Curse

glountz · Sep 14, 2007, 10:11 AM // 10:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Celestial Beaver

Woah, Tiger.
I've had very little to think about with my Ele in Dungeons, all in all, Dual Attunements, Blinding Flash, Shell Shock and Epidemic seem to own most dungeons since most seem to be packed with physical damage dealers, who very graciously stand in nice close packs.

Well maybe but maybe not. I actually browse the wiki before entering any dungeon. It avoid pain and especially slowness.
Your blindingflash ele is not that useful in Shards of Orr. Especially against 5 magicians +2 smite monks.

Cebe · Sep 14, 2007, 10:17 AM // 10:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by glountz

Well maybe but maybe not. I actually browse the wiki before entering any dungeon. It avoid pain and especially slowness.
Your blindingflash ele is not that useful in Shards of Orr. Especially against 5 magicians +2 smite monks.

Well quite, I'm not saying it works in everything, but I just need to put very little thought into most dungeons, since they're usually packed with physical damage dealers. I also do a little research before entering a dungeon, and in places such as the Catacombs of Kathandrax and the Ooze Pit I never bothered with blind, but in many other dungeons, blinding foes = win. Even when I have to switch Elements, most standard PvE builds work like a peach...I haven't had to re-design builds for each dungeon really...

bungusmaximus · Sep 14, 2007, 10:22 AM // 10:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Celestial Beaver

Well quite, I'm not saying it works in everything, but I just need to put very little thought into most dungeons, since they're usually packed with physical damage dealers. I also do a little research before entering a dungeon, and in places such as the Catacombs of Kathandrax and the Ooze Pit I never bothered with blind, but in many other dungeons, blinding foes = win. Even when I have to switch Elements, most standard PvE builds work like a peach...I haven't had to re-design builds for each dungeon really...

Apart from places whee minion masters suddenly don't work, I did some missions and dungeons where Olias just stood there picking his nose. Apart from wasting 1 slot on a char that did nothing it wasn't game breaking though.

Ravenzfire · Sep 14, 2007, 10:29 AM // 10:29

I do have to agree that shards of orr is a pain in the ass. I've been able to h/h every other dungeon with minimal to no problems. I'm running a derv with Melandru and dealing pure holy damage. Most of the mobs aren't that big a deal until you run into one with 5 skeleton wizards, a priest and cleric, and brutes. The single cleric is ungodly at keeping the mob healed and once you've wracked up some dp your henchies drop at the mere sight of the oncoming mob. I can imagine it wouldn't be that bad with a pug group but hh'n it is another story. I've spent hours trying to get through this one dungeon and it's really starting to piss me off.

zwei2stein · Sep 14, 2007, 10:44 AM // 10:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by MithranArkanere

Imaginary weaponry!

/win thread

Other suggestions are not that bad either:

* Caster sin
* Sightbeyond sight
* Have someone cast spellbreaker on you.
* Send in some other hero first.

You might not be at 100% efectiveness, but if blind gives you so much trouble (which it shouldnt...), it might be worth it.

But really, improve. One blinded character shouldnt be game over for group.

zenatomiser · Sep 14, 2007, 10:57 AM // 10:57

Sry, haven't read through it all just posting what worked for me...

E/mo

OgNDwqzPO7DKC1/6jMs+LE0I

[skill]Scourge Healing[/skill][skill]Restore Condition[/skill][skill]Smite Condition[/skill][skill]Purifying Veil[/skill][skill]Glyph of Lesser Energy[/skill][skill]Castigation Signet[/skill][skill]Judge's Insight[/skill][skill]Ressurection Chant[/skill]

Slap on purifying veil and judges insight before you run in and put scourge healing on the ele's. They drop in like 1 sec death blossom does over 130-150~ dmg with judge's insight.

