Curse

The Herbalizer · Aug 27, 2007, 11:57 AM // 11:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Agyar

Don't let the door hit you on the way out.

Decided not to quit

I want to spend all my ecto first.

Standard troll response to someone leaving though... Its kinda old aswell maybe a new response it needed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pork soldier

QQ more please, this game was never intended for you to horde things for wealth.

Please explain why?

As I would love to hear your explanation as to why it is not.

I am sure Anet never thought for one minute that making items which drop like never and only a dozen or so exist is not going to cause them to be highly desirable and collectable...

The recent addition of mini pets in limited numbers would suggest otherwise.

Lonesamurai · Aug 27, 2007, 12:04 PM // 12:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Herbalizer

Decided not to quit

I want to spend all my ecto first.

Standard troll response to someone leaving though... Its kinda old aswell maybe a new response it needed.

Maybe if you don't give people ammo they wouldn't troll... especially a mod should know not to feed the damn trolls

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Herbalizer

Please explain why?

As I would love to hear your explanation as to why it is not.

I am sure Anet never thought for one minute that making items which drop like never and only a dozen or so exist is not going to cause them to be highly desirable and collectable...

The recent addition of mini pets in limited numbers would suggest otherwise.

The games initial idea was to make things available to everyone, they succeeded in this by the sheer fact that you can make PvP characters and the max for all weapons are maxed and thats it...

better skins are there for people that want them, they are, however, not a necessity and you station they are is just more flamebait... This isn't WoW or Lineage 2, you don't need a Runic Blade when a Shortsword will do... you want it, good for you, but stating that ANet is in the wrong for putting a lil gem in for those that want to go out of the way and then making that gem more available to make way for other lil gems is stupid, immature and penile...

My old man reccomendation of the day? Go and get a real life job, and maybe snag a social life at the same time and see if you have the time to grind for those things that mean nothing

Patrick Smit · Aug 27, 2007, 12:18 PM // 12:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Foe

Ahh the eternal debate...Marx was correct only once. Your financial situation determines your political views. If your poor, nothing should be rare and fow armour is ugly(oddly enough the same ppl will argue its not accesible to them

)

Nah there are many political views that are not governed by wealth, liberalism says something about responsability and the way you (choose) to live, enviromentalists put sustainability up front, andboth poor and rich will follow the same ideology. He was just right if there was a limited choice system, being either communist/socialist or capitalist.

Daenara · Aug 27, 2007, 12:30 PM // 12:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by ManiakMogg

It's a fake...

Firstly,if it was true, the screenshot wouldn't show "xxx PICKED UP the runic blade" but "monster DROPPED the runic blade".

A monster didn't drop it though. They're saying that it dropped as a quest reward from the quest chest. Try it yourself and see, it doesn't say what was dropped, only mentions when someone picks it up!

O Nuxtofulakas · Aug 27, 2007, 12:42 PM // 12:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Herbalizer

If Anet stopped adding rare skins and they all had an equal drop rate I would be happy as at least people would not be screwed over.

Anet need to make their mind up. Do they want rare skins or not? As they sure as hell dont seem to have made their mind up at the moment.

Anet should stop changing its mind every few months about what they want as rare. That way threads like this wont pop up and annoy lots of players.

/signed

...so anyone knows what is "rare" anymore? (/sarcasm)

Retribution X · Aug 27, 2007, 12:42 PM // 12:42

IMHO, req 9 shouldn't drop elsewhere then HoH. or maybe non-max ones can drop in PvE.

Something that's won't jack with rare prices too much.

The Herbalizer · Aug 27, 2007, 12:47 PM // 12:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lonesamurai

Maybe if you don't give people ammo they wouldn't troll... especially a mod should know not to feed the damn trolls

The games initial idea was to make things available to everyone, they succeeded in this by the sheer fact that you can make PvP characters and the max for all weapons are maxed and thats it...

better skins are there for people that want them, they are, however, not a necessity and you station they are is just more flamebait... This isn't WoW or Lineage 2, you don't need a Runic Blade when a Shortsword will do... you want it, good for you, but stating that ANet is in the wrong for putting a lil gem in for those that want to go out of the way and then making that gem more available to make way for other lil gems is stupid, immature and penile...

