Curse

Mr. G · May 07, 2009, 08:45 AM // 08:45

You know the ones, ranging from images of people starving to images of people being shot, or beaten - or whatever the cause is.

While I understand the point to the adverts, does anyone else feel that there should be a line for them? I've seen plenty of adverts that have made me feel terrible inside, even from charities I give to.

Wouldnt it be nice to turn on your TV/Computer without somebody trying to guilt trip you into giving up your money?

So what you guys think? Does the cause justify what they repeatedly show us?

Cebe · May 07, 2009, 10:04 AM // 10:04

A woman on BBC News a few weeks ago was talking about the method by which charities try to get money from you by "guilt tripping", and made the point that if you train yourself to not be made to feel guilty, outright refuse to allow the adverts to work on you, you can simply go on with your life ignoring them and giving to Charities you believe in based on rational thought rather than guilt. Maybe it doesn't work for everyone.

There are plenty of aspects of Charities that you need to consider, as adverts will not paint a picture of what is actually happening. You need to consider what is being done with the money you donate. For instance, some charities set up to "help" people with lifelong diseases quite often use a lot of their funds to pay for community schemes which allows many people with the same illness to gather together once a week and play bingo, or some such thing. This is opposed to spending money on actually researching some sort of cure or treatment. Why would I want to give to a charity that spends it's money in this way? If people with a disease want to gather as a community, they will, regardless of funding from charities.

Some of the better known charities, such as the NSPCC as you depict, are quite well known and generally believed to be worthwhile. Unfortunately, I suspect the NSPCC needs a great deal of money these days because of the "Council Estate Community" we in the UK seem to be allowing, whereby a select population leech off the Government, sit in their council flat, and have children. Not my idea of a "job" and I don't much like the idea of funding this way of life. Unfortunately, this is a difficult one, because NSPCC supporters want to help the Children born into this environment, yet know that if the money were to be spent on stopping the children being conceived in the first place the problem would not be as potent.

In short you need to consider what the charity does, how it spends your donations, and whether you rationally consider it to be worthwhile. Do not rely on the "donation collector" you get harassed by in the street to be truthful, or the advert they have on TV. I generally only support those Cancer charities which I consider to be spending my money in a way which seems appropriate, and the RNLI. If anyone else approaches me I take the stance that my Charity allowance has been used up that month and I can't justify making myself more worse off for the sake of others.

It can be tough, and they can be very persuasive, but it's hard to get money for nothing, so instead, they try to sell "piece of mind", or "less guilt" for a monthly donation which is, frankly, a bit too underhanded for my liking. Likewise, the immortal line "But it's only £2 a month!"..."No...no it's not, it's £2 with frequent phone calls, emails and letters requesting more and more as a monthly donation. Did you not notice how I crossed the street to avoid you?".

pumpkin pie · May 07, 2009, 10:31 AM // 10:31

they can show you anything, you don't have to take action, i don't go on guilt trip.

but my concern is, the amount of money spend on advertising, everyone knows advertising cost a lot, and wouldn't that money be better spend on the actual charity?

zwei2stein · May 07, 2009, 10:40 AM // 10:40

Researching into ration of money received versus money actually used to help convinced me fast that donating to charity is not right way. In fact, that would make me guilty because of helping people who made business from leeching on good willed people and suffering people. If, for example, I want to help people suffering cancer, I will rather buy shares of company that does research that seems to be leading somewhere.

The only way I donate to charities is giving them worn clothes and older electronics. Awesome way to raise life standard for poor. And of course, less trash/clutter for me

Cebe · May 07, 2009, 10:42 AM // 10:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by pumpkin pie

but my concern is, the amount of money spend on advertising, everyone knows advertising cost a lot, and wouldn't that money be better spend on the actual charity?

I might not be right in saying this, but I always got the impression Charities advertised on TV channels and in magazines for hugely reduced rates, or nothing at all. I know our local radio station offers to advertise charity events for free. As good as it is for the charity wanting the advertising, it looks good on the company providing the service.

It's like any business though...you have to spend money to make money. Companies selling toasters, will advertise on TV, expecting that the added revenue will more than make up for the advertising cost, so Charities will hope donations will increase to not only cover the cost of the advertising, but to raise additional funds they wouldn't have necessarily had otherwise. So long as they continue to achieve a net gain in donations they will continue.

Quote:

Originally Posted by zwei2stein

The only way I donate to charities is giving them worn clothes and older electronics.

Not to mention that with donated items you can be more sure that it's going to go to those who need them, and not lining the pockets of a Chief Executive, or on pointless schemes.

