Curse

ekamdu · Nov 27, 2006, 12:26 AM // 00:26

i finished the game 3 times, of which 2 within the first week of nightfall. i had no character higher than r1 lightbringer, and it didnt really matter... had to do a few missions again but it all wasnt hard...

LB title makes it easier, but its not neccecary. I would suggest bonus teams to take high rank LB people, since this makes the whole mission easier with more succes for masters...

Antheus · Nov 27, 2006, 12:53 AM // 00:53

LB = Infusion

It's just formulated slightly differently. You don't need it, you can finish the game, you can max it, you can do what you want.

Gaze is an extremly useful skill because of interrupts. In addition, dealing out 800 damage (for a full human group) every 15 seconds is a lot. Lastly, it's the damage reduction and damage bonus.

These add up. Right now, LB is a good discriminator for PUGs, since most will know what it is, how to get it, and how to use it. This is mostly due to novelty effect, as it will dilute through time.

It's also another incentive for players to abandon their heros for RoT, and group with players.

Getting to rank 2 and getting the gaze requires you to kill the djin groups about 3 times total, right outside the court of Sebolah (sp). That is less than 1 hour of work. It also teaches you how to handle SF (useful for pvp, heh). So getting gaze for the first mission where it becomes really handy is a really simple deal.

Any rank above that will help a bit, but won't change much.

Basically all non-caster professions get nice damage bonus as well.

Too bad this has already turned into tiger vs. bambi style discrimination. You wouldn't want to do RoF missions with someone who's not infused. Same goes for RoT, except that it's much less risky. And as always, the LB is a lot of drama over grind, without really looking at numbers. LB2, the only thing you need, is really fast and easy to obtain, mostly right alongside the missions themself.

Night Winde · Nov 27, 2006, 03:39 AM // 03:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antheus

Too bad this has already turned into tiger vs. bambi style discrimination. You wouldn't want to do RoF missions with someone who's not infused. Same goes for RoT, except that it's much less risky. And as always, the LB is a lot of drama over grind, without really looking at numbers. LB2, the only thing you need, is really fast and easy to obtain, mostly right alongside the missions themself.

Yep. The grind aspect of it is meaningless to me, I got there just following the story and going out and doing quests as I found them. My char is rank 3 and I never intended to pursue anything beyond rank 2, it just happened.

The point I was trying to make is it is useful but it is not so important that (if anyone read the original closed thread) anyone needs to be getting that frustrated or excited about it.

As for title display as I said before, no one sees your title when you are in a mission or an explorable area. The only person who knows what title you have selected to display at that point is you.

Some of us have titles we have worked very hard for and those are the ones we display when in towns or mission staging areas. Why? Because that's the only place others see them and isn't that the point of earning a title?

So great, the OP doesn't care if some of us have explored the entire map or capped all of the elites in all three campaigns. That's fine. We (those of us who have achieved these goals) do and like to display that fact.

What this thread is saying is "none of your titles matter in the game only this one so display it so we know." Those titles may not impact gameplay but they do matter. To the person that spent the time (and I work 40 hours a week and had to re-visit almost all of Tyria for my GMC title there which took about two weeks of my gametime) they matter.

Anyone who has spent any time in a mission staging area will see messages like "P/W with gaze and <insert the latest build of the week skill> lfg" and so forth. Again that means nothing to me since it's a toss whether the person playing that char will cut it in mission or not. It tells me they've probably read the forums and know what to say to make their char more "marketable" in the PuG sector but that's about it.

We've already seen incorrect stats on what the LB skills and rank will do, people that won't have anything to do with those of use who don't display the title and others (like myself) that really don't care one way or the other.

So again my point is it's a useful assist but it's not THAT important.

Mad5cout · Nov 27, 2006, 05:28 AM // 05:28

Clearly this is a matter of opinion but there is one thing that is irrefutable:

If you take a team with no LB ranks and put them through a mission and then take the same exact team (same players, same build, same skill) and give them all LB rank of 2, the latter will go faster, have a higher chance of success and overall do better in the mission. I have found this to be paramount when trying to complete master for certain missions, particularly if you do not have certain builds that help in completing things under the time resitrictions.

A couple of things to clarify:

1. As I stated in my first post, I am LB 4 right now. Anyone reading carefully would know that my damage stats for LB 8 were merely guesses. My observations on LB Gaze damage are primarly from Margonites and Shadow warriors as they do not have the armor bonus that Torments seem to have. The exact stats were hardly my point anyway. The compounding effect of LB gaze and the title were...

