Curse

adugabutt · May 12, 2005, 11:12 PM // 23:12

I understand that about 90% of the people who play rangers are not very good, but isn't that true for W/Mo's too? It's just that I think it's easier to play W/Mo than it is to play a ranger.

People say that rangers can only play limited roles, such as anti-caster interrupters or trappers, but all really good characters are specified and put into good matching teams (hence, usually guild formed parties are better).

But rangers can do more than interrupt. I got so sick of all the w/mo's, that I made an anti-tank build with considerable success, possibly due to the lack of skill on the warriors' part.

What do rangers have against warriors? Energy and Expertise. Use them wisely. A good ranger/warrior can pretty much spam every single warrior attack skill without worrying about energy depletion. Combine that with stances and conditions and you got yourself an anti-tanker. They swing and miss and swing and miss while you drain away their life with conditions since their armor is so thick.

I've "pwned" as many as four warriors at once, which I think isn't bad.

What's my point? Every build can be made to destroy it's antithesis with a little bit of strategy and finess.

Zeru · May 12, 2005, 11:46 PM // 23:46

I'd have to agree with you that most people simply can't play ranger effectively at all. They are more or less unique with the amount that they skill spam and I guess most are simply not used to that approach.

With proper buffs and barrage rangers are really really powerful. I remember before tigers fury got nerfed

they were able to outdamage an ele even with barrage not hitting multiple targets. They still are quite decent now, just not on that scale.

Tactical-Dillusions · May 13, 2005, 04:16 AM // 04:16

Agreed.
Started a new character yesterday...now on level 11. I am a ranger/monk and have a pet melandru at level 10.
When in pvp, i do my best to kill enemies at long range and help others with assisted kills or heal/revive teammates when i see they need help.
A rangers best attribute is its pet. I use my pet to get up close for the dirty work while i rain in the arrows. If my pet needs help, i just send it some health

If i come under melee attack, i recall my pet to defend me while i fire all my deadliest weapons at the enemy.
I more often end up chasing the enemy around the map when he tucks tail and runs!! (although again its my pet that does the chasing lol!)
Not many can stand the pressure of a pet and an archer combination....especially if they think they can win by brute force.

Tactics, tactics, tactics!

Kilguri · May 13, 2005, 05:22 AM // 05:22

Just wait untill your pet pins you down in a corner and you can't move because the only way out of the corner is blocked by your pet, which won't move unless you do. That just might change your opinion on pets, hehe.

I agree tho, pets are a nice addition to Rangers, and they can be really helpful. But to me atleast they're anything but class defining, but then again, I find so many "class defining" abilities as a Ranger I just can't find room for pets to be added to the list :P
I'll say this tho, I only have pet on my 8th skill slot, but I never bother with pet skills and beast mastery.

catharsis · May 13, 2005, 01:40 PM // 13:40

Hm.. I don't like pets. They'd be much more useful if you didn't have to sacrifice a skill slot to take one along.

I'm playing with a variety of characters, and one is a ranger/smiting monk.. and you know, I've never felt particularly underpowered and I'll feel even better once I find Judge's Insight

As I see it, the Ranger is all about stacking damage. A skill like Favourable Winds combined with a good preparation can make your regular attacks pretty vicious, which seriously cuts down on the amount of energy you need... and when you can spam out some excellent skills like Hunter's Shot it only gets better. Toss a trap and a secondary profession into the mix, and you're laughing.

Unfortunately, this also means that you need quite a bit of time to prepare for a fight, which makes life somewhat difficult in PvP.

Epinephrine · May 13, 2005, 02:28 PM // 14:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by catharsis

Hm.. I don't like pets. They'd be much more useful if you didn't have to sacrifice a skill slot to take one along.

Lol, I know what you mean, but at the same time, it'd be funny as heck if someone said "I'd take X skill along, if it didn't take a slot"

I think that pets are possibly overlooked in their effectiveness, partly because people aren't trying to really use them. I do find a few things annoying about pets, as I am trying my hand at a pet based ranger:

Edit, cut the things out as they were turning into suggestions. They'll be in the suggestions area.

catharsis · May 13, 2005, 03:19 PM // 15:19

Heh.. I see what you're saying, and I guess my assertion DOES sound kinda dumb

That said, I'm not sure how effective the pets are unless you devote a ton of points and skill slots to Beast Mastery Calls and whatnot... and given that - as many people have pointed out - Rangers already NEED expertise and probably marksmanship, that's somewhat tough.

