Curse

arsie · Dec 03, 2007, 04:02 AM // 04:02

Anet 3D modellers, I know. OK, they were nicked from the abandoned Utopia project, which were made by humans.

The thing is, how long has the Asura been driven to the surface? Who build those buildings? In that quest where you look for a nice spot for a new Asura town or a picnic or something, you walk pass buildings of the same architectural style, but in ruins.

Did the Asura build all those buildings in the short months/years, since they were forced to the surface? Or did someone else build them?

Were they Mursaat buildings? Geographically, that would be quite accurate. But they looked nothing like the Mursaat architecture from Prophesies.

Operative 14 · Dec 03, 2007, 05:26 AM // 05:26

Definately agreed. I've always thought it quite odd that the Asura were able to build those buildings in such a short period of time, and that they appeared to be a bit weathered and overgrown.

Perhaps it was the descendents of the first group of humans that built the ruins on Istan. The architecture is sort of similar, and accounting for the fact that they would have been colonists seperated by thousands of miles (well, probably more like fifteen miles but that's another thread) that might explain the architectural discrepencies.

Or it might just be another lost race of Humans, we seem to get around on that world.

Mark Nevermiss · Dec 03, 2007, 06:04 AM // 06:04

Maybe those were built by the now defunct Mursaat?

mazey vorstagg · Dec 03, 2007, 06:20 AM // 06:20

It says in the Rata Sum description that those structures absorb energy from the air and convert it into magic electricity (or something like that) to keep themselves floating and to power the Asura's lives.

Here's everything
1) The mursatt lived on the tarnished coast but they build their buildings out of jade not sandstone and they're of a completely different style to Rata Sum.
2) The magic draining stone thing seems to be TOO aimed at the asura for it not to be built by them.
3) The architecture in Rata Sum is similar to that in the Central Transfer Chamber which was built by the Asura, Vekk said so.
4) There are ruins in the same style on the Tarnished Coast which the Asura seem to not know.
5) The stone looks weathered

From that I conclude that the Asura build Rata Sum and the ruins/weathered look are a discrepancy on the part of the designers.

Sheena Inverse · Dec 03, 2007, 07:22 AM // 07:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by mazey vorstagg

4) There are ruins in the same style on the Tarnished Coast which the Asura seem to not know.
5) The stone looks weathered

From that I conclude that the Asura build Rata Sum and the ruins/weathered look are a discrepancy on the part of the designers.

I would suggest rather that for the asura, who are not a young race, this would not have been thier first dealings with building surface structures. Like most races they probably started out on the surface and moved underground as thier culture developed. Thus leaving behind the old structures that strongly resemble thier newer structures in designe. The humans and others have ancient structures all over the place, so why not the asura too. Gives you a sense of more history in the game.

Onarik Amrak · Dec 03, 2007, 01:25 PM // 13:25

Well, they are in a jungle and oddly enough Rata Sum is an anagram for Mursaat which is also an anagram from Sumatra.

Maybe it all fits in somehow.

Neriandal Freit · Dec 03, 2007, 02:07 PM // 14:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Onarik Amrak

Well, they are in a jungle and oddly enough Rata Sum is an anagram for Mursaat which is also an anagram from Sumatra.

Maybe it all fits in somehow.

You know way to much about Guild Wars when...

Etta · Dec 03, 2007, 02:27 PM // 14:27

^ Not really, the anagram bit was on GW wiki as well. I remember reading somewhere that when those little guys made their way up to the surface. They found an abandon city, which they had taken over.

So consider the area and the name, the Mursaat fit the bill.

arsie · Dec 04, 2007, 05:36 AM // 05:36

Hmm. I also think they are very Mursaat in nature. With all the floaty bits. Lets assume that they are native Mursaat architecture, for a moment then.

The Asura have the technology or ability to detect magic. Which is why they built the Central Transfer Chamber near Primodus. (Correction: does it actually say anywhere that Asura built the CTC as opposed to used an existing tech?)

So Asura could also have detected the magical nature of the Mursaat architecture, which happened to be recently vacated. Of all the places in the world they choose to dwell on the surface.

The eyeball shaped structures in Oola's Lab is more likely to be native Asuran architecture.

That calls into question the relationship between Jade and Mursaat. They are not the same species, so might have an alliance or masters and slaves relationship perhaps. So all the architecture we thought was Mursaat architecture, could well be Jade architecture.

mazey vorstagg · Dec 04, 2007, 06:24 AM // 06:24

Good point Arsie, although I always thought that the Jade were bound spirits of the Chosen that had been killed by the Mursatt.

Those eyeball, ovens things appear in Boreal Station too, was that built by the Asura?

KalleDamos · Dec 08, 2007, 06:27 PM // 18:27

The ruins and the builds may have held the mursaat, but that does not mean they were not asuran made. Maybe it was the mursaat that moved into ruins from a time asura were above ground or something. Stumbled across an old golem, and based their jades on that design.

mazey vorstagg · Dec 08, 2007, 06:54 PM // 18:54

Have you seen the ruins from "O Brave new World"? they're in Arbor Bay, They look Asuran, but then. As far as we know there's nothing Asuran in game, so these must belong to the previous inhabitants of the jungle. They're in a cave, so it could be the "hidden city" near the Ullen river.

Mursatt, maybe but unlikely seeing as it's not like the jade fortresses they build.

Unless, the Jade are a separate race with their own style of building.

kRimag · Dec 08, 2007, 10:05 PM // 22:05

If the asura can build portal devices as well as all the other asura technologies who's to say that they can't just instantly build buildings by way of asura-tech?

