Curse

Ecomancer · Sep 26, 2006, 12:54 AM // 00:54

While browsing through the preorder bonus pack it struck me that the concept art for the margonite mesmer has an uncanny resemblance to the Ancient Seer we come across in Hells Precipice and Iron Mines mission.

Could it be that the margonites were the seers who wanted to ascend but could not because they were not favored by the other gods as they followed the sixth one? Could the Titans be a creation of the sixth god, whom the Mursaat were protecting Tyria from? And, was the Vizier influenced by this unknown God to unleash the Titans. If so, then the Seers helped us against the Mursaat whom, if I recall correctly, once fought the Mursaat but their race was destroyed (referance to Iron Mines mission). The Seers, having looked ath the screenshot definitely resemble the Margonite Mesmer so it could mean that the Margonites tried to unleash the Titans too.

There is a lot of backstory covered in the bonus pack which is too long to mention, but, since this is the final chapter covering gaps in the story of Prophecies and Factions, would anyone hazzard a more intelligible guess?

Discuss.

Lord Palidore · Sep 26, 2006, 01:03 AM // 01:03

I'm pretty sure it's mentioned in Guild Wars Factions lore that the Margonites are related to the Luxons, who came from Elona.

Angel Netherborn · Sep 26, 2006, 02:22 AM // 02:22

Actually, no. There was never mention of any relation between the Margonites and the Luxons. Just a potential speculative link.

Seers are Margonites? Could be. These could the good Margonites opposing their own people; or they are the remaining few manipulating the Prophecies heroes into unleashing the titans. They're actually working in concert with the Lich, until the Lich decided to backstab them and take control of the Titans himself.

Pure speculation. But I hope we don't have to fight titans again. That'd be like reusing old stuff. Besides... I still haven't finished the titan quests yet :P

gr3g · Sep 26, 2006, 02:35 AM // 02:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Angel Netherborn

I hope we don't have to fight titans again.

We may not fight Titans proper, but I have a strong hunch we'll be fighting their close cousins. Think Ridgeback/Jungle Skale level correspondence.

Reason? Guess I'm still not over the fact that the Titans came out of Abadon's Mouth.

Burn Butt · Sep 26, 2006, 03:17 AM // 03:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ecomancer

While browsing through the preorder bonus pack

I want to know how to browse the pre-order pack... All I have is audio tracks.

Angel Netherborn · Sep 26, 2006, 04:06 AM // 04:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Burn Butt

I want to know how to browse the pre-order pack... All I have is audio tracks.

Huh? Just the CD autostart run. Or you can browse over to your CD drive and run the "start" (iirc).

Vermilion Okeanos · Sep 26, 2006, 05:14 AM // 05:14

I remember reading about margonites in the crystal desert, how they were a group of water race that roamed around the ocean and came to crystal desert (when it is still under water). Those boat in crystal desert were theirs, and they were one of the foolish race who thought they were the chosen.

Ecomancer · Sep 26, 2006, 09:27 PM // 21:27

I think you mean that the Margonites were seafaring folk, not a water race. Well, I don't think I am allowed to post concept art from the bonus pack, otherwise I would have shown two comparitive images to show you guys how uncanny the resemblance really is.

Knightsaber Sith · Sep 26, 2006, 09:54 PM // 21:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ecomancer

I think you mean that the Margonites were seafaring folk, not a water race. Well, I don't think I am allowed to post concept art from the bonus pack, otherwise I would have shown two comparitive images to show you guys how uncanny the resemblance really is.

People have pretty much posted all the concept art from the bonus disc throughout various threads. No mods have said anything against it yet.

Stemnin · Sep 26, 2006, 10:05 PM // 22:05

Its not like a closed beta.. anyways, as soon as i get home im taking a second look at that pack.

Vermilion Okeanos · Sep 26, 2006, 10:16 PM // 22:16

I went to read it again, (from the ghostly hero in thirsty river).

They had a "sea-going culture", and simply floated to the only land above water in crystal desert. They made a tower and read their petition to the gods in an earthly fashion. The tower ruins remain as a symbol of magornite failure.

Urban_Nomad · Sep 26, 2006, 10:54 PM // 22:54

Am I the only one who doesn't see the resemblance? I mean, the Seer has feet, if I remember right, while the Margonites have "peglegs." Also, the seer's skin was noticably darker. The only resemblance I see is that they're both humanoid.

Ecomancer · Sep 26, 2006, 11:04 PM // 23:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urban_Nomad

Am I the only one who doesn't see the resemblance? I mean, the Seer has feet, if I remember right, while the Margonites have "peglegs." Also, the seer's skin was noticably darker. The only resemblance I see is that they're both humanoid.

What about 4 arms (the mesmer) and hands of similar features, if memory serves me right then also wing like features.

Urban_Nomad · Sep 26, 2006, 11:11 PM // 23:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ecomancer

What about 4 arms (the mesmer) and hands of similar features, if memory serves me right then its 3 fingers on both the Seer and the Margonite Mesmer. And of course, wing like features.

That seems to me like saying that dogs and cats both have four limbs, and have the same number of toes, and of course, fur. Therefore, they are the same.

I maintain that the Margonites don't have feet. It seems to me that what they DON'T have in common would be a better way to go, otherwise we'll just end up with cats and dogs. No offense, of course.

