Curse

Shaw Shank · Sep 07, 2005, 08:59 PM // 20:59

I am a W/Mo and I cannot beat this mission. I am wondering who is best to bring along as a W/Mo. 3 Monks or 2? 3 Warriors or 2? 2 Elementalists or a Mesmer and are Necromancers good to have? I have heard Rangers are useless during this mission but they may be wrong.
And what are a few main skills each should have?

Any help would be great

Tropan · Sep 07, 2005, 10:49 PM // 22:49

Trying to form 'specific' groups is pointless, every single random team has the possibility to complete whatever they need to. You just need to have them listen, and play smart. Use the catapults, 1 person. 1 person man the 4 catapults (though only 2 actually really help) it's that simple. I did it with a full henchie team on my ranger, due to the fact that no one wanted a ranger on thier team. Pfft, I got it finished before they did, I guarantee that.

As for skills, doesn't really matter for you, maybe a disrupting hit if you can't deal enough damage to the healer mursaat boss....other then that, dunno why the mission seems to bother so many people. Just forming specific teams, on the spot..without coordinating skills is pointless. If you get a random team, just make sure they all understand how to -talk- and -listen- and...know about the dwarf king's deathwish...

The Amazing Krandor · Sep 08, 2005, 02:08 AM // 02:08

Having the means to protect the King is almost a requirement. If you can keep the king alive, keeping the party alive is usually cake, even if they're just henchpeoples. If you can get a monk which will actually protect the King (which henchmonks seem loathe to do) during his suicide runs, as well as when the bad guys come a-callin' after the fort is cleared, this mission should be fairly easy. No different from any other mission, really, once Jalis's seeming-deathwish is taken into account.

Shaw Shank · Sep 08, 2005, 02:31 AM // 02:31

thanks for that.

Jhyphi · Sep 08, 2005, 02:47 AM // 02:47

Shaw Shank - I see what your problem is. It is what is known as short-sighted, tunnel vision. You seem to be focused on how many warriors/monks/eles with brute force and obvious effect methods. For some help, I recommend you take at least 1 shutdown/interrupt mesmer or ranger and 1 necro of any sort be it wells, conditions, etc.

Actually, take 1 of each, 1 ranger, 1 mesmer, 1 necro. The farther you get in the game, the better these 3 classes become as brute force doesn't cut it as much.

Also, due to people with your mindset not willing to party with these 3 classes, the further into the game you are, the more the players playing these 3 classes are likely to be very skilled b/c they are used to beating missions/bonuses with the low level, weak skills henchies. You can find lots of warriors at Thunderhead still being leeroy and eles still trying to tank but very few unskilled R/Me/N at higher levels. The simple-minded players would get bored and go back to being a warrior and ele. "OMG, loK AT the damge, I R0XXX0RRR!!!!!!!"

Not that ALL warriors and eles are bad players but every class has a role and a good balance is necessary.

BBoy_Manchild · Sep 08, 2005, 02:51 AM // 02:51

heh yeah, a interupt ranger and even a good trapper is good to use in this mission.

kvndoom · Sep 08, 2005, 03:28 AM // 03:28

Indeed, as I've posted elsewhere, my second completion of the Keep involved a Mesmer from ym Guild who slapped the Monk boss silly with Backfire. If you're going to have W/Mo's, at the very least make sure 2 of them (1 at each gate) has a hammer and interrupt skills, and Shield of Judgement would work wonders too.

Finding a PUG at Thunderhead won't be hard to do this weekend, with people wanting to finish the game to get to Sorrow's. But you gotta be more flexible than the "LFG 4 tanks 2 nukers 2 monks" people who (for obvious reasons) think the mission is totally impossible.

Orvix Thang · Sep 17, 2005, 11:13 PM // 23:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Amazing Krandor

Having the means to protect the King is almost a requirement. If you can keep the king alive, keeping the party alive is usually cake, even if they're just henchpeoples.

The problem is not the people or the henchies. If you have a half decent group or henchies you can easily kill everything this mission throws at you.

The problem is the "bugs" if that's what they are.

The King is unpredictable, one time he'll be as meek as a lamb and other times he'll make like a Super Leeroy and run halfway across the map aggroing everything while you're standing there counting your blessings.

If you do make it to the fort your henchies will manage to get hung up behind the ballistas, then the King will run off. LOL I even got stuck there myself and had to abandon the mission because I couldn't get out. Of course the King just stood there looking dumb.

If you manage to clear the city and fort and get to the next step, well guess what, that doesn't always work. I waited 20 minutes after the King was on his perch for the Mantle and Murrsat and they never showed up. I went looking outside and something triggered and before you know it I had at least a dozen Murrsat and 2 Perfected Armors and a blue boss of unknown origin bearing down on the King, needless to say that was ugly and the end.

Last but not least if you hang on to almost the end you get some casters BEHIND the fort on the outside cheap shotting the King over the wall while you are tied up in front.

I cleared every mission and bonus with henchies up to this point and even though some were hard and took several tries they were fair and doable once you learned what you needed to do but this has so many unpredictable elements and cheap "exploits" by the AI that all fairness gets thrown out the window. It's not I failed because I did this or that wrong, it's what random "bug" will show up to screw me this time and that's annoying.

