Curse

octaviancmb · Sep 14, 2005, 05:29 PM // 17:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sigil

I'd guess he means 126 * 2 (shatter at 16 dom and echo or arcane echo), but correct me if I'm wrong cmb.

Yeah, in case the context was lost, Echo + Shatter hex = 250+ damage. Echo tends to be my elite of choice since it lets me run both caster and attacker hate well without dipping into Illusion. (I should get around to posting the "Echo What You Need" build someday...but who really needs PvE builds?) I only run Arcane Echo when I have more energy mitigation than I tend to enjoy playing in PvE.

Most "echo nukers" would do better to not bring fire-based AoEs and instead spec into Domination for the Shatter Hex. Even at around 9-10 Dominate, they'll tend to perform better than echoing one of their armor-affected fire spells.

...but don't tell them I said that, or I'll be out of a job. Oh, wait, groups don't invite Mesmers anyway. Silly me.

Back to prepping for my next class,
cmb

yendornotact · Sep 14, 2005, 05:41 PM // 17:41

I was in UW last night just coming there because someone wanted to buy an item I had and they were in between UW runs. I kept getting random invite after random invite for my mesmer.

Enigmatics · Sep 14, 2005, 10:25 PM // 22:25

Really, I know that all theory, paperbound and otherwise, points out that Mesmers should be able to hold their own in pve groups. Whether because their contributions are so indirect that other party members don't notice or don't care, or because they simply can't do easy, gaugable damage, the general conception is that Mesmers' spots would be more valuable being filled by another bread-and-butter sort of character. It's very hard to change stereotypes, and most people prefer cookie-cutter teams.

Glasswalker · Sep 14, 2005, 11:36 PM // 23:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by KaPe

Please, people, stop repeating yourself and continually saying that Mesmer is *the* class, expect we are too "noob" to see that. Mesmer is not well suited for PvE. He has too many skills focusing on single targets, which is helpful against bosses, but don't work very well against group of 4+ enemies. Trying to make you a damage dealer is difficult and you'll never match true damage dealers anyway. For interrupts - well, plenty of interrupts in other classes, including fire elementalists. Energy denial - this isn't PvP, denying single caster energy won't change much.

I am really surprised at you KaPe. This post does sound incredibly noob. Skills focused on single targets? Okay, that means he needs to switch targets to completely disable several of them. Ever noticed that sometimes you can plow through Summit Carvers, and sometimes you need to devote some attention to them? Thank your local Mesmer for keeping their Monks busy.

Yeah, the damage is often indirect, but sometimes you will see that enemies are doing no damage to you when they swing, and some significant health is missing from them? Thank your friendly neighborhood mesmer for a dandy little skill called Clumsiness. It isn't all interrupts and energy denial. Check out what the enemy mesmers do to you. Keep swinging/casting no matter what they cast on you. That's what it's like to be a mob faced with a mesmer.

Yup, there are good mesmers and bad mesmers. Yup, it takes a different skill set to play one well. I don't see how this is different from say, a Monk or a Warrior.

Note: I have never played as a Mesmer (the only class I haven't played yet) and I'm not putting down any other class by promoting a Mesmer.
-------------------------------
To All: If you ever see 'Conan Mage Killer' in the War Camp, PM me. I love the Mesmer, and would enter Sorrow's Furnace with a 7 Mesmer team.

Warning: I tend to be a know-it-all, and after we play, I may offer some critique that will more endear you to the general PUG. That is -- assuming I can find fault with your play style or skill choice.

lord_shar · Sep 15, 2005, 12:50 AM // 00:50

My mesmer gets into SF groups by wearing a blood necro costume

Seriously though, I agree with many of the posts above -- the mesmer's talents aren't recognized until your group face a large pack of chain healing and ressing mobs, when shut-down abilities make or break your mission/farm run.

Ooma · Sep 15, 2005, 04:35 AM // 04:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pelias

Uhm, one get aggro, second one hoard enemies off from soft targets?

Haha...you're kidding right? How often does that happen?

