Curse

Roy_ · Jul 09, 2009, 04:17 PM // 16:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Abedeus

Uhm. No. Stop being ignorant.

The story about how God created the universe in 6 days is a metaphore. Nobody sane believes in it.

Christians, like YOU PROBABLY DON'T SEEM TO UNDERSTAND, mainly follow the teachings of Christ, not what was written in some old book thousands of years ago.

Just to show how wrong you are - John Paul II believed that the theory of Evolution is based on facts. So if the most important Catholic person in the world says it's very possible to be true (because, well, we haven't witnessed and probably won't witness the process of evolution - unless we find someone that has been alive for the last ten thousand years), then I think Christianity =/= Creationism.

<3 People with brains.

DreamRunner · Jul 09, 2009, 05:07 PM // 17:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by pumpkin pie

Everyone knows P'an Ku is underneath the world

He is a central figure in Chinese Mythology. But unless you have studied Taoism, or if you are a Taoist and, I don't think many people would understand in western society understands Taoism.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bhavv

That page on Pan Ku makes me realise why Philosophy is obsolete now.

Go go scientific method, the only real intelligent thinking.

*sigh* A lot of eastern philosophy and western philosophy is very different in actual thought process. Western society is built upon the idea of dualistic nature of things, you and me, him and her. We separate ourselves from the universe as two entities as we grow from a baby, but our western thought doesn't have a way of actually expressing oneness. Western and eastern thought, both have a different idea of what the mind actually is and while eastern philosophy has a word that resembles mind(citta). It isn't as we understand what the mind is by our way of western thinking.

But I suggest you look into Taoism and Chinese mythology before you discard it.

Scientific method is about objectivity and you're not going to go far by thinking its the superior method over subjectivity.

Ghost Omel · Jul 09, 2009, 05:18 PM // 17:18

Our world evoles with science ..not religion.. Thaty being said many invention were created by monks and other owrshipers to give the illusion that god exists etc....One temple in babylon or somewere in the middle east had statues that were bleeding from they eyes and mouth during worshiping . They were the first to use hydrolics to persform such a procedure.....

Science is the way of thinking and evolving and soon..very soon science will prove something doesnt exist..and that it was Aliencs...+, As far as my chineese friend go hes a Budhist (Hope spelled it right) that its a way of life and not neccesarli believe in higher being.. if anythign id for for that =).. Still the day when the "gods" will come down onto earth again i will stand up and laugh outloud saying to my catholic friend "HAHA i TOLD YOU they WERE little green men"

around · Jul 09, 2009, 05:24 PM // 17:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by kostolomac

This is the big difference between the theory of evolution and creationism. Evolution has real evidence to support it while creationism is just a belief since we don't have any means to find out if god created the universe or not (the only way to prove it is to find god, good luck on that).

Thomas Aquinas, 'Quinquae Viae'.

(not that I'm suggesting one moment they're right arguments, but somek ind of deity has been 'proven' to exist)

And for RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO's sake 'eastern' philosophy is not any more mystical or magical than 'western' philosophy. This is just lazy thinking and an attempt to somehow believe that we can escape all the problems associated by 'western' philosophy by escaping to another system of though.

Have fun proving a negative with inductive thinking, since it isn't actually possible

Accursed · Jul 09, 2009, 05:33 PM // 17:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ghost Omel

Our world evoles with science ..not religion.. Thaty being said many invention were created by monks and other owrshipers to give the illusion that god exists etc....One temple in babylon or somewere in the middle east had statues that were bleeding from they eyes and mouth during worshiping . They were the first to use hydrolics to persform such a procedure.....

Science is the way of thinking and evolving and soon..very soon science will prove something doesnt exist..and that it was Aliencs...+, As far as my chineese friend go hes a Budhist (Hope spelled it right) that its a way of life and not neccesarli believe in higher being.. if anythign id for for that =).. Still the day when the "gods" will come down onto earth again i will stand up and laugh outloud saying to my catholic friend "HAHA i TOLD YOU they WERE little green men"

First of all: lrn2spll

I'm an atheist. Second time I have ever told someone (first was my mom, but she got all pissy even though my family isn't religious at all). Since I'm an atheist, I do not believe in a 'god'. I believe in the process of evolution and that everybody alive on Earth was a simple 'accident'. Accidents happen, so I'm sure there are other lifeforms in this universe of ours; however, they're not aliens that come down to help humans build triangular buildings.. That would make absolutely no sense at all.

