Curse

CrAzZyKiLLa · Nov 15, 2006, 09:41 AM // 09:41

this missiong is so annoying ive been stuck there 2 WEEKS now!!!

Riotact · Nov 15, 2006, 10:15 AM // 10:15

the harder it is the better the satisfation. dont change this mission and eventually everyone will know their job and what to do.
its 1 of the few missions where patience and team works is really required.

Dr Imperial · Nov 15, 2006, 12:21 PM // 12:21

just beat it yesterday. I was set for some major tanking with glads defense, riposte, deadly riposte, dolyak, shield stance, WB, and rebirth. We had an SV, a nuker, two REAL monks, another tank, dervish, and more.

Got to shiro easy. I just tanked while the others casted. For the two bosses part, we killed the lich first. (duh :P) and then we had one tank in the back, tank shiro with a monk healing him, while the rest of us capped the shrines. (they really help) After we capped everything we went for shiro. Of course the first 2/3 are easy. But then when Impossible Odds came we were actually fine because there was just like one tank near him when he cast it. I think we had one death from a reckless ele who went up to him when he cast IO but it wasnt bad. Good luck everyone else!

Lykan · Nov 15, 2006, 01:07 PM // 13:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Batou of Nine

So i have tried EVERY counter and build in the book, why can't i kill this guy? Oh that's right, Impossible Odds.
</>
So what ARE these so called "Oh, Shiro was so easy" methods?

....

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Imperial

But then when Impossible Odds came we were actually fine because there was just like one tank near him when he cast it. I think we had one death from a reckless ele who went up to him when he cast IO but it wasnt bad. Good luck everyone else!

Simple answer, dont be near him when he uses IO. You actually have an advantage with hero's because you can stand them anywhere you want, something you cant do with pugs. If you cant tank him get someone who can, guildie, friend, random wammo.

jackwooly · Nov 15, 2006, 06:18 PM // 18:18

Just let the tank go in and peg your henchies back out of his aggro circle and you should be fine.

What does IO actually do? I never really noticed it's effect when I was doing the mission. :\

Son of Urza · Nov 15, 2006, 06:32 PM // 18:32

Causes his attacks to double strike 100% of the time (I think), spread all conditions on him to struck foes, and hit ALL foes near him. Very nasty with inexperienced groups that gather around him- he can wipe the entire party quickly if you're not careful and he's not blinded.

If your tank's the only one next to him, however, it doesn't really do all that much.

twentynine · Nov 15, 2006, 06:43 PM // 18:43

Shiro doesn't move when he does his IO sequence. I tanked him as a wammo with zero stances and simply moved away when I couldn't take anymore IO hits. I would just heal myself quickly and reengage when I was ready. In retrospect, I would've brought some actual stances and shouts lol.

A friend and I duoed this with our pool of heroes over the weekend and got a master rank. All we needed was someone with a stance cancel (me with Wild Blow), a necro with SV (Olias) and a good back line full of support, healers and ranged attackers. We also brought an extra necro for MM duty and Koss as another meat shield.

Shiro really isn't that hard, but WB and SV aren't invincible. You still need to be on the ball with coordination and positioning.

Batou of Nine · Nov 15, 2006, 08:32 PM // 20:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lykan

....

Simple answer, dont be near him when he uses IO. You actually have an advantage with hero's because you can stand them anywhere you want, something you cant do with pugs. If you cant tank him get someone who can, guildie, friend, random wammo.

Ok, great 3 replies now with "Oh, just let only one tank near him." Since when does the new Ai only attack one target? If i have forgotten to mention in my first post, I ALWAYS anchored my heroes/henchies a good distance away from Shiro, yet EVERY time he comes running for the casters without tanking on me only. For example, i am at the top of the stairs while tanking him, and have ALL my party anchored (waypoint) at the bottom of the stairs within range to cast spells, but far enough away that Shiro wont automatically go for them. However, EVERY stinking time i get him to 1/4 hp, he breaks off aggro from me, and sprints towards the others and immedietly uses IO.

Every freaking time... I have changed the distance to which i keep the others, but it hasn't changed the outcome. I even tried moving the party OUTSIDE the gates right before Shiro would hit the 1/4 hp mark. And SUURRREEE enough, even with that distance he runs out to them and starts nuking with IO.

