Curse

Tharg · Dec 29, 2008, 04:43 PM // 16:43

I notice a lot of people running HM dungeons with a monk and one or two heroes and I took a run to see how they do it. I guess they use a team build with a tank Monk and one or two (smiter) heroes. They have the heroes keep enchantments on them and flag them way back, out of aggro.

I'd like to try myself (not running, just doing the dungeons this way), so I went to PvXwiki and found several builds for a team 600:
- CoF 600 / Smite
- 600 Famine / Smite
- 600 Rit / Smite (not preferred since I play a monk)
- 600 Smite / FoW
- 600 Smite / UW

Which version will work best in the HM dungeons? I realize that they are based on the same concept but there must some advantages and disadvantages.

Please help me understand how it works. I would act as the Mo/Me tank and the smiter hero(es) just keep the enchants on me. How do I actually get enough DPS to kill the monsters? This all goes via Holy Wrath and retribution - that's it? So if the Monk tank has a totem axe for the 20% enchant, he actually does not attack with it?

The hero does not run out of energy due to Holy Wrath? Or does this require some micro management? If you put Holy Wrath on a hero that maintains 3 other enchantments, he loses all energy regen. Combine that with Holy Wrath and he is out of energy before you know it.

If you flag the heroes away from aggro, can they still use spells like Blood is Power? Or Signet of Judgement for that matter? How close do you need to flag the heroes?

Again, PvXwiki has a lot of information but I would like to hear from someone who actually has done it.

Ratman · Dec 29, 2008, 05:47 PM // 17:47

For practice is the CoF 600/smite a good build.

As for your questions regarding the energie management of the smiter.
It's true that he/she will run out of energie in no time.
But, even with 0 energie you can mantain the enchantmends.
And if you need to cast BiP you'll have to wait till your out of battle and use Blessed Signet.
This will give you 3 energie which is enough to cast BiP.

My advise first let someone else run you and watch what he/she is doing and try to remember the route.

(You can get CoF runs in Doomlore Shrine in GW:EN it'll cost you around 2k but if you take the quest you'll earn it back.

big bubba monk · Dec 29, 2008, 06:02 PM // 18:02

what he said but ask the 600 to wait at portal for a min and open ur map up and take a screen shot of the routes u need to go. thats how i learned to do CoF SoO and Ooze. none of the dungeons are hard to do just takes good timing and alot of practice

Tommy's · Dec 30, 2008, 01:04 PM // 13:04

I think this would help you out

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10325415

The idea about 600/smite is very simple. The 600 is to stay alive and the smiter is to dmg via the 600hp. 600hp has like 750+hp with enchantments on, has minimum armor so he takes the maximum dmg. Because of protective spirit he takes only 10% of his health, which is still quite alot. But everytime you get dmged spirit bond heals you. You got the enchantments Retribution and Holy Wrath on you (always retrib first, cause of some foes have reversal of dmg) which kills the mobs as they attack you.

Thats the basics of every 600/smite build I know. Then the builds change little as you often need SpellBreaker so that the foes cant remove your enchantment/to kill ele's etc faster. Also in some area's you need other things, so you add another hero, like in SoO. It just depends on which area you want.

But if you are just going to run to get the legendary master of the north points, you are deffinatly (is this word correct?) wasting your time, because it takes some time to learn the dungeon and be able to do it. You can better learn one, like SoO or Gragars or w/e, get alot of monney from running people in there, and pay to get a run in the others. It will save alot of your time.

To answer your questions:
-BiP only needs 1 energy, so outside battle, your hero casts Blessed Signet has 3 energy and can BiP you. Once you enter the battle you wont be able to get any BiP. Best is to begin casting your enchantments, let the hero BiP you during you are casting your enchantments, and enter battle while still having +4energyregen.
-Flag your heroes as far away as you want, if you dont need Purge Signet or any spirits to be in range or w/e. Remember that if you take a big mob of melee attacks, some agro will scatter and they will run away from you, sometimes towards your heroes. Be sure you flagged them far enough.
-Signet of Judgement is as far as I know used in FoW (at least with the builds I use) and its better to get a real player for that. It's able to do it with a hero, but heroes tend to do weird things often, which might get your smiter killed, which messes up your run and your time, better go with a real person. Same goes for UW, better get a real person, certainly if your a beginner.
-About the DPS you are asking about. In CoF SoO and alot more places, there are undead. As holy wrath and retribution deal holy dmg, they get double dmg from these sorces which makes them die very quickly. Also in HM foes attack very quick which makes them die quicker.