One huffy warrior is enough for any group. Who's the first to leave in any group that doesn't complete the mission first time?

The real reason to have Mesmers and Rangers in your group is they are generally the most stable (mentally), don't continually squeal "noooobs!" at everyone while attacking e.g. the Ettin being continually healed by Priest of Sorrows (why everyone thinks warriors should call the targets is beyond me), are not quitters (probably due to the time spent trying to get into a group in the first place) etc. etc.

Too tired to write more it's 6.30 a.m. I should go to bed

Seriously though, with VERY few exceptions, the most fun and least abusive games I've had have been with the 'unwanted' classes. I'd rather go with 2 rangers and 2 mesmers and fill out with henchies and have fun and a few laughs trying a mission/quest than complete it with a lot of uber!/pown!/suxor!(or whatever the terms are (and mean :P)) kiddie nonsense.

Now where did I leave that Grecian2000...?

*Shuffles off in his slippers*

QuixotesGhost · Sep 15, 2005, 04:57 AM // 04:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pelias

Uhm, one get aggro, second one hoard enemies off from soft targets?

Hexs and conditions are a far better way to deal with enemies that make it past the front line, then having a warrior innefectually hitting on its back trying to get its attention.

KaPe · Sep 15, 2005, 06:09 AM // 06:09

" am really surprised at you KaPe. This post does sound incredibly noob. Skills focused on single targets? Okay, that means he needs to switch targets to completely disable several of them. Ever noticed that sometimes you can plow through Summit Carvers, and sometimes you need to devote some attention to them? Thank your local Mesmer for keeping their Monks busy.
"

Ever noticed that half-decent group would call on Monks first anyway? Sure, if we're talking about group that c - space, everything they see, than Mesmer will be invaluable. And yes, I still believe that Mesmer are more focused on single target. Keeping two enemies down is possible, but it's not "completely disabling" them, unless you AE your disabling spells. Which is somewhat expensive energy-wise.
'Sides, I'm simply annoyed at people here calling all non-memser "noobs" because they don't take one with them. That, and killing target is "completely disabling" it too - and "nukers" do good job with that.

"Seriously though, I agree with many of the posts above -- the mesmer's talents aren't recognized until your group face a large pack of chain healing and ressing mobs, when shut-down abilities make or break your mission/farm run.
"

Interesting - so first people blame typical W/Mo for agroing everything in sight, and yet fighting 2+ groups at once is where Memser really shines. So, which one is it? Plus there aren't really many mobs with more than 1 healer.

bele · Sep 15, 2005, 02:16 PM // 14:16

Just my 2 cents of experience (800k as Monk- 750K as Mesmer)

With my Mesmer

I get almost everyday to ToA and it's a nightmare to get into a PUG , and almost imposible into a decent one. I'm of course the first being kicked if suddenly there are no Monks in the group ( oh well he accepted the invitations too fast ) :\ .Or get kicked if the mission fails (they better get another Nuker than that crappy Mesmer).

Although not my favorite i bring "Cry of Frustration", just to say , "hey, i'm doing sth".

As support classes is our fate, and it's not going to change as long as the "holy trinity" doesn't find a mission really difficult to do (a high level Thunderhead?. damm was eeeasy for my Mesmer

).

My Monk, well... gets tons of invitations. I Can be picky

.

PS: I agree totally with Ooma. IMHO Mesmer and Rangers are probably more mature than the average, just because you need loads of patience. I can't see a 15 years old boy waiting in ToA to get into a group, or being kicked from another one

.

KaPe · Sep 15, 2005, 03:54 PM // 15:54

"IMHO Mesmer and Rangers are probably more mature than the average, just because you need loads of patience"

On the other, playing monk, you don't have to be patient while waiting for group, but patient while dealing with one. So it evens out

If something goes wrong - who're gonna blame? Monk, of course. At least when Mesmer screws up - no one notices, because they have no idea what they do anyway

kawaii_bat · Sep 15, 2005, 04:35 PM // 16:35

I find that Necromancers and Mesmers have a harder time getting into parties than Warriors, Monks and Elementalists. Because those three are the stereotyped: Tank, Healer and Nuker. (Ranger is in between)

However:
Necromancers are actually very good Healer and party support, with blood ritual, well of blood, power, profane etc.. and minions can really help the rest of the group out while their blood spells can keep them alive and the healer can focus elsewhere for a change.