Either God hates me, or you all are VERY lucky with Shiro's Ai. Cause simply put, as i said in the first post: I HAVE TRIED EVERYTHING IN THE BOOK!.

cheers.

gestalt · Nov 15, 2006, 08:56 PM // 20:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Batou of Nine

Ok, great 3 replies now with "Oh, just let only one tank near him." Since when does the new Ai only attack one target? If i have forgotten to mention in my first post, I ALWAYS anchored my heroes/henchies a good distance away from Shiro, yet EVERY time he comes running for the casters without tanking on me only. For example, i am at the top of the stairs while tanking him, and have ALL my party anchored (waypoint) at the bottom of the stairs within range to cast spells, but far enough away that Shiro wont automatically go for them. However, EVERY stinking time i get him to 1/4 hp, he breaks off aggro from me, and sprints towards the others and immedietly uses IO.

Every freaking time... I have changed the distance to which i keep the others, but it hasn't changed the outcome. I even tried moving the party OUTSIDE the gates right before Shiro would hit the 1/4 hp mark. And SUURRREEE enough, even with that distance he runs out to them and starts nuking with IO.

Either God hates me, or you all are VERY lucky with Shiro's Ai. Cause simply put, as i said in the first post: I HAVE TRIED EVERYTHING IN THE BOOK!.

cheers.

Once he got low and stopped using Riposting Shadows he stuck to my tank like glue.

twentynine · Nov 15, 2006, 10:13 PM // 22:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Batou of Nine

Ok, great 3 replies now with "Oh, just let only one tank near him." Since when does the new Ai only attack one target? If i have forgotten to mention in my first post, I ALWAYS anchored my heroes/henchies a good distance away from Shiro, yet EVERY time he comes running for the casters without tanking on me only. For example, i am at the top of the stairs while tanking him, and have ALL my party anchored (waypoint) at the bottom of the stairs within range to cast spells, but far enough away that Shiro wont automatically go for them. However, EVERY stinking time i get him to 1/4 hp, he breaks off aggro from me, and sprints towards the others and immedietly uses IO.

Every freaking time... I have changed the distance to which i keep the others, but it hasn't changed the outcome. I even tried moving the party OUTSIDE the gates right before Shiro would hit the 1/4 hp mark. And SUURRREEE enough, even with that distance he runs out to them and starts nuking with IO.

Either God hates me, or you all are VERY lucky with Shiro's Ai. Cause simply put, as i said in the first post: I HAVE TRIED EVERYTHING IN THE BOOK!.

cheers.

It helps if your tank is human. I'm an obsessive body blocker and my friend that was managing the other half of our hero pool was doing a great job kiting Shiro in my direction. I usually just got in front of Shiro and axe spiked him like mad until he decided to stick to me. It worked more often than not.

Planting your group in one spot for the entire encounter is bad. Making sure they get the heck out of dodge when Shiro comes calling is good.

Batou of Nine · Nov 15, 2006, 10:16 PM // 22:16

Ok just beat it. I was setup as a Earth Dervish tank and was able to take lots of punishment. However, he NEVER stuck on me. I was constantly chasing him, and repositioning my hero/henchy party, trying to get them away from him.

Once i got him to 1/4 life, i still couldn't get him to hold still, so i simply staggered my party at safe distances. Positioned henchies at one spot and each hero at a different spot so if Shiro went after one, i'd have the retreat, and Shiro every so often would refocus on me. Took forever, but eventually killed him.

I still have no clue how EVERYone but me seems to have been able to get him to stick on one tank (Me). Oh well, i beat it. No thanks to this thread. LoL, but yall can't be blamed for some freak behavior i experienced..

TY anyway yall!
cheers!

llsektorll · Nov 16, 2006, 12:37 AM // 00:37

after doing this mission over 35 times... i've come to the realization of how easy this mission really is.... eventually people will get to that point too... until then... money..money...money..[in a squeeky voice] MONEY!!!!

AW Lore · Nov 16, 2006, 01:19 AM // 01:19

well, its not exactly a cake walk, but i managed to defeat this mission.

Shiro loves to over extend, moreso than than the lich, first time (when i finally succeded completing this mission) i went in first, hero monk behind me, i was trying to get a hold of shiro and the lich, but i positioned the monk wrong and he was unable to heal me.

then the two of them run to the henchies and wreack havoc among them, i managed to get one of them to res me and pull back and away from them.

it was:
me (w/mo (oh noes

) )
tahlkora (prot)
mhenlo
khim
Herta

zhed and olias were dead, after pounding a bit on shiro i went in and rebirthed zhed and pulled back, shiro was coming at us and then heading back to the center, so i kept pulling him, to the outside, at what it seemed to be his "allowed range" to be away from the center, whenever he dark riposted to the middle of the henchie group he would go to the center, eventually he tried to go to the middle, but was close to the wall, so i bodyblocked him... and he didnt move... didnt attack.