MMSDome · Jul 09, 2009, 05:38 PM // 17:38

Dumb atheists with the soul purpose in life to try and pick on Christians. Morons.

Not all creationists follow the bible word for word you ignorant retards.

For example some of us believe in Voltaire's theory where God created the Universe and let evolution progress from there.

Even science can't tell you what was before the big bang so it would be stupid to believe there isn't some higher existence such as God. Unless you can explain the big bang theory and why it happened.

O lol and @ Ghost; if you truly think our world didn't some part evolve with religion you are living in a box. At least for the time humans have been around religion has been the most influential role and the direction of society. Next time you visit your countries capital look at the buildings and see how many references to religion you can find. Look at history and when you were sitting in school in your history class how often did you hear about religion influencing the direction of humanity?

Ghost Omel · Jul 09, 2009, 05:45 PM // 17:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fallen

First of all: lrn2spll

I'm an atheist. Second time I have ever told someone (first was my mom, but she got all pissy even though my family isn't religious at all). Since I'm an atheist, I do not believe in a 'god'. I believe in the process of evolution and that everybody alive on Earth was a simple 'accident'. Accidents happen, so I'm sure there are other lifeforms in this universe of ours; however, they're not aliens that come down to help humans build triangular buildings.. That would make absolutely no sense at all.

Umm so you agree with me that god doesnt exist but you deny the fact that our world been visited by alien specis?...

Doscovery channel is fun

Look at some ancient building with MACHINED STONES that were cut by a precise tool such as a high power drills and lazers with diameters no more then a half an insh in diameter -_- explain this.. how can 5000 year old worker make that with a chissel... There are reported cave drawings of astraunats and craved statues of said beings. There are Mountain tops cut cleanly wiht no rubble for miles and miles and what seems to be as plane landing strips

There are images on the ground made thousand of ears back that can only be visible form high altitude of monkeys planes birds and human beings...-_- One of the most hard stones that can only be cut by diomoond dipped saw CUT like butter in perfect line

Denying existance of aliens on Plnater earth (terra) is foolish.

O lol and @ Ghost; if you truly think our world didn't some part evolve with religion you are living in a box. At least for the time humans have been around religion has been the most influential role and the direction of society. Next time you visit your countries capital look at the buildings and see how many references to religion you can find. Look at history and when you were sitting in school in your history class how often did you hear about religion influencing the direction of humanity?

I said that religion that god didnt help evolve human being it was SCIENCE and math

Next time look at the buildings at your countries capital and try build them without math geomtry tools and man power.... Religion inspired the building but math science geometry made it come to life.. that is what i said you misread my post aight.

Kattar · Jul 09, 2009, 05:48 PM // 17:48

Transformers built the pyramids.

MMSDome · Jul 09, 2009, 05:53 PM // 17:53

How did religion not help evolve human beings? ROFL it was probably the single largest thing that did.

For example in the dark ages, a lawless time where there was a chain of command of one person swearing an oath to another till you go to your king, who do you think healed people? When you go hurt or injured and had no place to go, what did you do? You went to a Monastery and the monks nursed you back to health.

This is just one instance of religion evolving humanity. Monks were also the teachers way back when and I do believe teaching is helping to evolve humanity.

Your atheists and your devotion to your religion of hating Christians is absurd.

Accursed · Jul 09, 2009, 05:55 PM // 17:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ghost Omel

Umm so you agree with me that god doesnt exist but you deny the fact that our world been visited by alien specis?...

Doscovery channel is fun

Look at some ancient building with MACHINED STONES that were cut by a precise tool such as a high power drills and lazers with diameters no more then a half an insh in diameter -_- explain this.. how can 5000 year old worker make that with a chissel... There are reported cave drawings of astraunats and craved statues of said beings. There are Mountain tops cut cleanly wiht no rubble for miles and miles and what seems to be as plane landing strips

There are images on the ground made thousand of ears back that can only be visible form high altitude of monkeys planes birds and human beings...-_- One of the most hard stones that can only be cut by diomoond dipped saw CUT like butter in perfect line

Denying existance of aliens on Plnater earth (terra) is foolish.

O lol and @ Ghost; if you truly think our world didn't some part evolve with religion you are living in a box. At least for the time humans have been around religion has been the most influential role and the direction of society. Next time you visit your countries capital look at the buildings and see how many references to religion you can find. Look at history and when you were sitting in school in your history class how often did you hear about religion influencing the direction of humanity?