I can understand Anet not wanting just anybody to get to RoF, sure make the missions hard but not rely on random events to screw it up.

I know people will say the world isn't fair, yes it isn't fair, I can deal with that but in games I expect fair because that's where I come to get away from the world.

ADDED: Since I'm in the keep now and just fell under the bridge near the Ballista's I'll add that and don't forget the red mob dots hopping around and mobs being somewhere else other than where you see them.

Oh yeah almost forgot the one where the pathing mobs in the city get stuck in the upper left corner near the static spawn, at least I managed to pull that mess apart but that is not intended to happen.

Old Leeroy Jalis did it again we killed Dagnar and stood back against the wall. There was the 2 groups of Heretics in the center. I approached the one group from the side. As my aggro circle was about 1/8" from the closest group old Leeroy runs right into the middle of both groups and was pinked to death. We did not have aggro because the henchies did not respond, I just watched and laughed.

I guess I'll go farm Grenths and Sorrows since I can't play this game as intended.

Alvante · Sep 17, 2005, 11:34 PM // 23:34

Well i find it a LOT easier when the group just stays at the king and 2 people go to the ballistas. Trappers can set traps on the stairs and you don't need to split up at the gates.

Orvix Thang · Sep 17, 2005, 11:42 PM // 23:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alvante

Well i find it a LOT easier when the group just stays at the king and 2 people go to the ballistas. Trappers can set traps on the stairs and you don't need to split up at the gates.

You can't do that with henchies. I don't use the ballistas except to kill that one set to the West that's there at the beginning. They hang up at the ballistas when you are on the ramparts killing the mobs there, that can't be avoided.

I always camp the king when I get him there but without fail something goofy always happens. Either I have the world's worst luck, I suck or this mission is bugged to hell. Maybe I suck but at least the drops are good and I'm making a fortune.

Alone) · Sep 18, 2005, 04:59 PM // 16:59

Why use henchies?

Anyways. To keep it simple, you need people who are smart. At the beginning, luring is always a good idea. You can either use a ranger to lure, or run and pull. When you get near the walls, use nukers to kill them from down there. When you get to the fort, you really should switch sides. It's not like they ALWAYS come on both sides at the same time, until later. Or, you just camp the king the whole time, and have people go to the cats every now and then.

NeXuS8 · Sep 18, 2005, 05:23 PM // 17:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alone)

Why use henchies?

Anyways. To keep it simple, you need people who are smart. At the beginning, luring is always a good idea. You can either use a ranger to lure, or run and pull. When you get near the walls, use nukers to kill them from down there. When you get to the fort, you really should switch sides. It's not like they ALWAYS come on both sides at the same time, until later. Or, you just camp the king the whole time, and have people go to the cats every now and then.

Cause ppl are sometimes really stupid and dont lisent to you and go there way (Warriors which give a bad image(I hate that) that they could tank as long as they have a monk on there team) heanchies are more obedient at final part just camp with king ppl do it this way

Bit Player · Sep 20, 2005, 03:52 PM // 15:52

Some good suggestions here.

I'll try to add a few that I didn't see. I've noted that the King will follow the person who talks to him first (up until that person dies, then he switches to closest) - so have a caster or ranger start the mission. This way the King will stay in the back, avoid damage, and limit aggroing.

I've also noted that the "final rush" in the Keep area begins when you kill the boss in the center of the fort. I try and clear the fort (without killing the boss) by pulling small groups, use a few ballistas to kill the outside mobs, then kill the fort boss & start the last portion.

I've done this several times, with henchies & with PUGs - henchies are pretty doable, as they usually focus fire & follow you - PUGs success depends largely on cooperation and communication.

delfin42 · Sep 20, 2005, 05:03 PM // 17:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Orvix Thang

The King is unpredictable, one time he'll be as meek as a lamb and other times he'll make like a Super Leeroy and run halfway across the map aggroing everything while you're standing there counting your blessings.

The King is _very_ predictable. If he takes damage _at all_ or is otherwise the target of an enemy spell, his little brain screams "UNDER ATTACK" and he runs after those responsible. This includes Chain Lightning forks, general area damage like Giant Stomps, and anything else you can think of.

Quote:

Old Leeroy Jalis did it again we killed Dagnar and stood back against the wall. There was the 2 groups of Heretics in the center. I approached the one group from the side. As my aggro circle was about 1/8" from the closest group old Leeroy runs right into the middle of both groups and was pinked to death. We did not have aggro because the henchies did not respond, I just watched and laughed.

A Heretic targetted Jalis, and he responded. Since you didn't attack, and the rest of the henches draw their cues from (a) you or (b) them taking damage themselves, they didn't flinch.

dargon · Sep 20, 2005, 05:37 PM // 17:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bit Player

I've also noted that the "final rush" in the Keep area begins when you kill the boss in the center of the fort.

This is incorrect. Killing him doesn't begin the Mantle/Mursaat assault, killing the last mob in the fort does.