My old man reccomendation of the day? Go and get a real life job, and maybe snag a social life at the same time and see if you have the time to grind for those things that mean nothing

I loled. And you base this reccomendation on what you know about me? Or is it based on generalisations? Do you know how much I play GW, do you know if I have a social life? do you know if I have a job? etc. Your reccomendation must be based on the fact I am rich and that must mean I spent 12 hours a day farming as that is the only way people can get rich... Generalisations are 1337 =)

Your "lil gem" argument is weird and confusing. Please rephrase it as I cant work out what you are trying to say.

Am I right in saying you mean: -

I am immature and stupid for saying it is unfair for Anet to recently introduce a rare HoH drop and then deciding to make it a rediculously common drop?

I would rather Anet make every drop common so players cant lose gold. This is better than Anet releasing rare skins then making them common all the time.

Lonesamurai · Aug 27, 2007, 12:51 PM // 12:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Herbalizer

I loled. And you base this recommendation on what you know about me? Or is it based on generalizations?

Its based on three things...

1, your poor spelling, which makes me cranky

2, I have flu, which makes me real cranky

3, the fact its a stupid game and not real life...

Turma · Aug 27, 2007, 12:51 PM // 12:51

First of all, I want to state that I am a common player, have 2 plats of money and only a few green weapons.

But, I do have to agree with Herbalizer.

Think it this way: You want a Ferrari F50 for example. You could have a Kia Cee'd and it would do just fine, but you want a Ferrari F50, as it has perfect stats and the skin is so cool..and because it is Ferrari F50 and not Kia Cee'd.

Ok, so you work years to get the money for it, and then you buy it.

Just to wake up in the morning on familiar motor sound and see your neighbour has a Ferrari F50 mark II. You go and ask where did he get it and he answers that the motorshop up north sells them for 499$ and it has only 50hp less than the original Ferrari F50.

And then you start to see those Ferrari F50 mark II's everywhere and you start to think you should have sticked with the Kia Cee'd...at least it is not common car...

Ok, enough of joking. When you gain something that you have worked hard for, and see it's value drop drastically, it is a pain in a butt, if it was a GW weapon, a car, a girlfriend or anything else.

Therefore, having Runic Blades dropping at GW:EN is like ANet kicking Runic Blade owners to the nuts and shouting "You got served!"

As for the PvP only matter, Runic Blade comparison Mallyx's Edge has the same skin as Runic Blade, and can be obtained by PvE players with almost same struggle as playing HoH...almost.

I hope we can agree now

King's Spectre · Aug 27, 2007, 12:53 PM // 12:53

I'd be just as happy if they only dropped as r11 purples outside HoH but I'm glad to have a shot at a few of my favorite skins now.

The Herbalizer · Aug 27, 2007, 01:08 PM // 13:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lonesamurai

Its based on three things...

1, your poor spelling, which makes me cranky

2, I have flu, which makes me real cranky

3, the fact its a stupid game and not real life...

1. Yes, because all adults can spell perfectly... Poor spellling = No social life + No job? Interesting.

2. Go see a doctor.

3. O I get about x1000 times more worked up irl when rich people are screwed over i.e. inheritence tax. I wana be a tax solicitor to ensure rich people pay less taxes

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Agreed with Turma.

Anet should just stop making rare items and just make them common. Would save alot of people alot of hastle and loss of gold.

arcanemacabre · Aug 27, 2007, 01:38 PM // 13:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Turma

Just to wake up in the morning on familiar motor sound and see your neighbour has a Ferrari F50 mark II. You go and ask where did he get it and he answers that the motorshop up north sells them for 499$ and it has only 50hp less than the original Ferrari F50.

And then you start to see those Ferrari F50 mark II's everywhere and you start to think you should have sticked with the Kia Cee'd...at least it is not common car...

Ok, enough of joking. When you gain something that you have worked hard for, and see it's value drop drastically, it is a pain in a butt, if it was a GW weapon, a car, a girlfriend or anything else.

