Curse

unienaule · Oct 14, 2005, 08:03 PM // 20:03

The problem with your plan is sometimes you go up against 3-5 taskmasters at once. Honestly, how many monks take spellbreaker? In my 93 trips, I've seen one. Just one. Why? Because most of them like to heal or protect instead. Oh and I'm not making this stuff up. I'm with my tank on TS, and he used to say "I'm at 10 degen... some hex removal would be useful," whenever Ob Flesh was down. Now, I'd invite you to come watch sometime and see how our group does. We take a Mo/R with symbiosis and maintained enchants + orizon and kiss of dwayna, and E/Mo (me) with Succor, Mending, kiss, other, breeze, and convert hexes. He gets hexed, puts up ob flesh, I convert hexes. No more degen, except for bleeding which is countered by mending. The real reason for mend + succor though, is symbiosis and kiss of dwayna. Can you say 286hp for 5 energy? :-) No one has died defending orozar for quite some time.

Slimcea · Oct 14, 2005, 08:42 PM // 20:42

Experience says unienaule is correct. If your team doesn't drop the opposition far enough, and you get caught in 2 waves (happens, but rarely though), even 2 monks healing you full time is insufficient. Also, I tend to find casting anything as the gear tank pretty impossible, given the fact that the mesmers spam Cry of Fustration.

Savio · Oct 15, 2005, 12:47 PM // 12:47

Actually, I'm the W/E that teams with unien a lot, and the Mo/R and E/Mo with me are pretty much all I need. I can aggro pretty much 4-5 groups at once, no problem. And I usually only cast Ob Flesh about a second before the Taskmasters hit; after they're offed the damage left is inconsequential. Actually, even if Ob Flesh is CoF'ed I usually don't suffer too much damage. The rest of my skills are instantaneous anyway.

BBoy_Manchild · Oct 16, 2005, 12:02 AM // 00:02

fire off SoJ and another enchant (breeze or whatever to stop SoJ from being removed) before you start running headfirst into the mob with the gear/keg in hand

unienaule · Oct 16, 2005, 03:59 AM // 03:59

One enchant is not going to keep up SoJ vs. more than 1 taskmaster.

ChoKILLate[FDG] · Oct 17, 2005, 05:24 PM // 17:24

Who is doing just one....usually the monk puts at least 2 on the warrior, the warrior has one or 2 on, and then right before he goes in, the monk casts healing seed. The seed is the first thing removed, then one of the monk enchantments....which (if you are in my group gets spammed right back on) so unless there are 5 taskmasters constantly spamming remove enchantment, my group can do this gear farming run pretty easily.

unienaule · Oct 17, 2005, 07:45 PM // 19:45

Well, see, maybe you can do it, but I don't quite think you know how easy it is my way. I put my enchants up on Savio, then watch tv and occasionally heal him. His hp stays somewhere around 1,200 out of 1,500 or so. That's easy. Honestly, with +6 constant regen, and heal breeze making that +14, it gets really boring.

ChoKILLate[FDG] · Oct 18, 2005, 02:29 PM // 14:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by unienaule

Well, see, maybe you can do it, but I don't quite think you know how easy it is my way. I put my enchants up on Savio, then watch tv and occasionally heal him. His hp stays somewhere around 1,200 out of 1,500 or so. That's easy. Honestly, with +6 constant regen, and heal breeze making that +14, it gets really boring.

Ok before you were asking this:

"Just a question with some of these W/Mo builds....None of them involve hex or shatter enchant protection. If you don't have those, you'll be sitting at -10 degen for nearly the whole battle. Thanks."

And now we are agreeing that the warrior barely takes any damage...I put enchantments on the warrior and he never goes down and I don't use hex removal, I just spam any enchantment that was removed and throw on healing seed and healing breeze. You never really explained what "your way" was other than to give the warrior some hex removal skills.

Batou of Nine · Oct 18, 2005, 05:19 PM // 17:19

3 man team.

2 monks. 1 tank. 1 protector, 1 healer. One castes Balths spirit on tank and both use upkeep enchants on tank. Tank uses nearly all AoE smite skills, glads armor and essence on self.

or 4 man with above group and a nuker. tank holds gear, and does major smiting, i.e. SoJ, SoW, Balths Aura, Smite Hex, etc

provided the right enchants are maintained and tank is heald enough, the group kills super fast...
As for protecting vs shatter enchants, Bury most important enchants, and cover up all enchants with Holy Veil. Veil gets shattered, then so does 2 hexes, and an additional hex with smite hex. recaste veil when needed...enjoy!