Mesmer is a VERY good disruptive class, their spells are *made* to cause havoc, *not* to do extream damage. That's why they have fast casting in the first place! They are however the class that get's the least notice.

Who's gonna notice that an enemy was disrupted casting meteor by the mesmer while everyone is wacking everything in the frey?

Unless you can actually see the spell going off in flames and spakles, no one can really tell if the enemy monk was disrupted using heal party or heal other. But these things make a WHOLE lot'a difference in missions. Havign a mesmer around during any mission, quest or PvP or PvE really helps. If that Mesmer is a Monk, even better! Fast casting Resurection BABY!

thisissayantan · Sep 15, 2005, 04:37 PM // 16:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by KaPe

"IMHO Mesmer and Rangers are probably more mature than the average, just because you need loads of patience"

On the other, playing monk, you don't have to be patient while waiting for group, but patient while dealing with one. So it evens out

If something goes wrong - who're gonna blame? Monk, of course. At least when Mesmer screws up - no one notices, because they have no idea what they do anyway

LOL. What a noob. I guess the only things u have played are tanks, monks and nukers.

Mesmers are interesting characters to play with. Probably the toughest. Unlike in a tank or a nuke where u can specialize in a particular attribute and put all points in it, if u play memser, u have to specialize in all attributes, and keep changing depending on mission/ quest. That means knowing a lot more about ur own skills and ur grp members skills. Also, lot of Mesmer skills work in combos.

When I ascended with my Mesmer, it took fewer attempts to defeat the Doppleganger, than when I did it with my tank or nuke.

I think by far the most powerful profession is the monk. A good monk refuses to die -- and they are the only class who can solo UW.

funbun · Sep 15, 2005, 04:49 PM // 16:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by kawaii_bat

I find that Necromancers and Mesmers have a harder time getting into parties than Warriors, Monks and Elementalists. Because those three are the stereotyped: Tank, Healer and Nuker. (Ranger is in between)

However:
Necromancers are actually very good Healer and party support, with blood ritual, well of blood, power, profane etc.. and minions can really help the rest of the group out while their blood spells can keep them alive and the healer can focus elsewhere for a change.

Mesmer is a VERY good disruptive class, their spells are *made* to cause havoc, *not* to do extream damage. That's why they have fast casting in the first place! They are however the class that get's the least notice.

Who's gonna notice that an enemy was disrupted casting meteor by the mesmer while everyone is wacking everything in the frey?

Unless you can actually see the spell going off in flames and spakles, no one can really tell if the enemy monk was disrupted using heal party or heal other. But these things make a WHOLE lot'a difference in missions. Havign a mesmer around during any mission, quest or PvP or PvE really helps. If that Mesmer is a Monk, even better! Fast casting Resurection BABY!

Here is a solution: Anet should redo all the Mesmer spells so that you have a big laser light show when ever they cast. People will see the lights and ask,

"Whoa, whatspell was that?"

You say, "Oh, Diversion. The enemy ca't use his Elite spell for at least another minute."

"Wow, that's cool! What other spells you got?"

I remember one of the Ascension missions where you gave to kill 5 bosses. I spammed Diversion on the last boss so that al his spells took forever to recharge. That mission is so easy with a Mesmer, but most people rather pack more firepower and die 12 times reather than pack a good mesmer and own the mission the first time through.

Numa Pompilius · Sep 15, 2005, 06:22 PM // 18:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by kawaii_bat

Fast casting Resurection BABY!

Hehe... good luck selling that in random arena. I tried, as my fast cast means I can resurrect in 4 seconds, and believe you me it wasn't appreciated. Plus as a mesmer you're usually first to die, and hardly anyone will bother ressing you.

