rational and emotional thought can bring happiness, but not in all cases. What a person finds logically right or logically wrong should vary among different people; what a person finds to bring pleasure, must depends on some sort of logic, for pure emotion makes us animals, and pure logic brings us to act as a programmed robot. If we're talking religiously, ignorance truly means bliss, but knowledge and logical action we must live up to our knowledge of "faith". But if we're talking in just the idea of emotional and rational thought, yes, I guess a balance is the answer.

OMFG i went in a circle, ok basically your theory is right Kurow.

Sol_Vie · Mar 17, 2006, 05:15 AM // 05:15

It is a fact that humans, in their primal states, seek pleasure and avoid pain. (Basic psychological principle)

The purpose of moral and ethical thought is to provide a happier existence for all. (See: Health Care Ethics)

With things like these you can come to many contradictions. For example, it is irrational to be rational all the time. Humans are not solely rational animals, as is seen in things like instinct.

Coming from a Taoist perspective, it is wholly foolish to think rationally all of the time. It is foolhardy to think on things so much that you come to a depressing conclusion.

Totally lost my train of thought.

Winterclaw · Mar 17, 2006, 05:44 AM // 05:44

Without looking at the responses, sometimes rational things lead to happiness, but it is a different sort of happiness. Like when you see someone who needs help and even though you don't feel like it you go and help them anyways because you know it's the right thing to do. Afterwards you feel better about yourself. And being passionate doesn't always lead to pleasure or happiness. Someone getting into a relationship without thinking about it may encounter a lot of pain (you choose the wrong person, you have an affair that leads to an ugly divorce, you get pregnant before you are ready, etc).

Quote:

An example of rational thought not yielding satisfaction is if one of your friends asks you to go to some crazy party, even though you know you have to get a good nights sleep tomarrow for work/test/school/ninjas, what ever.

Actually a rational person would ask himself if he can go to the party and get back early, if he's got the self control not to go overboard, etc. and then make a judgement. And then you've got the other side of things that if he makes a choice not to, and wakes up the next morning happier than if he went to the party, got little sleep, and woke up with a hangover would be a lot more happier.

PieXags · Mar 17, 2006, 06:33 AM // 06:33

Let me explain why I think it's pointless to discuss something like this:

We're discussing rational thought and emotion. But by dealing only with these two pieces of our being we ignore the IMMENSE amount of other factors influencing our decisions, actions, and feelings every single day. You can't simplify life into a spectrum with only "Rational Thought" and "Emotion". What about instinct? Reaction to physical sensations? Urges we can't control? Abstract thought? There's much much more to us than rationalities and emotions, with each effecting the other in so many ways it ruins any spectrum you might have without even identifying all the other qualities of our essence!

Let me explain with a quick diagram I've drawn up. Here is what the spectrum would look like if you were to draw it up:

Life's too complicated to discuss only two portions of it with any hopes of getting anywhere, it's not only our own actions, impulses, rationalities of feelings that effect us and make us who we are, it's how each of these things interacts with the others, along with those of OTHER people and things that really form our lives.

Sol_Vie · Mar 17, 2006, 07:25 AM // 07:25

^Good call Pie

Xiaxhou of Trinity · Mar 19, 2006, 02:50 AM // 02:50

"It is foolhardy to think on things so much that you come to a depressing conclusion.

Totally lost my train of thought.

"

The first part happened to me some time back, about a year or so ago. Coming out from the effects of that depressing conclusion, I lost my train of thought and haven't picked up this sort of topic until recently.

"Life's too complicated to discuss only two portions of it with any hopes of getting anywhere, it's not only our own actions, impulses, rationalities of feelings that effect us and make us who we are, it's how each of these things interacts with the others, along with those of OTHER people and things that really form our lives."

Right. With so many variables, there truly is no white and black in life.