ChoKILLate[FDG] · Oct 19, 2005, 01:45 PM // 13:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Batou of Nine

3 man team.

2 monks. 1 tank. 1 protector, 1 healer. One castes Balths spirit on tank and both use upkeep enchants on tank. Tank uses nearly all AoE smite skills, glads armor and essence on self.

or 4 man with above group and a nuker. tank holds gear, and does major smiting, i.e. SoJ, SoW, Balths Aura, Smite Hex, etc

provided the right enchants are maintained and tank is heald enough, the group kills super fast...
As for protecting vs shatter enchants, Bury most important enchants, and cover up all enchants with Holy Veil. Veil gets shattered, then so does 2 hexes, and an additional hex with smite hex. recaste veil when needed...enjoy!

EXACTLY what I've been saying!

unienaule · Oct 21, 2005, 02:36 PM // 14:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChoKILLate[FDG]

You never really explained what "your way" was other than to give the warrior some hex removal skills.

Quote:

Originally Posted by unienaule

We take a Mo/R with symbiosis and maintained enchants + orizon and kiss of dwayna, and E/Mo (me) with Succor, Mending, kiss, other, breeze, and convert hexes. He gets hexed, puts up ob flesh, I convert hexes. No more degen, except for bleeding which is countered by mending. The real reason for mend + succor though, is symbiosis and kiss of dwayna. Can you say 286hp for 5 energy? :-) No one has died defending orozar for quite some time.

I never explained it?

Also now I have switched to Watchful Spirit instead of Convert Hexes. More Hp and regen ftw.

Spoils from run number 104: Bortaks Bone Cesta. Yay.

ange1 · Oct 21, 2005, 03:52 PM // 15:52

nothingness

Raku Clayman · Oct 22, 2005, 03:48 PM // 15:48

Savio, could you post your build here. I am a W/E and I take a more aggressive approach using Cleave, etc. and the "tank" approach is something new to me thay I would like to try with more stance skills, etc. I'd like to know just how you set your player up. Of course, we all have our own playing styles so I would just adapt the philosophy to try out, but, I would like to play around using your approach.

TIA

Savio · Oct 22, 2005, 10:34 PM // 22:34

My tank build probably isn't too efficient, mainly because most of the time ange1 and unien are healing me for 200+ hp a sec. But it works for keeping them off me when I need them to.

W/E

Earth Magic 12
Strength 2+1
Axe Mastery 8+1 (Yes, Axe Mastery is pointless on a gear tank build)
Tactics 10+1+1

Obsidian Flesh - lasts 18 seconds, more than enough time to smack down casters. Unfortunately, a side effect is that the Taskmasters (Mesmers) will hex anyone in range rather than just you with the gear.

"Shields Up!" - lasts 18 seconds, reduces damage from Surveyors (Rangers) a bit.

"Watch Yourself!" - cheap +20 armor.

Sprint - because you're slow with the gear, and every bit helps.

Defensive Stance - 10 seconds of essentially 75% damage reduction* from Deep Knights (Warriors) and Surveyors. Try to use all your other skills before tossing this one up, as it ends when you use a skill.

Disciplined Stance - 10 more seconds of 75% damage reduction*. This one's slightly better because you can use Energy skills under it, but not "Watch Yourself!"

Bonetti's Defense - yet another 10 seconds of 75% damage reduction*. It's based on Adrenaline though, which is harder to get without Balthazaar's Spirit.

Resurrection Signet - because I'm bored and sometimes people are stupid in Grenth's Footprint. Sometimes I dragged Cap Sig along to laugh at the Warrior bosses and poor skill choices (all of them had Heavy Blow?), but they fixed that now, so I'm going to have to bring a Cap Sig to see what they have.

*By damage reduction, I mean that since 75% of the regular attacks at you don't hit, it's effective 75% damage reduction. It's much better than trying to stack armor, which reduces damage by half for every 40 armor you have or so. Skills like Melandru's Arrows and any attack skills with +damage bypass armor, so it's rather pointless anyway.