I said that religion that god didnt help evolve human being it was SCIENCE and math

Next time look at the buildings at your countries capital and try build them without math geomtry tools and man power.... Religion inspired the building but math science geometry made it come to life.. that is what i said you misread my post aight.

How the RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO do you spell 'discovery' and 'planet' wrong? Please, go find a dictionary. Oh and capitalize 'Earth'.

Also, human beings back then were much smarter and were way, way more religious than everyone is today. They were just highly advanced civilization stuck in the old ages. Really there is nothing about 'alien influence' about this.

Ghost Omel · Jul 09, 2009, 06:05 PM // 18:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fallen

How the RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO do you spell 'discovery' and 'planet' wrong? Please, go find a dictionary. Oh and capitalize 'Earth'.

Also, human beings back then were much smarter and were way, way more religious than everyone is today. They were just highly advanced civilization stuck in the old ages. Really there is nothing about 'alien influence' about this.

Meh im an immigrant i have the right to spell stuff wrong?

Please.. tell me have we found a Diamond tipped saw?
A Lazer capable of cutting hardest stone on the planet in perfect line?

How did the entire mayan civilizations diapeared? Before Spaniards ever got to the new world?

Have you even bothered looking for things i stated? or you just simply disagree and preach humanity is smart enaugh to make lazer 5k years ago?

Ancient batteries been discovered.. i give you that... the hiregliphs in the pyramids state there WERE light bulbs.....The 3 piramids PERFECTLY aliighned with stars.. they ARE Perfect depict a compass that hasnt been invented yet .

Explain this...Humans are not as smart as you think they are.. especialy to move a 100 ton stone in a vertical position......

How did religion not help evolve human beings? ROFL it was probably the single largest thing that did.

For example in the dark ages, a lawless time where there was a chain of command of one person swearing an oath to another till you go to your king, who do you think healed people? When you go hurt or injured and had no place to go, what did you do? You went to a Monastery and the monks nursed you back to health.

This is just one instance of religion evolving humanity. Monks were also the teachers way back when and I do believe teaching is helping to evolve humanity.

Your atheists and your devotion to your religion of hating Christians is absurd

-_- I never said it didnt contribute to the evolution of how people think... I said that Techologicaly its all to science ... even the herbs they used to heal people in shurches are a scientific fact..You put this on the wound it feels better to believers it was the will of the god to a scientis it was the properties iof the leafes structure and inetranl juices... Im not dicredeting Religion in advancment of society just not when it came to Building mechanisms, canonc bateries TVs .....Got it this time?

MMSDome · Jul 09, 2009, 06:08 PM // 18:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ghost Omel

Meh im an immigrant i have the right to spell stuff wrong?

Please.. tell me have we found a Diamond tipped saw?
A Lazer capable of cutting hardest stone on the planet in perfect line?

How did the entire mayan civilizations diapeared? Before Spaniards ever got to the new world?

Have you even bothered looking for things i stated? or you just simply disagree and preach humanity is smart enaugh to make lazer 5k years ago?

Ancient batteries been discovered.. i give you that... the hiregliphs in the pyramids state there WERE light bulbs.....The 3 piramids PERFECTLY aliighned with stars.. they ARE Perfect depict a compass that hasnt been invented yet .

Explain this...Humans are not as smart as you think they are.. especialy to move a 100 ton stone in a vertical position......

What are you trying to say?

Ghost Omel · Jul 09, 2009, 06:10 PM // 18:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by MMSDome

What are you trying to say?

that is to fallen not to you .. for you is the second part the bolded one =)

MMSDome · Jul 09, 2009, 06:16 PM // 18:16

I was asking about your crazy pyramid shit you were talking about but I can respond to your edited post.

Why can't you just accept the fact that religion has played a large role in the evolution of human beings? Does it really tickle you so much that much of what we have today is helped in large part from religion in the past?

Abedeus · Jul 09, 2009, 06:20 PM // 18:20

ZOMG ALIENZ ALIENZ

You should go to the site I posted, you really seem to think alike.

Also, immigrant or not, I'm from Europe and the closest English-speaking country is about 2-3k kilometers in straight line. And I still write better than you do.

