Curse

DarklingKiller · Jan 16, 2008, 06:00 AM // 06:00

For those having trouble with the end boss, I easily pulled him towards the resurrection shrine. We pulled him past the little flame geyser so you can probably trap him right there and watch as he dies. Pulling greatly helps with those little fireballs rolling around.

tmr819 · Feb 05, 2008, 02:53 PM // 14:53

Just because I am a masochist (what other reason could there be?

), I have been playing around with this dungeon in Normal Mode using various hero/hench combinations. So far the only team configurations I have gotten to work successfully have involved using Great Dwarf Weapon and spamming it relentlessly on my melee heroes/henches to keep Ilsunder, the end boss, knocked down.

In other words Great Dwarf Weapon, plus the teams' own knockdown skills (e.g., Devona plus my warrior Heroes) is the only way I have found to defeat the end boss.

However, this just seems really cheesy to me. It seems like a boss ought to be hero/henchable in Normal Mode without resorting to PvE skills: Ursan, Pain Inverter, Great Dwarf Weapon, etc.

I am just curious if anyone has a Hero/Hench combination that works against this boss that (1) does not involve PvE skills and (2) would work with any Player class.

Maybe that's asking too much. Heh. But this is the ONLY dungeon (excluding Slavers) that I have not been able to complete (always because of the boss -- the rest of the dungeon is fine) using regular in-game skills and an all hero/hench team.

Because of the end boss, Catacombs is much harder than any of the Master's Difficulty dungeons (Rragar's, Shards, and Frostmaw) and that just seems unbalanced to me. Of course, this may be because this end boss is particularly "Hero/hench-team unfriendly": Fire Bombs and giant rolling Fireballs.

I mean, come on.

So, my question is: how would you defeat Ilsunder using Hero/henches and no PvE skills with a team configuration that would work with any class player: warrior, monk, mesmer, etc.?

tmakinen · Feb 05, 2008, 05:49 PM // 17:49

Trivially easy

You need:

4 ranged attackers (set on 'attack')
4 support characters (set on 'avoid fight')

If you're yourself a monk or melee character, you're one of the support characters, otherwise you're one of the ranged attackers.

There are no specific requirements for the ranged attackers except the ability to do damage. All the support characters are Mo/X or X/Mo and bring Vengeance.

One of the ranged attackers aggroes Ilsundur to spawn the flaming balls and lets Ilsundur kill him at the spot. Other ranged attackers run into the balls and die as well. The support characters move to a spot which is about 1.5 aggro ranges away from Ilsundur and not on the path of either ball. The support characters resurrect the attackers at 8 second intervals, and the attackers move between the support characters and Ilsundur and attack. Repeat until Ilsundur dies. If one of the support characters is a MM, he can raise an unending stream of minions as well.

This works because Vengeance resurrects a player at full health and energy for 30 seconds, the recharge of the skill is likewise 30 seconds so you can have a constant duty cycle, dying won't add any DP, and on top of that the resurrected players will have a +25% damage bonus.

This method has been tested to be failsafe in NM and HM alike

tmr819 · Feb 05, 2008, 06:13 PM // 18:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by tmakinen

Trivially easy

You need:

4 ranged attackers (set on 'attack')
4 support characters (set on 'avoid fight')
This method has been tested to be failsafe in NM and HM alike

Interesting method, I must say. However, a single player with three Heroes and four henchmen would not be able to do this.

EDIT: Or ... would it work with three Mo/X or X/Mo Heroes, plus your own Mo/X or X/Mo player character and then use, say, Cynn, Zho, Aidan, and Herta as your ranged attackers?

tmakinen · Feb 05, 2008, 07:26 PM // 19:26

Yes, if you're doing it with H+H then you and your heroes must be the support team, and that restricts the party composition a fair amount since henches are not particularly good in offensive roles and thus the rest of the dungeon will be that much harder. Furthermore, it is not advisable to use AoE against Ilsundur because he will move and possibly aggro the support team. Having 2 real players with heroes is a considerably better option, if available.

In any case, Ilsundur has closer to 40k health in HM so it takes a while to gnaw that away with any method.

cyber88 · Feb 18, 2008, 02:54 AM // 02:54

Any idea how to H+H in HM? Having difficultly in finding grp for it.

bifter · Feb 18, 2008, 10:28 AM // 10:28

Scroll back in this thread for the multi-warrior / great dwarf weapon spam team. Worked for me, although you might want to take some canes or something to help out at the rest of the dungeon. Ilsundur himself was a pushover.