Your main problem is getting degened and/or Obsidian Flamed to death. If a Taskmaster hexes someone else, well, they hex pretty much anyone regardless of gears, so I could care less. Ob Flesh makes the Wardens (Eles) and Dark Binders (Necros) useless as all they can do is wand you to death.

~~~

It also should be noted that it's more of the monks' job to keep me alive. ange1 drops Symbiosis then casts a bunch of enchants on me. With another monk or two casting different enchants, my health is 1000+ most of the time. Not to mention that with somewhere around 8-10 enchants on me Dwayna's Kiss heals for a ridiculously high amount.

Reiden Argrock · Oct 23, 2005, 02:54 AM // 02:54

I don't know why you guys keep talking about 1000+hp.. it's not needed at all... I run FA 3 man farming runs, and get to rago everytime...

W/N, 560 hp, and the only skill that makes a difference, is Glads Defense, now granted, some of these dmg reducing, and blocking things are helpful, but only really keep you above 75% hp, rather than above 50% hp

And Even Glads Defense, really only is needed for not getting hit as much.. if you have a good aoe dmg caster.. the bonus dmg from Glads defense doesn't do much...

now, if your talking about orozar, maybe i'm off, I havn't done that one much.. but I imagine their pretty much the same kind of stuff

Savio · Oct 23, 2005, 03:07 AM // 03:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reiden Argrock

I don't know why you guys keep talking about 1000+hp.. it's not needed at all... I run FA 3 man farming runs, and get to rago everytime...

W/N, 560 hp, and the only skill that makes a difference, is Glads Defense, now granted, some of these dmg reducing, and blocking things are helpful, but only really keep you above 75% hp, rather than above 50% hp

And Even Glads Defense, really only is needed for not getting hit as much.. if you have a good aoe dmg caster.. the bonus dmg from Glads defense doesn't do much...

now, if your talking about orozar, maybe i'm off, I havn't done that one much.. but I imagine their pretty much the same kind of stuff

I never said 1000+ hp is needed, just that's how we do it for Orozar (I probably should have stated that). For normal farming runs I wouldn't even bother since you can control aggro easily. In Orozar when you have 3-4 groups on you, it's slightly different but still, 1000+ hp isn't necessary. It's easier though.

Glad Defense isn't great because of the extra damage, which isn't significant. It's more for the fact that it's the best 75% stance out there along with Bonetti's. Its recharge time is the fastest, and it doesn't end when you do anything. Were I not running Ob Flesh I'd do Glad Defense, Shield Stance, and Bonetti's.

Valkyrie Elly · Oct 24, 2005, 02:20 AM // 02:20

OK so i have been reading this and granted my build is not as good as your guys but it does work for orozar with a 4 man team easily. I use a W/R and I'm posting because i haven't seen a good build for them here, just w/e or w/mo. Again this is not as good as your two builds, but any help or revision on it will be appreciated. Anyways i use this,
Healing sig
sprint
endure pain
Shields up!
bonneti's defence
defensive stance
glad defence
dryders defences

basically i have 3 defensive stances with added armor and when combined with shields up if they do hit it is for very little. Dryders defences is great for elemental damage and doesn't make the mesmers attack others. Endure pain works if you hit a problem or need extra health because of degen. The only fault to this setup is health degen. But having the monk heal and my healing sig should we not have a battery or monk runs out of energy keeps me alive. We can aggro two groups with this setup. we usually stick to one though.
There isnt anything special about this setup just your average stances and bonuses.
Two things i expect to see remarked on are the healing sig, yes i do think it is useful here it has saved me before. Secondly i have thought about melandru's resilience but i prefer glad defense. But maybe after reading this i should consider a change.

Divine Kai · Oct 25, 2005, 03:05 AM // 03:05

Gladiators Defense
Retribution
Symbol of Wrath
"I will survive!"
Rebirth
Sprint
Endure Pain
"Shields Up"

Skill Bar setup of mine for 4 or 5 man group. 2 E - 1 prot - 1 heal or with just 1 less Ele.

Jigs · Oct 25, 2005, 06:28 PM // 18:28

This is my build for my W/R for farming

Defy pain
Endure pain
wary stance
whirling defense
I will survive
Shields up
defensive stance
Rez signet

simple but works very well on my SF farming

I have defy pain coz I am not always sure if the monks on my team are very reliable in keeping me alive

No matter how perfect your build is, a gear build warrior still needs help from the monk/s

darkMishkin · Nov 11, 2005, 03:40 AM // 03:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Savio

Except when you're holding a gear, you aren't holding a shield

LOLOLOL I just gear-tanked a SF ~10 boss run, using Gladiator, Bonetti's and Shield Stance, only now realising this^^

Man I guess I had good monks lol...

Also I used Contemplation of purity alot (helps to prevent boredom too), just wait til your Breeze, MoP whatever, is running out then Contemplate and get some nice easy hex and condition removal.