2. Although LB gaze has a base damage that does not change, the LB bonus does apply to this skill and changes its overall damage when used.

3. Contrary to popular belief, LB titles do not take a lot of time to get. One should be able to get LB 2 simply by getting bounties when they pass a Res shrine and completing the Primary story line. I got to LB 3 by simply getting bounties and completing all primary and secondary quests (minus some of the masters). I didn't have to farm points until I wanted LB 4. If someone is in the realm of torment without an LB 2 title, I can only assume that they are either lazy, unaware, or didn't care enough to get the bounties in the first place. I don't want any one of these traits in my party-members as they usually end up wasting my time.

4. Those L337 players that claim Godly status often get that way through experience by playing areas more than once. More than enough times to get LB titles. They also often gain godly status by farming for L337 items that have +15%^50 mods for weapons and shields with -5 damage redux (20% chance). People are willing to pay 30K, 60K, sometimes 90K+ for these items (depending on the skin). Although these people are much smarter than me (just ask them, they'll tell you), it seems to me that when you have the opportunity to get a FREE damage bonus of up to 40% (constant) and a damage redux of 8 (constant) for the realm of torment missions and areas, that this does matter in someway and is probablysomewhat significant.

5. If people want to post their other titles, that is their perogative. I am simply stating this information because even in the last mission area I find people that don't know how the title and bonuses work. So although there are some people who were and are aware and still don't care, I am not posting this for you. I am posting this for the literally hundreds of people out there I see every day that are completely oblivious to this information.

6. Finally, recognizing that I respect everyones right to post whatever title they want, I am simply not going to sift through that when searching for a party and most others will not either. No one is going to sit in town looking for party members saying, "OMG!!! There is a Master Cartographer! I am going to take the time to write out Igosukiyaki Tamguchisan so that I can PM her and see if she has an LB title!!!" They are simply going to take someone else. GLHF

Paperfly · Nov 27, 2006, 06:53 AM // 06:53

(I should probably start by mentioning that my Mesmer - who's the character I'm committed to doing all Elonian quests, including the Torment masters, on - is R3 Lightbringer. I always talk to shrine guards, so it happened automatically)

I refuse to use my Lightbringer rank as a form of protest.

...I'm not protesting rank discrimination. I've seen some pretty hysterical* shouting matches going on in the Gate of Torment, but that's got more to do with player self-confidence - people are terrified of the region, and Lightbringer rank is just one more security blanket they'll cling to, much like demanding Arcane Echo on their SS or Rebirth on their rangers.

On top of that, I'm pretty confident in the overall power of the refined, specialised party I can play if I run only heroes and henchies. So to convince me to compete on the PuG market for a tough quest in the Realm of Torment you'd have to persuade me that people would be easygoing and fun to be around - 'cause they aren't going to be more effective, no matter what their Lightbringer rank is.

So yeah, not gonna complain about rank discrimination. I refuse to use my Lightbringer rank because it destroys every other title.

Titles were concepted as an aesthetic thing - a mark of achievements, but a purely cosmetic one. ANet threw in odball titles like "drunkard" to reward intentionally quirky play, and they've been wildly popular. Specific titles can be used to define your character in much the same way as dyeing your armour pink and orange.

A title with virtually no aesthetic value, related to grind-style gameplay, that you're 'obliged' to keep active for 1/5 of the game? Yech. How does that not fly in the face of everything titles represent?

Titles also (normally) represent your character's history. As a general rule, titles represent a certain amount of affection you've lavished on the toon, worked out in hours played or gold spent with a specific intent in mind. Treasure Hunter means you've spent an unfeasible amount of gold on chests. Protector of Cantha means you've knocked back a lot of Assassins when they spammed random invites at you. These things show character. Lightbringer just means you're currently doing the local missions, same as everybody else.

...The final irony is that my Mesmer doesn't actually have a title worth displaying yet.

(and no, I'm not a big fan of the salvage title bonus either. Don't get me started!)

Quote:

Although these people are much smarter than me (just ask them, they'll tell you), it seems to me that when you have the opportunity to get a FREE damage bonus of up to 40% (constant) and a damage redux of 8 (constant) for the realm of torment missions and areas, that this does matter in someway and is probablysomewhat significant.

Er, those people are also putting 20/20 Sundering modifiers on their weapons, and will take a Chaos shield with crummy stats (as long as it's req 8!) over a collector's perfect Buckler. You're confusing two mindsets here - the genuine powergamers, who actually do the math on these things and have fairly specialised needs when it comes to pickup groups anyway; and the 'elite' who care more about perception. The latter aren't going to give a crap about any damage reduction for its own sake, not unless it impresses people at the same time.