And if you still can't kill them... Invest in a mesmer

OQNDAqozOEVOgP4BQEwgoA0I

[skill]Hex Eater Vortex[/skill][skill]Backfire[/skill][skill]Signet of Humility[/skill][skill]Mantra of Inscriptions[/skill][skill]Drain Enchantment[/skill][skill]Revealed Enchantment[/skill][skill]Ether Feast[/skill][skill]Ressurection Chant[/skill]

Could replace ether feast with blackout if you really wanna be nasty, but that should be enough. mantra+signet of humility should keep one of the eles completely shutdown from spamming blinding surge. Use drain enchantment/revealed enchantment to remove Shield of Deflection if neccesarry when spiking the crap out of other wizards.

And most of all don't stand in eruption or let your heros get AoE'd, use flags.

Have fun beating the crap out of undead, Holy dmg ftw!

freekedoutfish · Sep 14, 2007, 11:07 AM // 11:07

Em.... ive never had an issue!!! I usually take myself and a second SF ele, 3 monks and 2 warriors and I've not any problems with any golems!

I didnt even notice getting blinded... although I probably was.

I guess its more frustrating for close combat classes, but surely there is a build to prevent you getting blinded? maybe take mending and protection monks?

Do none of the pve only skills prevent blindness?

zknifeh · Sep 14, 2007, 11:34 AM // 11:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by SotiCoto

Way to not read the first post... ¬_¬
Sight Beyond Sight is Spawning Power based and is cast ON SELF. Only usable for more than a few seconds for Primary rits BY Primary rits, who couldn't care less if they're blinded or not anyway.

actually it lasts 8 seconds with 15 sec recharge
if u have 20% ench dagger mod, it lasts about 10 secs or so
i use that skill once in a while and it works ok, could be better tho
while i have it on there is usualy enough time to deal enough dmg to the blind bot to take him out
and since i know u use crit agility + defences, u should get enchanting daggers if you already dont have them

Cyan Rhae · Sep 14, 2007, 11:53 AM // 11:53

I get the impression by your post that your somehow the key to survival for your team by inflicting damage on mobs through melee attacks.
Your saying that your melee attacks arent very effective cos your blind and blinded in between 24/7 even though you have a support team of condition removals.

I happen to know that theres more blind up ahead waiting for you the moment you walk out of that dungeon .
However being blinded doesnt seem the real problem here ... your simply saying your team isnt healthy enough to finish, your dp 60 in notime.

Lets just forget about this cos its not reallly important.
As a Sin or War ... and in pve (think about high end areas) , when your fighting against foes higher then your own level , you are the person that holds the aggro on the frontline.
This way you will keep damage to your midline to a minimum and in return they will finish your aggro in the front advancing to any kind of foes hiding in the back.
In the meantime your Healers in the back shouldnt take a lot of damage and they can focus theyre energy on you and save enough energy to heal your team when needed.

If your playing h/h its important that you flag your team in the formation you think is best, you know about micromanaging and assigning targets im sure.

So here's my 50 cents to you im hoping it will help you in some other way then handing you over some godly build.

Cebe · Sep 14, 2007, 12:52 PM // 12:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

I guess its more frustrating for close combat classes, but surely there is a build to prevent you getting blinded? maybe take mending and protection monks?

Are you being serious or sarcastic? I really couldn't tell from the rest of your post...

xArcaeus · Sep 14, 2007, 12:58 PM // 12:58

My ranger got blindness spammed on him doing Sveltarm in Slaver's Exile (don't remember it happening in Oola's Lab, was watching tv as I ran through it), so what did I do? Not sit there spamming my triple and double shot hoping my 10% chance of hitting would come through. I literally ran circles around the casters, and laughed as they got the crap Savannah Heat'ed outta them. Cake. If you're blind and don't want to change your build (seriously, though, don't rely on attack skill chains against anything with hexes/blindness) then be a distracter/tank! If the caster's AI is confused about your running around like a chicken with its head cut off, pressure has successfully been taken off the rest of your team.

HydroX · Sep 14, 2007, 03:27 PM // 15:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Celestial Beaver

I've had very little to think about with my Ele in Dungeons, ...

That's because there are several tiers of players in this game, with varying skill levels.

Most of us don't need to think too hard to beat certain areas, because we have common knowledge about the game and what each skill does, and the counter to it.