Oh, and nothing excuses you from not capitalizing the first letter in a sentence or calling the Spanish "spaniards".

Ghost Omel · Jul 09, 2009, 06:25 PM // 18:25

-_-

.... Have you not read what i said.......Technology evolves human beings.. teaches them .. Thomas Eddison once said after having 2000 times failure of making a lightbulb " Now i have found out 2000 ways of how NOT to make a ligh bulb"....Religion preaches same thing over and over.... you learn it once and then you wait for it to happen..

Middle ages Agreed religion was pretty much the rule.. Crusades and all Gladly.. If you say war is an advancement i agrre.. The way people think when contacted by religion i agree....
But

Monks did did not invent steel,iron,led,copper,
Religion did not invent fire,wheel,spears,eye glasses...

I am talking evolution of human being through SCIENCE thats how humans evolve.. Religion is what they put at the back of their had and try find explanation for thisgs that happened throuhg it...

You are not giving me any examples of how religion contributed to humanity BUT the though of self righteousness being good keep traditions being good to the family and promise of paradise.... All im asking is giving me solid example besides beer and Ale =)

Im not trash talking religion i could care less im looking at the facts at my hand

Quote:
Originally Posted by Abedeus
ZOMG ALIENZ ALIENZ

You should go to the site I posted, you really seem to think alike.

Also, immigrant or not, I'm from Europe and the closest English-speaking country is about 2-3k kilometers in straight line. And I still write better than you do.

Oh, and nothing excuses you from not capitalizing the first letter in a sentence or calling the Spanish "spaniards".
Thats why i call them because that what i heard people call them.. Spanish to me is the ones from central America... -_-... i always use that as my excuse.. im just at work and ned to type fast =)

bhavv · Jul 09, 2009, 08:12 PM // 20:12

You dont need to be able to spell to be clever, neither does spelling correctly make you more clever then someone else.

Christians who do not believe in Creationism are a minority, and of course you display the trend of 'Picking and choosing' which parts of the religion you like and which ones you dont. Being a christian that doesnt believe in some parts of the Bible, but believing in other parts just makes that person a hypocrite. Of course, *IF* the world was not created in 7 days, and *IF* the world was not created before the sun, then we have right there contradicted the Bible. With the amount of fallacy in that book, it isnt really believable to anyone with common sense that anything in that book can actually be true.

Now as a past member of a universities chaplaincy (athiest but lots of christian friends providing free lunches), I can definately assure you that even among christian students at a university, the vast majority of them believed in Creationism and did not believe that evolution was true, with the usual 'Its only a theory' argument.

Also, please dont go around throwing the word 'hate' because I do not hate christians, but anyone that believes in Creationism and says that evolution isnt real because it is just a theory is an ignorant person, and surprisingly all of these people are christians, and also the majority of christians, even educated ones believe this.
Belief in religion has definately helped civilization develop thanks to it allowing slavery. With or without religion, the murder rate would not change, but with religion came undeserved authority, power, leadership, and slavery, the foundation of civilization.

Religion and Creationism was needed in the past to try and help people understand how things exist, and allowed people to cope with their lives. But today it's practice is not needed for us to understand our surroundings anymore. No one actually needs to believe that a God created the universe when we know that this has no proof, but people choose to carry on believing. They can do if they want to, but religion and belief based on faith will not help society or civilization progress any further today, now we need science and technology, and more importantly, proof of any beliefs and theories if our knowledge and understanding is going to progress any further.

And going back to the 'hate' thing, if you read your Bible clearly and accurately, you will find that it says that a vast majority of people are going to end up burning in hell for eternity. Religion itself hates disbelievers, as do some people who follow the religion. Atheists face far more hatred and prejudice from religious people then the other way around. Simply calling out things inside the Bible and the religion itself to be stupid is nowhere near as hateful or intolerant as religious belief can be.

Painbringer · Jul 09, 2009, 08:32 PM // 20:32

Columbus must be the anti-christ for them

zwei2stein · Jul 09, 2009, 08:50 PM // 20:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by MMSDome

Even science can't tell you what was before the big bang so it would be stupid to believe there isn't some higher existence such as God. Unless you can explain the big bang theory and why it happened.

Except lack of answers does not mean you are free to make up your own. And lack of answer to problem certainly does not mean some other explanation is true.

And being unable to answer something is not a bad thing. Because that actually motivates people to investigate further. On contrary to getting myth-answer and being right about it.