I can use an example that counters this example - and then you'll see why working for real-life items is different than playing for virtual items.

When the first CD player was introduced onto the market in 1982, it sold for $900 USD. It was big, clunky, and had all sorts of issues, but it was the first. People who bought it were the elite as far as audio was concerned. A few years later, you could buy one for about $200. A few years after that, $50.

Obviously, mass production, better materials, and better technology made it possible for lower prices, and paved the way for everyone to own one. This was clearly a good thing. Not everyone desires a Ferrari F50. If everyone could afford one, few would still own one. Many desire a luxury car, so car companies try hard to release luxury cars at more affordable prices, and they are a huge success.

Anet knows if the masses want something, it must become more readily available. Those who originally acquired that something when it was much harder to get can still say they were "one of the first," or "one of the original," if they so choose. It's a kind of bragging rights.

Now, the biggest problem with these analogies is what I mentioned earlier - this is a game. In real life, we are expected to work hard, or work smart, and earn our wealth. It keeps everything in check. It's a reward in life for an honest living. One of the luxuries we earn is entertainment. A video game is one such luxury. Many of us work the rat race during our everyday lives, and we would like to escape it when we sit down at Guild Wars.

That said, Anet understands this, and tries to appease both groups - those who want to enjoy the game and the goodies it has to offer, and those who want their ultra-rare elite CD players. Having really rare items in the game that eventually become more common is a great way to do that. It means you can't just horde a rare item and expect to have its value frozen. Even that Ferrari will devalue over time simply because you own it. Time makes fools of us all, they say.

Sorry for the long post, I'm a bit tired. I hope it made sense.

Knight_Blazer · Aug 27, 2007, 02:08 PM // 14:08

In my opinion the old owners of these runic blades who get screwed represent a really low % compared to the casual players who benefit from these new drops. So I don't even if those old owners do quit it'll affect the game much. I have been wanting to buy a Mallyx Reaver and a Tormented Scythe but both dropped prices recently, I do wish items value were more stable because I just hesitate to buy them. I'm more pissed off at the constant ecto price drop. Economiy needs stability badly.

nem coke · Aug 27, 2007, 02:53 PM // 14:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Knight_Blazer

In my opinion the old owners of these runic blades who get screwed represent a really low % compared to the casual players who benefit from these new drops. So I don't even if those old owners do quit it'll affect the game much. I have been wanting to buy a Mallyx Reaver and a Tormented Scythe but both dropped prices recently, I do wish items value were more stable because I just hesitate to buy them. I'm more pissed off at the constant ecto price drop. Economiy needs stability badly.

/agree 100% (bloody 12 characters)

Ben-A-BoO · Aug 27, 2007, 03:10 PM // 15:10

I enjoyed this thread enormously, even if I had the odd feeling I have read this thread before (Dejavu?).

Contradicting views with good arguments.
Sometimes even beautifully written: http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...7&postcount=23

But now to my point.

I wanted to second Herbalizer:

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Herbalizer

It is happening at lower levels and is affecting far more people.
People are grinding to buy a cool skin. They spend dozens of hours grinding for it. Anet know this will happen when they made the drop rate low. Tons of people grind and grind to get the skin. Then a few months later Anet decide they dont want it to be rare. Is that fair that Anet have done that? Anet should never have made the skin rare in the first place.

This is not about runic blades but about drops rarity.
Another example:

Aureate Aegis

I was spending around two months focused farming and trading to make my PvE Paragon ready to enter pvp...
So i needed a set of 12 shields (com & mot) with the appropiate stats (req9 and 6 x +10 AL vs type of damage).
Of course I wanted to be looking before I die

So the obvious choice (for me) was the Aureate Aegis skin.

I did spent round about 440 K on those shields.
(round 20 K for the skin ... round 15 K for a +30 HP Handle ... round 5 K for the inscription ... one was still missing)

Then I discovered this weekend that the Aureate Aegis skin is a collectors shield in GW:EN

The stats even better: req 9 (motivation) +30HP with inscription slot.