...And at the moment, high Lightbrinnger rank just isn't glamorous enough for them.

Quote:

"OMG!!! There is a Master Cartographer! I am going to take the time to write out Igosukiyaki Tamguchisan so that I can PM her and see if she has an LB title!!!"

Since you're going to great pains to point out that (in spite of the spirit of your previous thread) you're simply trying to do the community a service by providing them with information they may have overlooked, allow me to do the same:

"ctrl+c" and "ctrl+v" can be used after highlighting a potential teammate's name to avoid all that tiresome spelling.

*in the "stressed out" sense, not the funny one!

aohige · Nov 27, 2006, 07:03 AM // 07:03

This is EXACTLY why I don't PUG.
Those jabbering on about a title requirement will most definitly not make my playinig the game fun.
Solo, friends, guildies, or alliance ftw.

Lb rank does make a significant diffrence in output of overall damage, but that diffrence is NOT enough to make up for inefficiency of people.

Cebe · Nov 27, 2006, 09:17 AM // 09:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paperfly

Protector of Cantha means you've knocked back a lot of Assassins when they spammed random invites at you. These things show character.

-----

I have Elonian Grandmaster Cartographer and I would much rather display that title than any other...until I get KOaBD. I somtimes apply Lightbringer when I'm not in an outpost if I remember...which is rare. I have obtained Brave Lightbringer (rank 3), mainly from speaking to shrine priests during my travels around Elona in pursuit of the GMC title.

Makkert · Nov 27, 2006, 10:06 AM // 10:06

This discussion looks suprisingly similar to the endless 'rank-skill' discussions about HA...

Effendi Westland · Nov 27, 2006, 11:21 AM // 11:21

LoL

High rank LB pugs will be something to avoid for sure. I bet they contain the same guys who go "Need more ele's and warriors, kick the mesmer" at THK after they fail it.

Think about this, the game was completed within days by people who didn't have the time to farm for Lightbringer points, they also didn't care that most we're r1 or r2, and they did it just fine. If somebody really thinks he needs to have a r8 party, I will avoid it like a plague.... I mean come on, there must be a reason why he thinks it is necessary.

And yes I'll take a 100% explored or high level Skill capper anytime, those titles require dedication and are usually titles one works on solo, so you have to be a skilled player to have them.

O Nuxtofulakas · Nov 27, 2006, 11:53 AM // 11:53

From my pov high LB rank is definitely not needed to finish the game, get masters etc...

The only use i see for this title atm is farming...
So if you are looking for a farming team, LB title is a good indication that this guy knows what's going on here...
It's an indication that this guy has experience, has spent many hours in these high lvl areas killing mobs or get killed...(hope he was not afk

)...

.....so you assume that he is not another "rambo" who aggro all red dots in the map...

...but as i just said..it's just an indication

Cyan The Archer · Nov 27, 2006, 12:25 PM // 12:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mahanaxar

Ok, I'm gonna kill Abaddon with my 5th char with heroes while you are looking for some uber R8 Lightbringer.

Too bad that im not looking for a R8 Lightbringer. Go kill Abaddon, i dont care. What i care about is if you have bothered to wear your Lightbringer title. No matter what rank you have in it. Too many are misunderstanding me... PLEASE read before you think that just because im r8, i only look for r8 players. I NEVER said that.

You can show any other title you have, as long as you change it to Lightbringer when i tell you to. If you dont know what Lightbringer title is, i will simply explain what it is, but if you DO NOT have it in THE REALM OF TORMENT you're getting kicked asap. People who dont have Lightbringer title in RoT is a waste of time to me, and most of them do not know how to play.

Cyan The Archer · Nov 27, 2006, 01:11 PM // 13:11

ramma the exra dmg do not mean much to me, but it means alot to me when the player wont take the time to wear his or her Lightbringer title in a mission.

Effendi Westland · Nov 27, 2006, 01:50 PM // 13:50

I get your point Cyan, it's just the OP I don't get.

Edit: no longer speaking for others

Cyan The Archer · Nov 27, 2006, 01:54 PM // 13:54

Effendi it seems that at least 2 havent got it.

SnipiousMax · Nov 27, 2006, 03:45 PM // 15:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Makkert

This discussion looks suprisingly similar to the endless 'rank-skill' discussions about HA...

Exactly, Closed.

The information is out there.