Mr. G · May 07, 2009, 10:57 AM // 10:57

Quote:

A woman on BBC News a few weeks ago was talking about the method by which charities try to get money from you by "guilt tripping", and made the point that if you train yourself to not be made to feel guilty

I feel though that training yourself not to feel guilt can't be a good thing for the community as a whole though, if it ever reaches the point where nobody cares that would be worrying for me. Actually mabey it woudlnt, I wouldnt care.

Quote:

In short you need to consider what the charity does, how it spends your donations, and whether you rationally consider it to be worthwhile. Do not rely on the "donation collector" you get harassed by in the street to be truthful, or the advert they have on TV.

Nah I always look into the charities that I donate to, especially after all those scandles about how 90% of the money was being used to pay the people collecting it. But thats the point, If I am going to give some of my hard earned money to a charity I will look into it, I make the decision to give based on logic rather than Guilt then. Personally I'm not overly bothered by these adverts but they do annoy me, I know some people whoever (My mother for example) who get distressed by all these images of abused children, no matter how fake.

Quote:

I might not be right in saying this, but I always got the impression Charities advertised on TV channels and in magazines for hugely reduced rates, or nothing at all.

iirc from a friend who works for the NSPCC its pretty much at cost, not free but a massive discount.

Quote:

The only way I donate to charities is giving them worn clothes and older electronics.

I gotta agree here, this is why I'm generaly more trusting of local charities. Even if it just my local charity shop.

As a random point though - You give away your electronics? Nowhere local to me will take them, for obvious reason I s'pose.

a lot of the larger charities I know won;t actually accept straight up cash donations. I realise that this could lead to a bit of corruption, but It still shocks me when they refuse my money now, but insist I pay them More over a longer period.

I though I was donating to charity not getting a morgage.

Cebe · May 07, 2009, 11:10 AM // 11:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. G

I feel though that training yourself not to feel guilt can't be a good thing for the community as a whole though, if it ever reaches the point where nobody cares that would be worrying for me. Actually mabey it woudlnt, I wouldnt care.

It's not a case of the community "not caring". I know there are problems in the world, and I'm intelligent enough to know there are charities out there trying to help, but they will not all manage to prize my money off me any time they please. Not allowing yourself to be guilt-tripped is not the same as not caring, it's about allowing yourself to think things through more rationally. To distinguish between the two one requires a degree of common sense - something the community at large lacks horribly.

If animal charities asked my wife to empty her bank balance into their bag marked "Swag", she would, providing they showed her a picture of a sad dog first. The difference is, I wont. Does this mean I do not care? No. It means I do not wish to support them at this time, but I acknowledge what they're trying to do and wish them all the best in their endeavours.

Empress Amarox · May 07, 2009, 11:26 AM // 11:26

I think they're completely fine.

After all, it is for a very good cause.

Would you rather have commercials that made you feel guilty for not helping starving children in Africa or commercials that made you feel guilty for not buying some new Apple product?

I like Apple as next as the next person, but I do think the starving children are just a little more deserving, y'think?

Mr. G · May 07, 2009, 11:27 AM // 11:27

God why can't more people make sense like you Cebe :P

The power of rationality would do the world a lot of good I think. I gotta admit I do tend to get swayed by things like this though, I'm so self rightous when you poke me a [Skill]Ray of Judgment[/Skill] comes out.

It worries me that these tactics obviously work though, as they continue to do them, and I can't help but to imagine the generic pensioner giving their money away to every cause under the sun because of these bullying tactics. At that point its practically Mugging somebody with a smile.

That reminds me, when I was researching stuff about charities just now I found a great word "Chugger" (Charity + Mugger), basically those people who chase you around the streets trying to get your bank details.

Sounds good though, Chugger. Chugger, chugger, chugger. Chugger!

EDIT:

Quote:

If animal charities asked my wife to empty her bank balance into their bag marked "Swag", she would, providing they showed her a picture of a sad dog first.

Thats actually a great image hehe.

Quote:

Would you rather have commercials that made you feel guilty for not helping starving children in Africa or commercials that made you feel guilty for not buying some new Apple product?

I like Apple as next as the next person, but I do think the starving children are just a little more deserving, y'think?

AFAIK there isnt an Apple advert that tells you people are dying because you don't have their product. Perhaps thats a bit extreme, but you get the point.

Aparently foreign aid is bankrupting the NSPCC and other "home charities". It seems people are more willing to give to disasters and famines.

zwei2stein · May 07, 2009, 02:14 PM // 14:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. G

As a random point though - You give away your electronics? Nowhere local to me will take them, for obvious reason I s'pose.

