Curse

Savio · Mar 28, 2006, 11:42 PM // 23:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by jibikao

Cleave is pretty good in PvE. Better than Eviscerate in PvE.

No, no it's not.

Mysterial · Mar 28, 2006, 11:59 PM // 23:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by snikerz

totally right about arcane langour, i tried and tried to make it work, i thought, yeah exsaution on a monk yeh thats gonna screw him hard, i even used archane echo, but any monk with a brain will wait a small period of 5 seconds out, and even if he manages to cast 1 spell and happens to be exsausted, woop de doo, i think blackout does a better job.

And it's not like that spell is better against other casters, either, since many spells for them (especially Elementalists) take so long to cast the duration will run out before you exhaust them much even if they cast right through it.

blackbane · Mar 29, 2006, 12:41 AM // 00:41

On the post about lightning surge being a waste of elite.. 16 Air magic + lightning surge + orb = dead monk

Mysterial · Mar 29, 2006, 12:58 AM // 00:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackbane

On the post about lightning surge being a waste of elite.. 16 Air magic + lightning surge + orb = dead monk

No, it's 246 damage against 60 armor, not even half the monk's health. And if the monk has played the game much, he'll know to slip in Reversal right before it lands, or remove the hex, or even just run away, since if you run and the Lightning Orb is cast immediately following Surge, it will almost always miss. Which is why the "after 3 seconds" mechanic is broken. It's crazy strong against newbies who don't know what to do about it and near useless against people who do, so it has to be costed against the unrealistic scenario of the target just sitting there waiting for the damage to hit him even though you'll rarely if ever get that in serious PvP play.

Minus Sign · Mar 29, 2006, 01:13 AM // 01:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ensign

The really terrible elites are those which are so bad that even when it has the effect you want you won't run it because it's so bad. Prominent examples are Mind Freeze and Skull Crack.

Mind Freeze+Malestorm in an ice build=6second shutdown plus damage and further spike potential to kiters. Follow that with Obsidian Flame in hydro/earth builds and somethings goanna die

It's not a great Elite skill, but it has its uses and stands out "enough" to earn an Elite slot...else it would be abused. Increased slow time would increase it's play in builds. Translation: unnerf it Anet!

Now, Mind Burn saw little play on my skillbar when I had my ele(some of that is personal prefference though). neither did Obsidian Flesh; if i'm going to be slowed with each use, I'd rather take Ward against Harm and trust to kites when I have to instead of being "stuck" by my own spell effects when armor ignoring spikes start training on me.

But like I said before: Ether Renewal...why???

Quote:

Originally Posted by jibikao
Cleave is pretty good in PvE. Better than Eviscerate in PvE.

Cleave+For Great Justice=1 skill spike for 15 seconds. Not bad, but there are better ways to do it. It earns its {E}, but only because of charge time.

Rukmedes · Mar 29, 2006, 01:20 AM // 01:20

OoB and Glimmering Mark.

I'm still upset about the OoB nerf.

thor hammerbane · Mar 29, 2006, 01:26 AM // 01:26

Keystone signet has to have it, untill factions comes out though. When it comes out...well, thats a new story

Cade · Mar 29, 2006, 01:29 AM // 01:29

Hundred blades.
Sure, its not THAT bad, but it merely does a second attack, with no damage boost, and shouldnt be elite. What i say puts it as the worst is the fact that you have to wait until the end of the game to get it, and its too sorry of an attack to have to use your only elite spot IMO

Rukmedes · Mar 29, 2006, 01:35 AM // 01:35

.....Hundred blades has a 100% damage increase, try again, and Hundred blades is a good elite. just that Charge is better.

Keystone signet is far from bad even in Prophecies, I have a few builds that can use it

sh4ft3d · Mar 29, 2006, 03:24 AM // 03:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Str0b0

Oh it has it's uses but it is not necessary nor is it the only reason that UW trap groups work. However the aggravation of getting it versus the limited utility of it make it one of the worst elites ever in my opinion.

I got it with relative ease. Get a group willing to work with you the whole time, and you'll be fine. If you don't have it already, I would be happy to help you out.