MagmaRed · Feb 18, 2008, 02:51 PM // 14:51

I did this dungeon last night with hero+hench. I used 3 PvE skills, but only 2 of them in the fight against the boss, and one of those was used minimally, and did little. I was R/Mo with Rebirth, PvE skills were LoD, Pain Inverter (which didn't do much), and "I Am The Strongest!".

Took the following hero+hench team:

Dunkoro = HB healer
Norgu = Migrain
Gwen = Hex Eater Vortex
Lina
Eve
Herta
Zho

I was a Broadhead Arrow build, so we had lots of interrupts. The boss wiped me once, and the fire balls wiped my team 2 times. I had more trouble getting to the boss than I did beating the boss. I used 2 Powerstones, 1 Armor, and 2 Essences.

Marverick · Feb 18, 2008, 03:26 PM // 15:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by tmakinen

Yes, if you're doing it with H+H then you and your heroes must be the support team, and that restricts the party composition a fair amount since henches are not particularly good in offensive roles and thus the rest of the dungeon will be that much harder. Furthermore, it is not advisable to use AoE against Ilsundur because he will move and possibly aggro the support team. Having 2 real players with heroes is a considerably better option, if available.

In any case, Ilsundur has closer to 40k health in HM so it takes a while to gnaw that away with any method.

Well if you take a SP sin or something to spike with you can chip off 600 damage every 8 seconds so it's only a little over a minute. Plus the sin KD's Ilsundur so he won't die before finishing the chain.

The Meth · Feb 18, 2008, 04:54 PM // 16:54

This dungeon just really stresses different skills. Where most of the rest of the game running X overpowering build will allow you to steamroll anything, in here you have to watch your positioning a lot more unless you take 100% shutdown of some kind.

For Ilsundur himself if you have very good flagging/micro, the only real problem is firebomb, since melee henchies will stupidly run back to the group and nuke the whole thing, so if the boss follows up with another aoe spike you go down fast. Otherwise he doesn't have that much more damage then other nuke bosses, just have to remember to avoid the balls of fire.

Cherng Butter · Feb 18, 2008, 10:25 PM // 22:25

[skill]Dragon Slash[/skill] + Brawling Headbutt + [skill]Steelfang Slash[/skill]

Kept him knocklocked the whole time (though this was with Alliance members), I think we had a couple deaths due to not watching the balls.

I also used knock lock against the Flame Djinn, I had agroed it w/o my teammates explaining to me that we should body block it, so I just knocked it down over and over instead :P

This was in HM

And are end-bosses immune to Daze?

cyber88 · Feb 19, 2008, 04:23 AM // 04:23

Interesting posts...I play a primary monk & usually H+H as the pugs looking for a monk is not doing catacombs. *cough* temple *cough* I run a signet smiter (bane, castaigon & SOJ) with breath, RoD, imp summom, banish & PI.

Any suggestions for my prof as the suggestions r usually for rangers, necs & eles. help appreciated.

tmr819 · Feb 19, 2008, 01:12 PM // 13:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by cyber88

Interesting posts...I play a primary monk & usually H+H as the pugs looking for a monk is not doing catacombs. *cough* temple *cough* I run a signet smiter (bane, castaigon & SOJ) with breath, RoD, imp summom, banish & PI.

Any suggestions for my prof as the suggestions r usually for rangers, necs & eles. help appreciated.

Well, I would recommend the two warrior/one paragon setup suggested by The Meth at the top of page 6 of this thread. It's a good combination. Just be sure to bring Great Dwarf Weapon to back the warriors up and some extra healing might be good.

You might also try my "mesmerized" modification of this build on page 7, but I am not sure this combination would work in Hard Mode, since I have only used it for Normal Mode.

Brian Fellow · Feb 19, 2008, 09:01 PM // 21:01

Wow a vengeance team build involving heavy amounts of dying LOL!

cyber88 · Feb 20, 2008, 06:16 AM // 06:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by tmr819

Well, I would recommend the two warrior/one paragon setup suggested by The Meth at the top of page 6 of this thread. It's a good combination. Just be sure to bring Great Dwarf Weapon to back the warriors up and some extra healing might be good.

You might also try my "mesmerized" modification of this build on page 7, but I am not sure this combination would work in Hard Mode, since I have only used it for Normal Mode.