Others... like the OP, are uneducated about certain skills (and even their skill line--Deadly Arts, for example). That's where sharing knowledge comes into play. However, if they are unable to listen and shoot down every idea that's thrown out to help them, then I would think that they deserve to fail.

Emanuel Zorg · Sep 14, 2007, 03:33 PM // 15:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by SotiCoto

Byebye key attack chain (requiring elite)

Probably so. I know how much you love your Moebius + Death Blossom spam, but not everything in the game can be beaten with the same build, which is actually a good thing (it's one of the few times when PvE requires thought).

Assassin is my primary character too. Last time I did Shards of Orr I was pretty useless for damage because like you I picked a suboptimal build. I was a good distraction while the H/H cleaned up, though. There are lots of good suggestions in this thread and I'm going to try some of them. I'll bookmark it and let you know how well they work if I do Shards of Orr again.

Darkpower Alchemist · Sep 14, 2007, 03:54 PM // 15:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by HydroX

Enchantment Spell.

With all the shatter enchantments (and their variations) you encounter.. Spotless Mind/Spotless Soul can be a horrible option for most of the game. It would be more harmful than helpful.

Any monk that finds themself running a superior headpiece is just.. laughable.

Or a 55 monk.

The standard two monk backline should always have one condition removal and one hex removal each (being Remove Hex, or Cure Hex -- purely preference).

--

Say your warrior is blind, or in this case, an assassin.

You cast Spotless Soul on them. It takes 3 seconds for the first condition to be removed.

Spotless Soul gets stripped within 2 seconds.

Blind condition remains on the assassin, and you're throwing the 5 mana out the window

Even if Spotless Soul caught the blindness on the first 3 seconds before it was stripped, and the assassin is blind again -- either from Blinding Flash or Eruption -- then you're still out 5 mana and you're waiting the 12 seconds for the recharge to take that gamble yet again.

Me personally... I'd rather have [skill]Dismiss Condition[/skill]. 5 mana. 3 second recharge. Or even good ole' [skill]Mend Ailment[/skill].

It's more viable to just remove it and ask your assassin to kite if blinded again until removed.

First, you're thinking in terms of PvP only when refering to If you have a monk with a sup rune on...you're not using your brain fully yet. He is talking PvE, first, and secondly, I was making reference to someone saying the skill is useless- so please be aware of the stuff you're walking into before commenting.

In a place where enchantment stripping is heavy, dismiss condition or Reverse Hex would be my choice of spells(Not being the one who condones stripping enchantments). Yet, consider the scenario in question. He is being constantly and consistently blinded and doesn't want to change his build in the least. 3 monks with basic blind removals as you and others have pointed out have not been able to keep him clean, so what do you do to make things better?

You find something that will repeatedly clean the blinds while not causing multiple casts or the fewest casts possible. This is E management 101. You should know this stuff already. Casting Spotless soul one time compared to casting DC 3 times to achieve the same goal, which is taking off the blind, is poor energy management. If he and talon are both under a scenario of constant/near constant blindness, then they bodyblock while the casters do the killing, and when the monks clean them off eventually catch a hit in to help the cause.

If he is 'always' blind during battle, no amount of mend ailment/dismiss condition/Restore Condition/Blessed Light or any other removal will keep him clean. He might as well wear a blindfold the whole dungeon/mission if that is truely the case. Spotless is an option if enchantment stripping isn't heavy and if he is being stripped down to the bone, then Crit Agility is comprimised and his ability to be an effective melee attacker is very much in question on a whole.

To clearify, sup runes are not the enemy, nor is the use of enchantments, but the lack of knowledge of proper application.

Also, if he was blind in the first place, the monk cast Spotless Soul, and he is using hench monks who have mend or dismiss, wouldn't he have a better chance of being cleaned by not overlapping spells? Think about that for abit...

Bryant Again · Sep 14, 2007, 04:05 PM // 16:05

This is like the third time SotiCoto has done this, it's buggin' me.

That aside, I haven't had much of a problem. They either A. Blind the minions, B. Blind the casters, or C. Blind me, in which case I'll either micromanage a hero to Dismiss Condition me or mending touch.