Khift · Mar 29, 2006, 03:29 AM // 03:29

Warrior: Hundred Blades

Cyclone Axe FTW. Anyone who uses this useless elite has obviously never used an axe.

Elementalist: Ward Against Harm

It's like Ward Against Melee and Ward Against Elements put together, right? No, not really. It provides a measly benefit for your elite slot... Just not worth it. Not even in an area filled with fire damage.

Monk: Unyielding Aura

Sure, it allows you to be a puppet master, but really, who uses it any longer, since it was made to exploit corpses? The only potential use before was in a PvP MM build, but now...

Mesmer: Mantra of Recovery

Keystone Signet gives it a run for it's money, but there are several good signets coming with factions and more destined to arrive with future expansion packs. However... Mantra of Recovery lets you spend tons of energy in order to spend your energy faster! Yeah! Lets do the opposite of what most elites do: energy management!

Necromancer: Grenth's Balance

Lets use my elite slot to accomplish a minor self heal and damage spell! Yeah!

Ranger: Greater Conflagration

This was actually a tough one -- none of the ranger elites are currently completely unusable. (Especially Quick Shot. If you've ever used it, you'd know that the best part about Quick Shot is it's recharge -- and so, with a zealous bow string and 13 expertise you can use Quick Shot to infinitely spam bow attacks, once per second, far faster than any stance or other skill can speed you up.) However, turning everything to fire damage just isn't something that's worth spending your elite on. It's got some uses, unlike some of the other skills on this list, but it's still pretty bad.

Factions Edition!

Warrior: Triple Chop

Although Shove gives it a run for it's money, Triple Chop is just like Hundred Blades: It's utterly useless. Cyclone Axe FTW!

Ranger: Heal As One

Yeah! Lets be bestest buddies with my pet!

Necromancer: Spoil Victor

Hmm, lets see: It has a specific and rare activation and a small effect when it activates... I think we have a winner!

Mesmer: Recurring Insanity

Well, lets see: Medium energy cost, high recharge time, a small amount of degen over a medium duration... but look! It can be kept up indefinitely!

Elementalist: Ride the Lightning

Medium energy cost, high recharge, medium damage, a very bad side effect, and oh look! Exhaustion. Beautiful.

Monk: Ray of Judgement

High energy cost, high recharge, medium AoE damage, and a very bad side effect, but look, it hoses MM's!

Assassin: Seeping Wound

Hey, I know, lets add a measly amount of degen with my elite! But, of course, this degen won't exist unless the opponent is bleeding or poison. Because it'd be broken if it weren't for that clause. Yeah.

Ritualist: Preservation

A three second casting time spirit that, four seconds after you summon it, starts healing nearby allies completely at random, just doesn't cut it. If only it could summon a healer henchie, though...

Rukmedes · Mar 29, 2006, 04:27 AM // 04:27

Sigh, learn to be a warrior outside PvE before talking. Sure Eviscerate and Charge are the best, but Triple chop and Hundred blades are far from bad.

Cyclone axe is massivly horrible in PvP, I actually laugh out loud when I see someone run it in PvP.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Khift

Elementalist: Ride the Lightning

Medium energy cost, high recharge, medium damage, a very bad side effect, and oh look! Exhaustion. Beautiful.

That one made me chuckle a little. Remember far back, probably before you knew what PvP ment, W/E were rampant. Destryoing everything. With what skill? GALE! What does Gale do? EXHAUSTION. This skill is by no means bad, I think it is you who is bad.

Nice try though.

SnipiousMax · Mar 29, 2006, 05:12 AM // 05:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thom

Practiced Stance-Stances don't stack, preperations don't stack. Oath shot is going to be more useful in all but the most silly builds. If you really want to spam choking gas, go have fun. Mimicry+Practiced stance+Incidendiary arrows=a mediocre interrupt build with a stance that needs to be up.

This one get's my vote. Most Preps (at least the useful ones) are 24 sec duration with a 12 sec recharge. So um....what does this stance do then?