Hmmzzz.....interesting. Will give it a go tonite. btw for the becalmed djinns, if the H/H goes into aggro range to them, will they automatically attack them or they will attack when i attack?

tmr819 · Feb 20, 2008, 01:07 PM // 13:07

The becalmed djinn will not attack unless you attack them first. If you are careful in pulling the bugs off to the side, you are less likely to have the djinn anywhere near. I have gotten to know these rooms pretty well and can usually clear both rooms of bugs without drawing in the djinn.

The djinn get aggroed if they are attacked directly or if an aoe gets set off (against the bugs) that also hits a djinn. Heroes and henches with any kind of aoe (like Cynn) will almost always get the djinn involved.

Still, it's better to get as many bug groups as you can before that happens, since they get buffed and also get really aggressive once a djinn gets mad -- and who needs that?

I usually clear the bugs first and then all the djinn (just because red dots just have to die in my opinion

) Then I go near the door at the end to spawn the Boss Flame Djinn (with the key to the next section). I don't like having the other djinn around when I'm fighting him.

Hope it goes well for you. Personally, I really hate this particular dungeon.

h9dlb · Feb 20, 2008, 11:22 PM // 23:22

I hate it too - I struggle just to get through the forest

Miska Bow · Feb 22, 2008, 04:33 AM // 04:33

Just been there. i can live with a Dungeon boss with 4 gazillion HP. I can live with the rolling balls of fire. I can live with a boss throwing fire bombs. But not all at the same time.

Ressing 24 1/2 miles away from the boss is a major problem. the res shrine just behind the last wurm is totally unnecessary. I dont mind dungeons if they are hard. But this one the devs went overboard.

A word to the devs who design this one. I would very much like you to take me in this one and kill the boss in front of me with no dev god mode.

Shard of Orr is a walk in the park compare to this.

Hengist Meldanash · Feb 26, 2008, 05:34 PM // 17:34

I agree heartfully to all of you who had a terrible nightmare in this dungeon...

I decided yesterday night to start working once again on filling up my dungeon book in NM, and thought, well let's start with the first one (I would rather have changed my mind if I had read this thread first)...

So I prepared myseld, W/El conjure (water)/cripslash build, Norgu as powerblock / interrupt, Tahlkora as protect / anti-burning, Razah as restauration support / warder (against harm) and some henchies Mhenlo, Herta, Zho and Eve.

Making my way to the forest was a walk in the park (quite boring in fact), the forest was easy so I thought the dungeon should be a breeze, and it was until I arrived with +10% bonus on all party in front of the BOSS...

I will pass here all the details concerning party wipes, frustration, rolling fireballs, etc...
So after half an hour struggling to find a way to drop the boss health under 9/10th, I resigned and searched today for hints here. It seems really that the only way to do it is contant knockdown, as fire warding and interrupt do not make it.

I feel like it would be a long time before I try again this dungeon, playing in PvE should be fun, specially in NM, but I found this rather frustrating and irritating to be forced to resign after reaching the final level of this dungeon, it ruined my evening in fact...

Thanks for all the tips in there.
Cheers.
Hengist

stigtorp · Feb 27, 2008, 02:12 PM // 14:12

Hi!

Finally I have found a way to H/H this dungoen in NM mode

The Team was:
NMe (Human): Pain Inverter, Migrene (elite), Conjure Nightmare, cry of pain, arcane echo, Hex eater signet, Hexers Vigour, and Breath of the great Dwarf

N/Rt (Master of Wispers): SABs Healing Ritualist. (see triple necro Vanquishing by SAB)

R/Me (Magrid the Sly): Rapid Fire, Broad Head Arrow (Elite), Epidemic, Distarcting Shot, Disrupting Shot, Savage Shot, Mantra of Flame, Whirling defense (optional)

W/Rt (Koss): Flail, Weapon of Warding, Skull Crack (Elite), Savage Slash, Galrath Slash, Gash, Final Trust, Death pact signet

The Henchies where:
Lo Sha
Mhleo
Devona
Thalon Silverwing

This build did not cause me any trouble getting to the boss. And as long as I avoided the rolling fireballs this was a walk in the park...
The tactic was:
1. Set BHA to be the first Ranger attack
2. Cast Migren while Calling Boss Target.
3. Stay almost on top of Islandur (to avoid the rolling balls)
4. Use Migrene, BHA and interupts to keep him from Casting spells
5. Follow up with Conjure Nightmare, and Cry of Pain, when available.

Hope others now can kill this Boss a little easier...
I would really appriciate if let me know if this works for you.

^Miss^