Shadowmere · Dec 09, 2007, 12:12 AM // 00:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by kRimag

If the asura can build portal devices as well as all the other asura technologies who's to say that they can't just instantly build buildings by way of asura-tech?

while I wouldn't doubt the powers of asura prefab-construction many of the buildings seem to be aged/overgrown by the jungle.

that and I think there's a few quests the asura have you "scout" the buildings to find more suitable ones for habitation or something...all I know is I had to kill about 200 destoryers for the lil jerks to be happy with their new home.

mrmango · Dec 09, 2007, 05:48 AM // 05:48

They are most likely mursaat buildings.

arcanemacabre · Dec 09, 2007, 06:42 AM // 06:42

My guess is the Asura buildings were originally built by the Mursaat long ago. The Mursaat's new architecture could be after their discovery of the bloodstones, since it appears to use the same shiny crystal that comes off the bloodstones. The Jade Armors also appear to be the same material. It looks like maybe when they learned to mold and shape this crystal, they adopted a new way to create buildings, too.

arsie · Dec 11, 2007, 02:01 AM // 02:01

I went through "The Final Vision" in the scrying pool, and Vekk specifically said "...that's why we built the Central Transfer Chamber there..." And the Central Transfer Chamber has the same style as Rata Sum etc, and not like Oola's Lab/Boreal Station.

Lets look at a few facts:

1) Asura are subterranean. Although some of the Asura Gates lead near to the surface, suggesting surface contact.
2) Asura can detect magic. Which is why the Central Transfer Chamber was build near Primordus.
3) Asura Gate technology/magic is stable.
4) G.O.L.E.M. technology/magic is not stable yet.
5) Gadd is experimenting with the Bloodstone technology/magic.
6) The architectural style of Rata Sum, Vlox's Fall and the Central Transfer Chamber is the same.
7) It is also the same architectural style as the ruins encountered in O Brave New World quests.
8) Purple crystal style architecture attributed to the Mursaat, as seen in Bloodstone and Ring of Fire islands, also appears the Realm of Torment.

If the Asura built the Central Transfer Chamber, which has the same architectural style as Rata Sum, there are 2 possibilities.
1) Rata Sum was built by Mursaat, and the Asura copied their design, or
2) Rata Sum was built by Asura, and the Mursaat occupied it.

Another question arises when we suppose that Asura copied Mursaat architecture: Did the Asura encounter the Destroyers after they built the CTC, and was later driven to the surface?

Since many Asura Gates are near the surface, we can suppose two things.
1) Asura occassionally explored the surface, and might have encountered Rata Sum, and/or
2) Asura have always had surface colonies.

These possiblities make the origins of Rata Sum being Asuran or Mursaat both plausible.

If the Asuran did not copy the Mursaat architecture, they might have learned two other technology/magic from them. One is the Bloodstone, and the other is the G.O.L.E.M., which could be inspired by Jade Armor and Jade Bow (assuming they are automatons).

There are several clues associating the Jade Armor and Jade Bow, and the purple crystal architecture with Abaddon. This need not contradicted by the fact that Titans fought the Mursaat, as they could both be attempts by Abaddon to take over the world, and he used whichever was stronger.

The relationship between Jade and Mursaat is unknown.

mazey vorstagg · Dec 11, 2007, 07:59 AM // 07:59

Ok here's a theory.

The mursatt were once humans, that would explain the legs and nipples and humanoid form 'an all. They lived in the jungle and built Rata Sum and other towns.

For some reason they had to flee the jungle and on their travels they ascended (not in the Desert though, because otherwise Augury rock would be broken already) and through ascension they gain greater spell casting abilities. Using their new found power they eventually transform into the creatures we know today, floating using magic, skin drained of colour due to overuse of magic...

They made their home in the RoF and sent patrols back to the jungle to investigate the situation. They started to reestablish a city there (the one saul found) but it was more of an outpost, most Mursatt stayed in the RoF. In the RoF they found the jade which they used to build their fortresses and armors to help defend themselves lest another threat come, like the one in the jungle.

The rest is history

The CTC is an exception, because we know it's not Asuran architecture out there in the jungle (which it's like) yet the asura claim they built it. I'm putting my bets that it's just a big reuse of art, and technically should look different to the Mursatt Ruins.

Onarik Amrak · Dec 11, 2007, 02:38 PM // 14:38

I don't think Mursaat were humans. Humanoid perhaps, but not human.

I would also suggest they Enchanted in the Desert are old discarded Mursaat armor.

My guess is they went there and attempted Ascension but failed.

Maybe they became disillusioned or found some other great power, so they discarded their old armor and became primarily casters.

But do you think if the Mursaat built Rata Sum, if they built it before they went to the Desert or after?

mazey vorstagg · Dec 11, 2007, 05:26 PM // 17:26

Well, I don't think they can have ascended in the desert. We were the first people to have ascended in the desert (because when we ascended we broke Augury rock in two, we also reassembled the vision crystal. If these feats had been done before then we couldn't have Ascended.

But who's to say that the Mursatt didn't somewhere else, is there any lore which says you have to ascend in the Crystal Desert? if you had the knowledge and power couldn't you call the gaze of the gods upon you in another location?

And I'm suggesting that they built Rata Sum when they were still humans and before they ascended.

I'm against the idea that the Mursatt used Enchanted as their armor because I think that's just a reuse of skins and models on Anet's part, not a deliberate similarity.

However, you do have a point. They might have tried to Ascend in the Desert and failed when the Forgotten destroyed them. That could give a way for the Forgotten to have their armor, but I'm not convinced.