slowly and steadily me and the other henchies started to hit him like if there was no tomorrow, and all what shiro did was spam the battle scars without actually doing anything, then he used impossible odds and i thought i was done for... 10 seconds later he used again... and again... and he never attacked me, and eventually we killed him.

the lich was little trouble other than for the dp the first fight inflicted on us, so i didnt wanted to risk trying to split and cap the shrines so i just killed him.

hope Anet doesnt fix that "allowed ranged" so i can pull it again with my other chars

Dr Imperial · Nov 16, 2006, 01:57 AM // 01:57

nice...I don't think I could do this with just Heros/Henchman....for one not all my heros are at 20, and 2, i just dont think i could handle messing around with what they're doing, while at the same time tanking. But yay i got my primevel armor today and its sweet. (hehe my avatar shows it) but man its spiky.

MaglorD · Nov 16, 2006, 03:22 AM // 03:22

IMO, this mission was designed by Anet to show ppl the limitation of using heroes/henchies only. It can be done with heroes/henchies but it's extremely unpredictable.

I have taken four of my characters through Nightfall in the following order - dervish, warrior, paragon and ranger. I heroed/henched Madness with my dervish, warrior and paragon. When NF was first released, the AI was such that it always targets the character with the highest AL, so if you fight Shiro, he will always gravitate towards your tank unless reposting shadows causes him to teleport to someone else. But he goes back to attacking the tank. If the tank dies and is ressed, it's back to attacking the tank.

Sometime later, they changed the AI and Shiro nows attacks squishes as well. So this made Shiro a lot harder than initially.

The biggest problem is the skill Impossible Odds(IO). All squishes, especially monks, should stay out range when he does IO and warriors should come with stances to reduce damage from IO. Shiro should go down eventually as long as IO damage is minimised. Damage dealers should continue hitting him and warriors should use Wild Blow to stop him from healing.

With a hench/hero group, it's hard to control the henchies/heroes effectively to prevent a wipe when he uses IO since he runs around and attacks squishes whereas he used to only focus on warriors.

Edit: Corrected some misinfo on riposting shadows.

IIIPowerIII · Nov 16, 2006, 03:39 AM // 03:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by llsektorll

after doing this mission over 35 times... i've come to the realization of how easy this mission really is.... eventually people will get to that point too... until then... money..money...money..[in a squeeky voice] MONEY!!!!

haha yup...

doing it with 6 hench and 1 customer make it so easy :P I think it would be even a piece of cake with 5 hench and 2 afk ppl :P

Glevi · Nov 16, 2006, 03:58 AM // 03:58

So, when are you runners available and how much do you charge. I can not micromanage, so hero-hench use is out and I've beent rying on this mission for three days with no luck. I'm playing a Fire/Water ele using Elemental attunement and glyph of lesser energy as energy management, with a monk secodnary just for rebirth.

bamm bamm bamm · Nov 16, 2006, 04:01 AM // 04:01

I don't know what all the fuss is about. When we did it (a pug) we took out the Lich and then went after the margonites. Shiro spent his entire time attacking the other monk, but he doesn't seem to actually have anything in the way of damage output until you attack him back, so that was hunky dorey. I was expecting full groups of margonites, but nothing so challenging it turns out. The margonites fall, Shiro kills our dervish twice with impossible odds, the end. No super special team build required. I thought Jennur's Horde, Dzagonur Bastion and Gate of Pain were all harder.

MaglorD · Nov 16, 2006, 04:16 AM // 04:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by AW Lore

slowly and steadily me and the other henchies started to hit him like if there was no tomorrow, and all what shiro did was spam the battle scars without actually doing anything, then he used impossible odds and i thought i was done for... 10 seconds later he used again... and again... and he never attacked me, and eventually we killed him.

Very interesting. Did he not use riposting shadows at all?

Sasuke The Betrayer · Nov 16, 2006, 04:27 AM // 04:27

Spoil Victor does help, but I see that impossible odds ends it. You need to just immediately put up spoil victor back as fast as you can
Btw. I've done this mission twice now and this is what's happened so far

My paragon-
I somehow managed to aggro shiro alone. Spoil Victor wiped him, and Lich was a pushover afterwards.

My Necromancer-
Spoil Victor, messed up as his impossible odds, but then shiro teleports into the corner where my Koss is locked on to him and has his covered. Shiro doesn't teleport out again, and continues to attack my Koss until he has so little hp that spoil victor doesn't work. We kill with minor spells and attacks.