Quote:

I think by far the most powerful profession is the monk.

In PvE monks are gods. They tank better than warriors, nuke almost as well as elems, and have free rez and the best healing and protection spells in the game.
In PvE there's monks, and then there's all the other classes.

mm00re · Sep 15, 2005, 08:12 PM // 20:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sagius Truthbarron

Mesmers don't nuke! They don't heal! They don't tank! They don't cut cookies, slice pizza or dice carrots! What do they do?!

HAHAHA dude a mesmer would sit there and have you shut down, have your spells interrupted, sucking the life out of you every second and as i watched your life bar get to nothing i would then type "buh bye!" and wave as your lifeless body fell to the ground.

KaPe · Sep 15, 2005, 08:25 PM // 20:25

"
LOL. What a noob. I guess the only things u have played are tanks, monks and nukers"

Typical idiotic response of someone who is full of himself. Re-read my previous post. If you think you're "pro" because you play Mesmer, think again. There idiots amongst any classes - and your reaction only proves that. Next time, try to notice those little thingys called "smilies". Thank you for proving that I was correct posting in this thread, because some people just believe themselves above any monk/warrior/ele, no matter what.

mm00re · Sep 15, 2005, 08:31 PM // 20:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by KaPe

"
LOL. What a noob. I guess the only things u have played are tanks, monks and nukers"

Typical idiotic response of someone who is full of himself. Re-read my previous post. If you think you're "pro" because you play Mesmer, think again. There idiots amongst any classes - and your reaction only proves that. Next time, try to notice those little thingys called "smilies". Thank you for proving that I was correct posting in this thread, because some people just believe themselves above any monk/warrior/ele, no matter what.

nah I never believe myself above anyone else, hence i never feel a need to use the word n00b, but I will give you a free smile

KaPe · Sep 15, 2005, 08:42 PM // 20:42

Thing is, *some* do feel that way and it is deeply annoying. Yes, we are unworthy of basking in the glory that is Mesmer, and that is why we don't invite them to our parties, since their presence is like light, blinding our noobish eyes to their obvious superiority. Please forgive your humble servants

Actually I kinda planned to start Mesmer - but since I was playing cleric type in previous mmorpg, my guild mates convinced me to stay monk. I still managed to keep it as second professon

(and secondary character) However, PvE part of game is far too easy to really force people to use more sophisticated tactics, including energy denials, interrupts or curses. But this does not make "the trinity" or whatever you call them, inferior to "other three classes". Yes, they make it easier at time. But it's not like it's difficult anyway. That's all.

Vexx · Sep 20, 2005, 07:59 AM // 07:59

Well everything seems to have been covered.....so i'm just proud to say I was able to finish the game with my mesmer and henchies

Sorrows.....thats another story ....time will tell.

Dumeka · Sep 20, 2005, 08:34 AM // 08:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobsura

This is not a bash on the update, in fact i think the update is great but you can only do so much with Henchmen. I spent 2 hours in the war camp and saw many qoutes of "need people to go to sorrows furnace invite self" or "looking for people to farm invite self" so seeing that it is invite self i do and guess what, Declined or no answer. I have played over 400 hours with my mesmer, and over 50 of those hours were spent trying to get in an Underworld or FOW group, and have only been once in FOW once. I know the box says that you can't make a mistake early in the game that affects you later, that's true unless you make a Mesmer.

Add me to your friends: Dumeka Shoren

I have a Necro/Mesmer myself and sometimes didn't go accepted because of my professions myself (mostly Thunderhead keep where I can provide tons of help actually and have proven it to many).

As about the SF, I was there yesterday with my monk and we had a female mesmer with us also so no worries.

Not everyone is so retarted to not accept someone because of his/her class in the game.

I will be there tonight again between 6PM - 8PM GMT+1 in case that you can come just drop me a whisper and we go farm together a bit or do a quest or two!

Other than that you can find me in different times on weekends (also after midnight

).