In here, there is always demand for older computers. Local guy set up small "internet cofee" at church to provide free access for needy (+ education) and is fixing thrown out pcs to give to poor.

I use pretty much everything else till it breaks, so did not try to give away old tv set or cell phone or something like that.

Tullzinski · May 07, 2009, 02:41 PM // 14:41

Sam Kinison said it best:

You want to help world hunger? Stop sending them food. Don't send them another bite, send them U-Hauls. Send them a guy that says, "You know, we've been coming here giving you food for about 35 years now and we were driving through the desert, and we realized there wouldn't BE world hunger if you people would live where the FOOD IS! YOU LIVE IN A DESERT!! UNDERSTAND THAT? YOU LIVE IN A F&%$ING DESERT!! NOTHING GROWS HERE! NOTHING'S GONNA GROW HERE! Come here, you see this? This is sand. You know what it's gonna be 100 years from now? IT'S GONNA BE SAND!! YOU LIVE IN A F%@#ING DESERT! We have deserts in America, we just don't live in them, assholes!"

They guilt trip the hell outta you, those guys can talk to Sam.

Not sure if any of you have ever seen the Combined Federal Campaign (CFC) it is an annual event in the military. We get a big book of all the charities that want to ask the federal government employees for donations. It has some interesting stats in it. One of which is the amout of your donation that actually ends up going to ACTUAL cause. Many charities will take your contributions and remove administrative cost and salaries from the donations. A majority of the charities have around a 20% reduction that comes straight out of your donation. I have seen others over 50% and some as low as 1%. I always dontate to Paws with a Cause, not only was it a good charity IMO it had a very low administration cost. The majority of my donation would actually go to teaching dogs to assist blind and handicapped people. The campaign keeps us from constantly getting donations request from various charities.

Fril Estelin · May 07, 2009, 02:52 PM // 14:52

It's a tough discussion, because some charities actually do depend a lot on visibility, given that there are thousands of them out there. Some ads are strong because their message is hard to explain in simple ways. Child abuse is a trully horrific thing, an utter disgrace for the human race (I'd even venture to say that we cannot call ourselves civilised society until we've got rid of that in our countries...).

We see ads every day, for everything, it's completely part of our societies and ourselves, even if we're intelligent, conscious and cautious. But this has in turn diminished the value of an ad, which is seen as a fiction, a parody and a tale. When you try to send a message of "truth", it appaears extremely shocking. (I like the front pages of the British newspaper The Independent which also bring these kinds of truth)

Now, shall it make us give money for the charity? IMHO it's too personal a decision to be really "debatable". But it's very interesting to hear everyone's opinion. I give for some charities which I think are doing a good job at something important. Charity is an act of good, even when your money is abused by the charity (an act as horrible as the act they claim to protect against), but overall I'm quite trusting of the "big names" and distrusting of the other ones.

pumpkin pie · May 07, 2009, 02:52 PM // 14:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tullzinski

Sam Kinison said it best:

You want to help world hunger? Stop sending them food. Don't send them another bite, send them U-Hauls. Send them a guy that says, "You know, we've been coming here giving you food for about 35 years now and we were driving through the desert, and we realized there wouldn't BE world hunger if you people would live where the FOOD IS! YOU LIVE IN A DESERT!! UNDERSTAND THAT? YOU LIVE IN A F&%$ING DESERT!! NOTHING GROWS HERE! NOTHING'S GONNA GROW HERE! Come here, you see this? This is sand. You know what it's gonna be 100 years from now? IT'S GONNA BE SAND!! YOU LIVE IN A F%@#ING DESERT! We have deserts in America, we just don't live in them, assholes!"

They guilt trip the hell outta you, those guys can talk to Sam.

Not sure if any of you have ever seen the Combined Federal Campaign (CFC) it is an annual event in the military. We get a big book of all the charities that want to ask the federal government employees for donations. It has some interesting stats in it. One of which is the amout of your donation that actually ends up going to ACTUAL cause. Many charities will take your contributions and remove administrative cost and salaries from the donations. A majority of the charities have around a 20% reduction that comes straight out of your donation. I have seen others over 50% and some as low as 1%. I always dontate to Paws with a Cause, not only was it a good charity IMO it had a very low administration cost. The majority of my donation would actually go to teaching dogs to assist blind and handicapped people. The campaign keeps us from constantly getting donations request from various charities.