Painbringer · Sep 14, 2007, 04:11 PM // 16:11

I can give advice on Shards of Orr. It is a pain and all groups are heavy hitters. As mentioned above maybe pick a less damaging build. I would use a more survivor build and just be a meat puppet. Yes it will be boring but for this dungeon you need to keep the enemy grouped, and let the casters pick them off. Keep them in tight groups and let the AOE do its work. Build you team to snare and destroy. I have tried many different ways but this concept seemed the best for me. Shadow step in and use Return as an opening attack then let your team follow after they have been snared. Easier with Heros and hench . You will get blasted but your casters will not and the monks should keep you alive.

lunksunkunk · Sep 14, 2007, 04:23 PM // 16:23

@OP

I totally understand you, i had my warrior in there getting blind, poison, weakness almost constantly, ill admit it was annoying, but they werent hitting my squishies. I tanked my way through there, but yes the annoyance factor was pretty bad. Just try fighting those raptors......critical defenses up all the time, 75% chance of missing everytime, man, now thats annoying, so now my warrior has either pure KD skills that dont require melee or just packing skills that cant be blocked.

Emanuel Zorg · Sep 14, 2007, 04:32 PM // 16:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zeek Aran

http://www.pvxwiki.com/wiki/Build:A/Me_Assacaster
Might that be what you are looking for?

This is what I'm looking into. There are a lot of nice skills in the Deadly Arts line, most are spells and thus not affected by blindness, and many of them do respectable damage. Deadly Paradox + Dancing Daggers = 174 earth damage to one target in 5 seconds, which isn't bad for 10e. In a quick test, I was able to spam conditions and hexes far faster than the enemy monks could smite them. Combined with a hex-heavy hero and some holy damage, I think it's going to work pretty well with some tweaks.

Evilsod · Sep 14, 2007, 04:38 PM // 16:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by lunksunkunk

@OP

I totally understand you, i had my warrior in there getting blind, poison, weakness almost constantly, ill admit it was annoying, but they werent hitting my squishies. I tanked my way through there, but yes the annoyance factor was pretty bad. Just try fighting those raptors......critical defenses up all the time, 75% chance of missing everytime, man, now thats annoying, so now my warrior has either pure KD skills that dont require melee or just packing skills that cant be blocked.

[skill]Rending Touch[/skill] /win

Freeked... what are you on about. We're talking mainly about Shards of Orr, if your getting blind spammed in Oola's you should lure less and prioritize targets for your casters more.

Going into dungeons without a clue is fun

I entered the Catacombs on after just finding it using 2 Searing Flames heroes and an MM. Even with things that are immune to burning it was pretty simple.

SotiCoto · Sep 14, 2007, 09:59 PM // 21:59

Just tried Shards of Orr again.
Used a Blood Magic build that was most un-assassin-like.... but it seemed to be doing the job for the most part.

Got to the third level this time. Killing off groups was much easier.
BUT.... failed again.

Started accumulating Death Penalty... and from there everything just went screwy.
There is an area on the 3rd floor where it is nigh on impossible to flag the heroes correctly because either I can't lure the enemies far enough back.... or the herohench will Leeroy into a poison jet-stream and wipe within moments. They're total fvcking retards like that.... and it bugs me....

Just how am I supposed to find a group build that works in that hellhole? Paragons don't work because they end up blinded and can't build adrenaline. With one healer and two protection monks.... the third floor groups can wipe us out by sheer weight of numbers despite the monks' best efforts.
I tried a Smiting monk as well.... damages nicely... but the group as a whole lacks defense now.
Just what the crap am I supposed to do?

There are far too many variables to just guess at it.... PLUS Shards of Orr is a pain in the arse to get to because it can't be done from Gadd's Encampment....

I'm quickly sickening of this whole business.
I'm getting sick of A-Net for making GW:EN into nothing but a mindless dungeon-crawl... and I'm getting sick of the folks who keep saying PvE is "too easy" because they aren't going around the place on constant -60%.