Ecomancer · Sep 26, 2006, 11:21 PM // 23:21

Seers do have feet but they do not stand on it, they float which is what the Margonites seem to be doing. And bear in mind, in game model doesn't always end up looking exactly like concept art.

Also, here is a quote from GW Wiki which supports that the Margonites could be the Seers race.

"It has recently been revealed that, roughly a thousand years ago, the Margonites worshipped an unnamed evil sixth god, who blessed them with horrific transformations that granted them awesome power, and waged war against the followers of the Five Gods of Tyria. The epic battle between the Margonites and the followers of the Five Gods devastated northern Elona, creating the Crystal Desert."

Urban_Nomad · Sep 26, 2006, 11:41 PM // 23:41

In the first in-game cinematic Anet released, we see a Margonite in-game, and it also bears the same "peglegs" that both the Margonite Mesmer and Margonite Paragon have in the concept art, looking decidely more like the Paragon. That mesmer isn't the only example of the Margonites we have, and the Seer resembles the Paragon much less than it does the Mesmer. However, I'm not sure that anyone knows for sure what the Seer's gender is, so I won't argue that point

Also, that statement from the guide is questionable, as it contradicts many of the things already stated in-game, but that's an argument for another thread.\

EDIT: Oh, and thanks for posting that picture, I was looking for it. And I can now safely say that that Mesmer has six eyes and the Seer doesn't

To edit my edit: Although, seeing as they supposedly worship Abaddon, and Abaddon has six eyes in the images we've seen, that could be a ceremonial mask to mimick that. Although it still seems more likely that they have six eyes, just from the way it looks.

sjd02 · Sep 27, 2006, 04:50 AM // 04:50

I think that this could be true. As far as the seers being margonites (most likely distant genetic cousins). The differences in appearance could have occured at the time when the margonites started worshipping this sixth god. It makes sense that not all of them jumped on the band wagon so to speak, creating the race of seers. The margonites that did start worshipping this sixth god would have been given the different appearance to set them appart from the seers by said sixth god. Even if the margonites in nightfall and the seers in prophecies are the same race and the seers do worrship the sixth god then the difference in appearance can be explained by a millennia (sp?) and an ocean of seperation. Also known as evolution. Seers might have been forced to mate with humans at times to keep from the dreaded "shallow gene pool" effect hence giving them two eyes instead of six?? .....Just some thoughts....

Steps Ascending · Sep 28, 2006, 03:22 AM // 03:22

Excuse me if i'm going completely off-topic but...

Maybe the Margonites actually are the seers.
We know some Margonites tried to ascend with the tower(those that failled), maybe some of them acheived it and joined the Old Gods, the others must have turn their backs on them and Abadon enlisted them. They then waged war against each others, at this point the Mursaats must have had an advantage with their Spectral Agony (since I think the seers discovered infusion after they were wiped out).

So Abadon reveal/summon the titans at the Ring of Fire (maybe because the bloodstone was buried at this place, or was it placed there later in history?), they then slaughtered a couple of Mursaats before being sealed by the door of Komalie(sorry if i spelled it wrong).
But wait, if i'm right the blood stone was set there by the gods and the Mursaats use them to fuel the door of Komalie, what if the stone was put there to help the Mursaats maintain the seal (since they wanted to take magic away from men, they killed 2 birds with 1 rock!).

With the titans out of the way, the mursaats counter-attacked the Margonites who must not have given too much resistance. One of the last group discovered the technique of Infusion. The Mursaats probably killed them the good old way (no Spectral Agony) untill only 1 was left (as far as we know) : the Seer.

That would mean we played the bad role in Prophecy, and also that the Seer/Glint wind up being evil... And if the Charr are worshiping the Titans, that means a) The Titans stayed in Tyria long enough to be worshiped or b)They were living in Tyria the whole time (maybe in the NorthLands) and maybe the Margonites wanted to ascend to be able to defeat them with the help of the Gods.

Of course this doesn't explain the Jade/Forgotten armor but that's because i'm too tired to think about it, right now. Also to back up my theory, remember a mission in the Ring os Fire is called Abadon's Mouth, which makes me think that he summoned them there.

Stemnin · Sep 28, 2006, 12:52 PM // 12:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ecomancer

Seers do have feet but they do not stand on it, they float which is what the Margonites seem to be doing. And bear in mind, in game model doesn't always end up looking exactly like concept art.

Also, here is a quote from GW Wiki which supports that the Margonites could be the Seers race.

"It has recently been revealed that, roughly a thousand years ago, the Margonites worshipped an unnamed evil sixth god, who blessed them with horrific transformations that granted them awesome power, and waged war against the followers of the Five Gods of Tyria. The epic battle between the Margonites and the followers of the Five Gods devastated northern Elona, creating the Crystal Desert."

The Mursaat also float.. hmm, maybe they were protecting the Titans from the Lich so they could await the return of the 6th god, Abaddon? And that Margonite mesmer has 6 eyes, like the concept of little Abaddon lol. Possible, the Margonites, Seers, and Mursaat were all from a similar race, much like our own sapien gene pool?

Nortos · Sep 28, 2006, 01:10 PM // 13:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steps Ascending

That would mean we played the bad role in Prophecy, and also that the Seer/Glint wind up being evil...

So what ur saying the glint may of have some desire of his own in this?