Curse

Revan Soulbreaker · Nov 07, 2007, 10:50 PM // 22:50

Anet has major issues, but I'm not gonna start flaming about it in this thread. But I agree with DTS and Strokey.

Balance the game, dont Nerf everything cause its not the same as balancing.

Norrin · Nov 08, 2007, 04:01 AM // 04:01

It's impossible to balance without nerfing, just picture a scale in your head.

ducktape · Nov 08, 2007, 08:26 PM // 20:26

Ugh, nerf coming soon? :/

I've been avoiding vanquishing stuff and have been farming reputation points instead, but I suppose I should go vanquish some of the more annoying areas while this build is still as strong. Does anyone have any advice as to what really sucky areas I should go clear out ASAP before the nerfbat arrives? I know the four-man areas are supposed to be the most difficult, but if there are any other difficult areas this build especially kicks ass at for vanquishing I'd like to go do them while it's still enjoyable with this build.

RTSFirebat · Nov 09, 2007, 08:43 AM // 08:43

Tired of reading posts about who made what? No one cares... I've deleted it all and any further posts about this being a HA build or whatever are going to get deleted and user noted. No further warnings will be given.

yesitsrob · Nov 09, 2007, 02:18 PM // 14:18

Soul Reaping is the underlying balance issue here, and I think any other balance to this build other than soul reaping would be crazy, because none of the skills are that overpowered. Perhaps Soul Reaping shouldn't work on spirits... though considering how long people have said that (like way back when EW FoC spiked months and months ago

) I can see Izzy being very reluctant to doing what it correct. And Jagged Bones should never have been made, pretty big mistake there.

I guess it might be worth looking at how good the heroes are with the ashes, they are so fast at dropping kaolai you sometimes won't even see the bars drop. The ashes themselves are far from overpowered though

bungusmaximus · Nov 09, 2007, 03:00 PM // 15:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by yesitsrob

Soul Reaping is the underlying balance issue here, and I think any other balance to this build other than soul reaping would be crazy, because none of the skills are that overpowered. Perhaps Soul Reaping shouldn't work on spirits... though considering how long people have said that (like way back when EW FoC spiked months and months ago

) I can see Izzy being very reluctant to doing what it correct. And Jagged Bones should never have been made, pretty big mistake there.

I guess it might be worth looking at how good the heroes are with the ashes, they are so fast at dropping kaolai you sometimes won't even see the bars drop. The ashes themselves are far from overpowered though

Hmm the fact ritualists heal for a crap load while only investing 8-9 in restoration magic has something to do with it as well. Dropping SR from spirits wouldn't hurt this build. It would be good for balance, that's probably why everyone and his granny is suggesting that. I am most surprised aNet didn't nerf it that way as it is the most perfect solution you could think of.

Vinraith · Nov 09, 2007, 06:52 PM // 18:52

Also wanted to chime in and thank Sab for this build. I used a variant of it for Glint's Challenge to remarkable effect along with my own condition necro. I'm always loathe to use other people's build designs without understanding them in a complete enough way that I feel confident retooling them myself, though. As I understand it (and please correct me if I'm wrong) the fundamental elements that make this thing work are:

1) MM minion bombing with JB results in an enormous amount of death, fueling SR for all three characters. It also spreads bleeding and disease throughout enemy mobs, and Barbs from the Curse necro amplifies the physical damage output of the minion swarm.

2) The N/Rt healer uses this pool of energy to continuously cast Resto spells thus providing an inordinate amount of healing and a bit of protection despite the skills all being off-primary and thus runeless.

3) SS does what SS always does.

I'm not tremendously familiar with Rits, so if I'm missing something let me know. I'm particularly curious about the prot spells on the MM. Those are an anti-spike measure, I gather, because the resto line doesn't really provide for that kind of thing?

Furthermore, am I right in thinking that the SS's only "synergy" with the other two is barbs for the minions and, of course, the infinite energy supply from the minions? It seems like, conceptually, there's a lot of room for skill flexibility here outside of the JB minion skills (to keep the engine going). Is that right?

mcsumo · Nov 09, 2007, 07:21 PM // 19:21

You are pretty much spot on with your summaries of the synergy and individual skill. The N/any has enough energy coming in from the minions to do whatever they like.