Hope I helped

Tharg · Dec 30, 2008, 02:38 PM // 14:38

this is great - thank you so much.

I had experimented a bit, taking 3 monk smiting heroes and dividing the enchantments amongst them. I also added a bunch of other enchantments as well. Where I went wrong is that I kept my normal level 60 armor (too lazy to get new low level armor). I guess that messed up Spirit Bond (SB) since I did not get a minimum of 60 damage. I assume that SB works per attack and not cumulatively? So for each of the next 10 attacks if any of the attacks has a minimum 60 damage you get healed.

Tharg · Dec 30, 2008, 02:51 PM // 14:51

this is great - thank you so much.

I had experimented a bit, taking 3 monk smiting heroes and dividing the enchantments amongst them. I also added a bunch of other enchantments as well. Where I went wrong is that I kept my normal level 60 armor (too lazy to get new low level armor). I guess that messed up Spirit Bond (SB) since I did not get a minimum of 60 damage. I assume that SB works per attack and not cumulatively? So for each of the next 10 attacks if any of the attacks has a minimum 60 damage you get healed.

Sacratus Ignis · Dec 31, 2008, 12:10 AM // 00:10

spirit bond triggers any time you take enough damage... and yes you need lower AL or the whole build is epic fail. It costs like 1k to make a noob armor set lol

Nightow · Dec 31, 2008, 12:35 AM // 00:35

Is the 600/Smite Monk version that much different from the 600 Rit / Smite that they absolutely, positively need BiP for the tank? I've 600 Rit / Smite complete areas and some dungeons and after the first times running it, I found that BiP/BR was useless outside of someone using it on the smiter in between mobs but even then, it wasn't absolutely necessary. IMHO, [Shield of Absorption] + bonds = energy mgmt. for the tank

If anybody is wondering, this is the customized 600 Rit / Smite I usually run with:
[build=OAOj8whM5QWMrl1DaR3VhE0D6DA]
[build=OwUTEM3C5IipskAEf5TegA]

MercenaryKnight · Dec 31, 2008, 04:43 AM // 04:43

The only part I don't like about the rit is always having to rely on the smiter to regain energy and cast spellbreaker on just about any and all mobs (I mainly do cof runs). It is usually too tedious for me and a pain to always have to wait for smiter to cast sig and then spellbreaker.

I prefer mo/x with spellbreaker on the 600 just because I don't need to wait for smiter to get their energy and breaker me all the time.

And yes, blood is power and blood ritual are not needed. The only reason you may need it would be because of a death which you'll be regening anyway. Take a self sustaining healer and ask someone else to go /necro with blood ritual or bip just in case.

Nightow · Dec 31, 2008, 03:18 PM // 15:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by MercenaryKnight

The only part I don't like about the rit is always having to rely on the smiter to regain energy and cast spellbreaker on just about any and all mobs (I mainly do cof runs). It is usually too tedious for me and a pain to always have to wait for smiter to cast sig and then spellbreaker.

Well, there's two things you can do to help with this.

1) Disable blessed sig and have the hero use it manually after a mob.
2) While everyone is getting ready for the run, kindly ask if anyone could bring [blood ritual], [blood is power] or [song of power]. If they agree to bring it with them, give them a couple hundred g off or something.

Incandecree · Jan 01, 2009, 01:29 AM // 01:29

I have three different smiter set-ups that are my "normal"

all three have:
Balthazar's Spirit
Retribution
Holy Wrath
Vital Blessing

Mesmer smiter: 16 in illusion
Signet of Illusions
Rebirth

Mo/W smiter: 16 in smite; 15 in prot; 6 in Tactics (16/14 on a hero)
Unyielding Aura (not maintained)
Healing Signet

Mo/P smiter: 16 in smite; 15 in prot; 6 in motivation
I Am The Strongest
Signet of Aggression
Energizing Chorus
By Ural's Hammer