I think whether or not a pet will be effective depends on your secondary/primary class. Monks (Protection and Smiting are hugely useful for pet buffs) and Necros (that thing where your dying pet explodes and does damage... bwaahahahaaa), for example, can do a great deal more with pets than Rangers specced otherwise. I played around with Beastmastery a little bit on my R/Mo(smite), but I haven't yet found skills that complement a pet, and I found it was just holding me back. Dumped the pet, got two skill slots back, refunded the points I'd put into BM, and now I feel so much more powerful there's no real comparison.

Macel · May 13, 2005, 03:26 PM // 15:26

Rangers can fit into a variety of roles, but here's another example; I built a pvp one to test a build quickly last night.. In a 4 on 4 match, The rest of my team died off fairly quickly due to poor coordination and bad mix of classes.

So, I had 2 warriors beating on me, a necro trying desperately to drain me along with his two necro pets beating on me and a monk healing the necro. AFTER all this started happening to me, I started shooting the necro. He went down before I died.

I hardly think you can call the ranger a gimped class.. It's all about using proper abilities at the right time. And you have to realize that depending upon the build you take, you will be good at one thing in particular, which will make you good at killing certain classes, but not so good at killing others... Just like everyone else..

Macel · May 13, 2005, 03:33 PM // 15:33

Oh, and about pets.. Have you looked at the pet abilities? They're extremely cheap, they cast instantly and recharge fairly quickly and they do nice things. A pet ranger would do very well in pvp if focused mainly on the pet. People think pets are gimped because they take the pet along but dont use any of the pet skills.. You really have to go one way or the other with pets.. All out beastmaster (with maybe one really good bow skill, such as apply poison), or no pet at all to use the slots for better things.

sulos · May 13, 2005, 03:34 PM // 15:34

i agree, pets aren't that useful, if they die you get a skill penatly for about 10 sec?? or something like that. you save 2 skill slots that can be used for other things like pin down and called shot or anything you wish. i picked a warrior secondary and if mobs are ignoring me i will hit frenzy and then i fire extremely fast (faster than shortbow when i am using a longbow). it is really up to you if you use a pet or not, it may be good as a sleeper so you can interupt with it or do a knock down or something. i just think that the ranger can do all that stuff by himself more effectively.

Epinephrine · May 13, 2005, 03:45 PM // 15:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by catharsis

Heh.. I see what you're saying, and I guess my assertion DOES sound kinda dumb

That said, I'm not sure how effective the pets are unless you devote a ton of points and skill slots to Beast Mastery Calls and whatnot... and given that - as many people have pointed out - Rangers already NEED expertise and probably marksmanship, that's somewhat tough.

I think whether or not a pet will be effective depends on your secondary/primary class. Monks (Protection and Smiting are hugely useful for pet buffs) and Necros (that thing where your dying pet explodes and does damage... bwaahahahaaa), for example, can do a great deal more with pets than Rangers specced otherwise. I played around with Beastmastery a little bit on my R/Mo(smite), but I haven't yet found skills that complement a pet, and I found it was just holding me back. Dumped the pet, got two skill slots back, refunded the points I'd put into BM, and now I feel so much more powerful there's no real comparison.

Yeah, I think that you are right about the expertise thing, a ranger needs expertise if he/she is going to be using the ranger skills. Marksmanship is only necessary if you plan to use a bow; you can have a wand and a focus though and still play a ranger; the druids armour is decent energy, you only sacrifice one energy recovery for much better armour (especially vs. elemental attacks) and your expertise kicks in on any of the traps and such that you are using, so non-bow rangers primaries are a possibility. I like the idea of a buffed pet, and the attacks actually arent that bad if you put the points into BM; they tend to have fairly fast recharge times, with 5, 8, 10 and at most 15 second recharge times, and are often quite affordable, especially with some expertise - I am not certain yet if I'll try to make the push to 13 expertise for the awesome breakpoint (2 energy per 5 cost!!), but even at 3 energy many of them are good value for your energy spent (after all, 25 extra damage and 9 energy back for 3 energy spent every 8 seconds is nice - granted, that's the elite, but it nets you 2 and change in pips while doing a bit of bonus damage, which is nothing to sneeze at). Glad to see some votes for pets - I too think that many people take a pet and a skill (comfort animal :X) and put a few attribute points into BM and are disappointed that it isn't doing the damage that they get with their expertise, marksmanship and 3-4 skill slots.