Marduc Snakeslayer hands them over for 5 stone summit emblems, which can be farmed with ease in the Killroy Stoneskin Solo quest.
http://img301.imageshack.us/my.php?i...teaegistx4.jpg
So instead of 440 K and "two months" I would have gotten there with 60 K for the inscriptions and "two days" of knuckle fighting.

Though here I have to contradict Herbalizer:

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Herbalizer

They are driving players away from the game through doing shit like that. Making the skin common to begin with wont piss people off and make them quit.

What I did was let out a long sigh and got the last one in my collection (finally) and even better...
I find my "vs. blunt damage" quickly in my inventory because it is the only one that is not golden

I knew from the beginning I was "wasting" time grinding for vanity in a e-game.

Thanks for your time and heads up,
Timebandit

The Herbalizer · Aug 27, 2007, 04:10 PM // 16:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by arcanemacabre

I can use an example that counters this example - and then you'll see why working for real-life items is different than playing for virtual items.

When the first CD player was introduced onto the market in 1982, it sold for $900 USD. It was big, clunky, and had all sorts of issues, but it was the first. People who bought it were the elite as far as audio was concerned. A few years later, you could buy one for about $200. A few years after that, $50.

Obviously, mass production, better materials, and better technology made it possible for lower prices, and paved the way for everyone to own one. This was clearly a good thing. Not everyone desires a Ferrari F50. If everyone could afford one, few would still own one. Many desire a luxury car, so car companies try hard to release luxury cars at more affordable prices, and they are a huge success.

Anet knows if the masses want something, it must become more readily available. Those who originally acquired that something when it was much harder to get can still say they were "one of the first," or "one of the original," if they so choose. It's a kind of bragging rights.

Now, the biggest problem with these analogies is what I mentioned earlier - this is a game. In real life, we are expected to work hard, or work smart, and earn our wealth. It keeps everything in check. It's a reward in life for an honest living. One of the luxuries we earn is entertainment. A video game is one such luxury. Many of us work the rat race during our everyday lives, and we would like to escape it when we sit down at Guild Wars.

That said, Anet understands this, and tries to appease both groups - those who want to enjoy the game and the goodies it has to offer, and those who want their ultra-rare elite CD players. Having really rare items in the game that eventually become more common is a great way to do that. It means you can't just horde a rare item and expect to have its value frozen. Even that Ferrari will devalue over time simply because you own it. Time makes fools of us all, they say.

Sorry for the long post, I'm a bit tired. I hope it made sense.

If Anet knows the masses all want a certain something and that eventually they will give in to their whining then they should not make that certain item rare in the first place...

All I ask of Anet as they keep doing this is stop adding rare skins which are made common not long after. Just make them common to begin with. It causes a whole lot less hassle, people wont winge because they cannot afford them and people wont winge because yet again their items' value is screwed with.

Your example didnt really work.

Runic Blade - CD Player is more like this: -

CD player is released at $900. Only a few hundred thousand sell. 2 months later the market is flooded with tens of millions of identical CD players for $50 each.

korcan · Aug 27, 2007, 04:30 PM // 16:30

if anet does intend to make hoh only drops "fairly easily" attainable in gwen, why stop at weapons?

how about minis? lol

wtb mini panda 5k

ShadowbaneX · Aug 27, 2007, 04:55 PM // 16:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Herbalizer

CD player is released at $900. Only a few hundred thousand sell. 2 months later the market is flooded with tens of millions of identical CD players for $50 each.

And this is where your example fails. Everyone knows never buy first gen technology. It's always way too expensive and way too buggy. You wait a few months for the supply to build up and for the bugs to be found and worked out. Granted, these are game items so there are no more bugs, but eventually the supply should go up. Basically what you're saying is "I was here first, and I spent alot of money. Other people that have to follow me have to pay as much as I did." That isn't the way the economy normally works. Capitalism and free enterprise and all that fun stuff. You're paying more to have it first. Eventually, it should happen that the prices come down. Look at the PS3s and the XBox. When they first came out there was only a HIGHLY limited supply. People obtained them through various means (HoH) and then resold them for hugh profits (EBay). Eventually more were produced and more people could get them (and the price dropped).