A secondary Rit healer is generally much more effective than a secondary Mo healer. Largely because a Monks healing skills are 'buffed' further by Divine Favour bonus.

Originally the 2 'spare' slots on the MM build were duplicates of Spirit Light and Mend Body and Soul, but Sab changed that somewhere along the line deciding that Aegis and Prot Spirit provided mnore utility.

The curses Nec is the most changeable bar. Barbs is a must with minions, SS is .... well..... just the best really. The rest can be changed depending on preference/available skills/location. Sab actually stated in a post, that 2 of the skills were just 'meh'.

This is what my curses ended up as,

[skill]Spiteful Spirit[/skill][skill]Reckless Haste[/skill][skill]Mark of Pain[/skill][skill]Barbs[/skill][skill]Price of Failure[/skill][skill]Enfeebling Blood[/skill][skill]Signet of Lost Souls[/skill][skill]Death Pact Signet[/skill]

Where there is a lot of enchant hate I still use rit skills on the MM. Just change what works for you.

Vinraith · Nov 09, 2007, 07:38 PM // 19:38

Thanks mcsumo, I appreciate the confirmation and clarification. I feel reasonably well equipped to tweak now.

Vamis Threen · Nov 10, 2007, 06:08 PM // 18:08

I just want to thank to the OP and Sab for sharing/creating this amazing build. As far as I'm concerned it really is the holy grail of Hero Team builds; builds which heroes can run (common enough I suppose), which are not just sub-par but great (rare), and additionally synergise with each other (unheard-of, by me anyway).

I just now finished Rragar's menagerie in HM with H/H, which I had just about given up on. It was still hard but at least it was possible.

Fantastic work, guys.

Gigashadow · Nov 13, 2007, 07:32 PM // 19:32

I've switched to using Weaken Armor instead of Insidious Parasite, now that weaken is 5e, applies cracked armor (applies to both physical and elemental damage, unlike the old weaken armor), and has a quick recast. I was never a big fan of Insidious Parasite, it's expensive and the health gain part may be wasted.

Cracked armor benefits the minions, any damage casters you happen to have around (I usually use the earth and fire eles), as well as yourself depending on what you are playing.

Skuld · Nov 13, 2007, 09:41 PM // 21:41

I use Splinter Weapon and Warmonger's Weapon on the SS.

thunderai · Nov 14, 2007, 02:44 AM // 02:44

With the latest skill balance has this build seen the end of days?

Jamison0071 · Nov 14, 2007, 03:43 AM // 03:43

It's only the spirits, in PVE there is already enough corpses.

Sab · Nov 14, 2007, 04:29 AM // 04:29

I expected Soul Reaping to be nerfed a lot harder, but the only thing that's changed is that you won't get the 10e back from Life.

Avatar Exico · Nov 14, 2007, 04:30 AM // 04:30

ya but the pets I used for my build in my runs is now gone. Nerf my build. This is making me mad. They make changes just for pvp and never leave PvE alone. Im about to Cry for Pets.

Arkantos · Nov 14, 2007, 04:35 AM // 04:35

The SR nerf barely affects the build seeing as theres only 1 spirit in the build.

RTSFirebat · Nov 14, 2007, 08:41 AM // 08:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arkantos

The SR nerf barely affects the build seeing as theres only 1 spirit in the build.

QFT... this update changes nothing for this build.

blue.rellik · Nov 14, 2007, 08:44 AM // 08:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Avatar Exico

ya but the pets I used for my build in my runs is now gone. Nerf my build. This is making me mad. They make changes just for pvp and never leave PvE alone. Im about to Cry for Pets.

If your builds success depended on the ability to molest your pet's corpse then.....well *ahem*

Yeah.

bungusmaximus · Nov 14, 2007, 12:04 PM // 12:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by blue.rellik

If your builds success depended on the ability to molest your pet's corpse then.....well *ahem*

Yeah.

I didn't try it yet, but I'm pretty sure the build isn't hurt beyond repair.