This is the main issue. People make up stuff to fill void.

---

Anyhow, <3 christians.

In meanwhile, can someone explain where the hell did they gain so much confidence that they thing their theological explanation of universe, life and everything is the right one?

Why are they so arrogant that they think there was one god and not two gods like in ...

Quote:

In the beginning was only Tepeu and Gucumatz (Feathered Serpent). These two sat together and thought, and whatever they thought came into being. They thought Earth, and there it was. They thought mountains, and so there were. They thought trees, and sky, and animals etc, and each came into being. But none of these things could praise them, so they formed more advanced beings of clay. But these beings fell apart when they got wet, so they made beings out of wood, but they proved unsatisfactory and caused trouble on the earth. The gods sent a great flood to wipe out these beings, so that they could start over. With the help of Mountain Lion, Coyote, Parrot, and Crow they fashioned four new beings. These four beings performed well and are the ancestors of the Quiché In the beginning was only Tepeu and Gucumatz (Feathered Serpent).

Or maybe ...

Quote:

Hinduism presents a number of accounts pertaining to cosmology, and several explanations have been given as regards the origin of the universe. The most popular belief is that the universe emerged from Hiranyagarbha, meaning the golden womb. Hiranyagarbha floated around in water in the emptiness and the darkness of non-existence. Ultimately, this golden egg split and the cosmos was created. Swarga emerged from the golden upper part of the Hiranyagarbha, whereas Prithvi came out from the silver coloured lower half part.

Or, what do you know...

Quote:

On great god named Ometeotl watched over this darkness in complete solitude. However, one day, Ometeotl gave birth to four other gods. These gods created the world, filling it with giants.

The god named Tezcatlipoca the Jaguar made himself into the sun. He ruled the world. But then, the god Quetzalcoatl knocked Tezcatlipoca into the ocean with a club. Quetzalcoatl turned himself into the sun. He appointed himself ruler of the world and created people with which to populate the earth. Tezcatlipoca returned and knocked Quetzalcoatl out of the sky. A great wind tore across the world, destroying everything except for a few people, who were turned into monkey.

Next, the god Tlaloc became the sun. He repopulated the earth with another group of people. However, in an attempt to regain his throne, Quetzalcoatl sent a rain of fire down upon the earth, killing all of Tlaloc’s people except the few that became birds. Then, the goddess Chalchiuhtlicue became the sun. However, during this war between the gods Tezcatlipoca caused great floods to cover the earth. All of the people drowned except for those who turned into fish.

Due to Tezcatlipoca’s actions, the entire earth was covered with water, with no land in sight. Finally, Tezcatlopoca and Quetzalcoatl stopped their quarrel and lifted the waters off of the earth. Then, Quetzalcoatl went to the land of the dead where the bones of the people lay. He tricked the god of the underworld, Mictlantechutli, into letting him take back the bones of the people back into the world. Quetzalcoatl then dripped his own blood onto the bones. The bones transformed into living, breathing people, the Aztecs.

Or,

Quote:

The universe first appeared when Nammu, a presumably formless abyss, curled in upon herself, giving birth to the primary gods.

Etc ... can pretty much spend rest of the day copypasting different religious accounts of universe and earth origin.

Or basically any other freaking religion. There are so many, but only one can be right, can't it. So pretty much everything else is gonna be bullshit.

And that is the main issue with any religion. If we say something supernatural indeed exists, the only argument that someone has for his version is his own faith. And that he was very lucky to be born christian which is the one and only faith with true explanation and proper account of god.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arkantos

Is this some kind of horrible joke?

I'm honestly at a loss for words here...

Yes, it is.

And pretty much everyone in this thread just became yet another victim and /point /laugh of private part of FES forums.

Come on, they reference freaking discworld to tip people off that it is joke.

Ghost Omel · Jul 09, 2009, 09:09 PM // 21:09

.... I just had a lauhg =) and expressed my ideas oh we got so advanced relatively fast.... i Mean we did something in around 7k years that took us about 200k years just to realize we can walk on 2 feet honestly.... i say that there was an outside intervention.....We humans think that we are smartest and the most advanced beings in the UNIVERSE...this pride blinds us to the obvious facts as stated by my oponents in this thread....They dont even bother researching examples to see by themselves -_-..Arrogance will lead to our own downfall..Luckily for us we are gonna get killed by alliens before hand =)