Another point is the PvP influence on PvE. People have been shouting for years to have PvP removed from the purely PvE aspect of Favour. If we follow this trend then why would something that's solely PvE (weapons skins, etc.), be only found in a PvP environment? Put Runic Blades, Dwarven Axes, and whatever else, in PvE zones and actually let the PvE community get them. I play this game for PvE, I've never even tried TA, and I only even got there because I was really, really bored one afternoon. Why should I, as a PvE player have to depend on the PvP community for PvE items, and at extreme expense?

The Herbalizer · Aug 27, 2007, 05:07 PM // 17:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShadowbaneX

And this is where your example fails. Everyone knows never buy first gen technology. It's always way too expensive and way too buggy. You wait a few months for the supply to build up and for the bugs to be found and worked out. Granted, these are game items so there are no more bugs, but eventually the supply should go up. Basically what you're saying is "I was here first, and I spent alot of money. Other people that have to follow me have to pay as much as I did." That isn't the way the economy normally works. Capitalism and free enterprise and all that fun stuff. You're paying more to have it first. Eventually, it should happen that the prices come down. Look at the PS3s and the XBox. When they first came out there was only a HIGHLY limited supply. People obtained them through various means (HoH) and then resold them for hugh profits (EBay). Eventually more were produced and more people could get them (and the price dropped).

Another point is the PvP influence on PvE. People have been shouting for years to have PvP removed from the purely PvE aspect of Favour. If we follow this trend then why would something that's solely PvE (weapons skins, etc.), be only found in a PvP environment? Put Runic Blades, Dwarven Axes, and whatever else, in PvE zones and actually let the PvE community get them. I play this game for PvE, I've never even tried TA, and I only even got there because I was really, really bored one afternoon. Why should I, as a PvE player have to depend on the PvP community for PvE items, and at extreme expense?

I pre-ordered my PS2 so was one of the first to own it. £300 it cost around October or something (I cant remember as many yrs ago). At Easter the price was brought down to £250 I believe. Few months later £200. Do I have a problem with that? No.

What I would have a problem with is: -

I buy the PS2 pre-order for £300 and when it comes to Easter they are £50.

Anet done this with the Runic Blades. They make them rare and costing like 200e. They knew before introducing them that if they are rare they would be desirable. They added them anyway. After adding them they could see hundreds of ecto are changing hands for them. They decide to go ahead with making them a common drop in GWEN. This isnt normal depreciation which GW player's should expect. It was unforeseeable.

Anet make future skins either common or rare. Dont change your mind afterwards please. Is there a problem with asking that? Or unexpected changes fair and a good idea?

Please no more: -

Anet add x skin which is a really rare drop.

The really rare drop due to being rare sells for many hundreds of ecto.

Anet decide a few months later for reasons unknown to us to make it a common drop.

Instead it would be better to: -

Anet add x skin which is a common drop.

*Nothing bad happens, noone complains, no crying etc.*

Its not too hard to ask that.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Would you object to the following regarding PVP only drops?

1/2 the number of Crystallines, Dwarvens etc drop from HoH chest.

The other 1/2 are added as completely random drops in PVE areas.

The same number of Crystalline etc. drop as before but they are also available also to pvers.

Or how about: -

The HoH only skins drop in PVE but only in purple. That way they are cheaper and can be modded to whatever you want. Purple are also waaaaay cheaper than gold thus pleasing the casual gamer.

Purple inscribable Runic Blades would not have been a problem.

Safer Saviour · Aug 27, 2007, 05:31 PM // 17:31

Firstly, Runic blades and Ele swords, from what I've seen are not a common drop. As far as I know they drop only from the Frostmaw's Burrows end chest and even then, only very infrequently. You're overestimating the supply, over half the player based seemed to be doing GWEN this weekend and how many of them got the rare skins?

Secondly, if the items that dropped from that chest were purple, no one would bother with the dungeon and that would ruin the play experience for the casual player.