Sam Kinison is not funny saying that. if they can, they would all move to stay in New York

Fril Estelin · May 07, 2009, 02:58 PM // 14:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tullzinski

we've been coming here giving you food for about 35 years now and we were driving through the desert, and we realized there wouldn't BE world hunger if you people would live where the FOOD IS! YOU LIVE IN A DESERT!! UNDERSTAND THAT?

Joke aside, I've read in various places that a lot of natural "livable" environment have been destroyed by industrial activity during the 20th century.

Quote:

One of which is the amout of your donation that actually ends up going to ACTUAL cause. Many charities will take your contributions and remove administrative cost and salaries from the donations. A majority of the charities have around a 20% reduction that comes straight out of your donation. I have seen others over 50% and some as low as 1%. I always dontate to Paws with a Cause, not only was it a good charity IMO it had a very low administration cost. The majority of my donation would actually go to teaching dogs to assist blind and handicapped people. The campaign keeps us from constantly getting donations request from various charities.

I've seen volunteers working for some charities and I often wish that their work was recognised beyond their self-esteem and good feelings. I wish we'd collectively send the message that "helping" is important and shall be rewarded. Not as a salary (i.e. do that every month and you'll get money) but rather as a "trophy" (i.e. you're doing something important, something that I couldn't do, I wish to thank you for that).

I don't mind paying salaries to people, as long as their work actually does help others. See teachers in poor countries. Don't send them food, send them the knowledge to create their own food from their land.

makosi · May 07, 2009, 03:34 PM // 15:34

I don't ask anything of anybody else and I expect nobody asks anything of me. You may call me cold and heartless but I don't and won't succumb to the 'flies around the mouth' or the short film noir of a sad kid in a cot accompanied by sombre music and a dreary voiceover. The animal cruelty ads sometimes inspire a sympathetic frown from me but nothing more. The bats and cobwebs remain intact in my wallet.

Then there's the issue of the Government handing out numerous billions of pounds to bail out the banks... it makes me think that the ad campaigns are barking up the wrong tree for cash in the most heavily taxed European state. People are losing their houses and access to credit in the current climate and these companies are asking us to increase our monthly outgoings.

My last reason for not giving is that I don't feel 100% secure that the cash is going to good nitty-gritty charitable causes such as the kids and animals depicted in the ads but, instead, are helping to pay executives £100k+ salaries. And, also, how much is squandered in red tape/bureaucracy?

I always vowed that if I won the lottery I'd never write cheques on a whim but I'd actively go to the places and get a full understanding of the charity before I put pen to paper.

You have to be that thorough. There's way too much scum out there.

Inde · May 07, 2009, 03:51 PM // 15:51

The problem is, there are only so many causes you can be really passionate about. Otherwise, for those who can be "guilt tripped" into giving money you'll continually be giving money. Best advice is always to pick 2 or 3 causes you really care about and donate your time or resources to those. Or a single cause if you really want to go all in.

If you know someone affected by cancer, you'll be more likely to give to that charity and it's worth your time as you can really appreciate the cause and that experience. If you really feel that giving to your local fire department is important because you Dad was a firefighter, you're going to feel more fulfilled and know that you truly helped them because of those memories.

So pick a cause or 2, and brush the rest off. You'll know that you are helping without having to feel guilty about every other charity or worry about where your money is going because it's now personal to you.

ZenRgy · May 07, 2009, 03:56 PM // 15:56

Quote:

What do you think about charity adverts?

Hilarious. Top quality comedy.

Shursh · May 07, 2009, 04:06 PM // 16:06

i can never be sure my money is going to a worthy cause and not being used improperly.

plus it takes a REALLY horrible advertisement to get me to feel any sympathy at all, and even then it barely affects me.

when the media here shows you pictures of violence in the middle east, homes on fire, children running around with no food and all alone, etc. on an hourly basis you start to get a bit numb to the pain of others. after a while you get like me and stop caring.

don't get me wrong - if a poor starving kid asks me for some food, i'll give him what i've got. but don't expect me to trust someone i've never met to distribute my charity in an ethical way.

Tullzinski · May 07, 2009, 05:59 PM // 17:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by pumpkin pie

Sam Kinison is not funny saying that. if they can, they would all move to stay in New York

EEEKKKK

I love sam though, and if you hear that whole bit he did waayyyy back then, he talks about the huge guilt trip that is thrown at you.

Painbringer · May 07, 2009, 06:13 PM // 18:13

They work and people send money lots of money. Many people are very susceptible and have a giving heart to the horror’s out in the world. Although I do not care to watch them personally and change the channel most of the time they do help in some sort of way.