Rukmedes · Mar 29, 2006, 05:19 AM // 05:19

I agree, just run Incindiary AND Choking gas. Even though both skills are not that great.

Rustjive · Mar 29, 2006, 10:10 AM // 10:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Minus Sign

Mind Freeze+Malestorm in an ice build=6second shutdown plus damage and further spike potential to kiters. Follow that with Obsidian Flame in hydro/earth builds and somethings goanna die

Cleave+For Great Justice=1 skill spike for 15 seconds. Not bad, but there are better ways to do it. It earns its {E}, but only because of charge time.

Right. It's a 10 second shutdown if you have only one monk that can't remove a hex on himself during the 4 second Maelstrom cast...and I'm sure your Hydro/Earth build is just awesome without a way to mitigate that exhaustion...

Mind Freeze is crappy because it deals crappy damage, it's a conditional snare, AND it causes exhaustion. Almost always, a skill that does too much does nothing well.

Cleave + FGJ = 1.5 strikes of adrenaline for a 4 strike skill. If anyone gets 'spiked' by this elite combo, then there's only one option - uninstall.

The 'blind' elites seem to be the worst - Glimmering Mark and Signet of Midnight. In Mark you have a skill that's has no use anywhere in the game, and in Signet of Midnight you have a skill that's been basically balanced for Competition Arenas. At least with Practiced Stance you can combine with Choking Gas for a viable AoE interrupt, but when Signet of Midnight + Plague Touch is your elite combo...

Dead Phlox · Mar 29, 2006, 11:48 AM // 11:48

Would you guys mind posting what the effect of the spells are when you post them? It just makes it so I don't have to run to guildwiki everytime a new spell is mentioned. Thanks!

Str0b0 · Mar 29, 2006, 02:51 PM // 14:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by sh4ft3d

I got it with relative ease. Get a group willing to work with you the whole time, and you'll be fine. If you don't have it already, I would be happy to help you out.

I got a long series of absolutely rancid PUGs 27 of them to be exact. Can't get past THK otherwise I'm fairly certain I could cap it with nothing but henchies. 27 THK failures is frustrating. I wish they had left the elites spread out more. I'd love the help though and appreciate the offer. I have a day off tomorrow so maybe if I can catch you around then.

Raxxman · Mar 29, 2006, 04:24 PM // 16:24

Hundred Blades strikes everything twice, thats twice as much adrenal than cyclone axe can muster if you know how to position for hundredblades.

vs 5 foes? Galrath, Final, HB, Galrath, Final combo strike you as useless?

Francis Demeules · Mar 29, 2006, 04:44 PM // 16:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rustjive

The 'blind' elites seem to be the worst - Glimmering Mark and Signet of Midnight. In Mark you have a skill that's has no use anywhere in the game, and in Signet of Midnight you have a skill that's been basically balanced for Competition Arenas. At least with Practiced Stance you can combine with Choking Gas for a viable AoE interrupt, but when Signet of Midnight + Plague Touch is your elite combo...

Signet of Midnight is a 15 seconds being blind and 15 seconds of recharge. You can use it right after it finishes. Off course Plague Touch and Epidemic with it is a great combo against warriors and assassins.

Keystone Signet is not very useful, for now, but with the new skills in Factions, this one will get, at least, a place in GW.

Incediary Arrow, already use it and love it (dont care about recharge and duration). Again, when Faction comes out, mix it with needle arrows.

My vote goes for Practiced Stance. Except PS+ Chocking Gas, I think its useless for the others.

Former Ruling · Mar 29, 2006, 05:46 PM // 17:46

Ok, If you read my post a few pages back I think it was, I'd liek to fix an error I think I made. I was reading off a list of elites on GuidWiki, and one skill at that time was I think mistakingly called an elite when it isnt one. Without the actual skills in the game at the priest to check it with you can see where the mistake came from.

Thank you.

As for Practiced Stance. There are a few more non-elite preps that would benefit from it in Factions, but all in all it would be much more effective as a non-elite so you could use it with Inced. arrows or Trappers Focus/etc.