Curse

Kishin · Jul 21, 2005, 04:08 AM // 04:08

I wouldn't knock Offering of Blood in the arena without trying it. I for one have had tremendous success with it. The key to it is entirely rhythm, and casting it not when you're close to bottoming out, but more towards the midpoint of your energy spending. 10% of your max HP is a 40-50 HP hit, which really isn't that bad at all, and you'll easily heal it and then some fairly quickly. Obviously you don't want to be in a situation where you're at say, 50% health and casting itt, but sometimes you must. I've been able to keep the enemy team at bay for pretty much an indefinite period barring a good spike or a knocklock by multiple warriors simply slipping it in between heals when I needed it. It's an art, and it definitely took me time to develop a feel for it.

Really, since you've dissed all other energy management options, the only option left you really is Inspiration Magic, and the only thing worth taking from it is Energy Drain (I'm not really a fan of Channeling), as Tap takes way too long to cast. I would seriously recommend trying Divine Boon over that.

ICURADik · Jul 21, 2005, 05:01 AM // 05:01

Basic Boon/Active Prot:

RoF
Signet of Devotion
Protective spirit
Mend Ailment
Smite/Remove Hex
Divine Boon

Whatever else you want after that. This monk probaly heals for 75 to over 100% of what another heal monk will do, depending on what kind of damage RoF snags. I always use signet of devotion whenever the time is up. If someone is getting spiked I prot spirit then alternate SoD and RoF. Usually this is myself.

As another poster said, Channeling, Energy Drain, and Offering are all options for energy management.

banishd · Jul 21, 2005, 12:34 PM // 12:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by SoTzuMe

LMAO, ok whatever. Someone this defensive is obviously compensating for something...

I look forward to meeting you all in the arena. And, after you've played monks for over a year, collected all your Monk elites, won the HoH, have >3 fame, have a top 100 Guild, and can win more than 20 consecutives in the arena consistently, come back and reread this thread.

uh sorry to burst your bubble, but your list of achievements arnt that noteworthy or anything to brag of, i mean you have 3+ fame, in a rank 100 guild and have every elite, you must be the master of monks.

3 fame is like, 1 tombs battle rofl.
rank 100 is nothing.
having every elite? ...wow
you can get in the top 100 in 1-2 days?

SoTzuMe · Jul 21, 2005, 02:25 PM // 14:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by banishd

uh sorry to burst your bubble, but your list of achievements arnt that noteworthy or anything to brag of, i mean you have 3+ fame, in a rank 100 guild and have every elite, you must be the master of monks.

3 fame is like, 1 tombs battle rofl.
rank 100 is nothing.
having every elite? ...wow
you can get in the top 100 in 1-2 days?

LMAO I never thought I was all that, no bubbles to burst here or people to put in their humble places; there are many, many monks more accomplished than I am, they just weren't showing up on this thread. It is like one good tombs run, and when you sit on top of the HoH it all racks up really fast.

So do you feel better now that I am sufficiently cut down to size LOL? Someone suggested that I hadn't played that much, and I thought it would be reasonable to list some tangibles that would indicate at least a base level of familiarity and experience with the PvP game. Plus, I was inexplicably cranky.

ElderAtronach, you are correct, I was thinking of Protective Bond, not Protective Spirit.

And Ristaron, Blessed Signet has always left me unsatisfied due to it's long recharge and cast time, though 2 seconds isn't really that long in real world terms, it's still 8 times as long as OoB and seems to take forever under combat conditions. Still, sounds like you have made it work out pretty well, so cool. I haven't run Lifebond builds nearly as much as healing, so maybe that's part of the reason.

To theclam, like most things in GW Heal Other and Infuse Health offer tradeoffs. On my current monkie (somewhat in attribute transition phase) at DF11, HP13, BM 8, Heal Other heals for 161 base + 35 DF + 61 Boon = 257, a bit more than half of your average teammate's health. Well, I get 160 from an Orison for 5 energy, so why spend 10 for a 257 point heal when I could drop 2 Orisons for 320? Compare with Infuse, which is both faster to cast and faster to recover than HO: based on the example boon healer above (granted with slightly different attributes) Infuse Health is healing for 411 points of damage. To be fair, you have to consider Infuse to be a 15 point heal, since you need to Touch yourself after using it to recover your own health. Orison still comes out ahead (160x3 = 480), but if Infuse isn't Mr. Right, it is Mr. Right Now. Ok, thats a mixed metaphor, since I'm a dude, but you get the idea. Infuse is a superior heal, but with a higher cost in energy and health -- it's still the best way to save a life in an emergency IMO.

I have the same problem with Heal Other that I have with Healing Breeze -- they are too expensive and tempting. I'd much rather force myself to be efficient, because if they are on my toolbar I will tend to overuse them. I find that I can "buy time" with Vigorous Spirit just as well as with Breeze, and that the cost and benefit of Infuse make using it a big enough decision that more often than not I will just drop an Orison instead (and be just fine.)

Finally, to Schorny, you gotta look at it as a team resources issue. When you are a hammer, every problem looks like a nail. If one warrior rushes through and attacks you, you can outheal him indefinitely, and still heal your team by alternating between Orison and Touch. So the net gain for your team is that one of their players is whacking off, metaphorically, by attacking you, while you still have at least 50% capacity to heal indefinitely. Now you have a 3.5 to 3 person match-up. If that warrior is a knockdown, you can still stay alive by taking advantage of their recharge time to heal yourself -- it isn't pleasant, but it is possible. Two warriors without knockdown simply leaves you with nothing to do but heal yourself, but you've put two of their players out of commission for a 3-2 advantage for your team resources. If your teammates can't convert that to a victory, the problem isn't the monk. If you have two knockdowns on you, you really do need help. You are right, prayers won't help (please forgive me for any misguided attempts at levity), but it is absolutely your job to call your team's attention to what is happening. If you die, they die. UNLESS, you can tie up two or more enemy players for a long time, thus unbalancing the team matchups, in which case, feel free to die eventually. By that time, two of the opponents should be down due to the 3-2 matchup, you should be rezzed, and your team should have a 4-2 advantage again for the wrapup and the win. The same philosophy applies to spike teams, if 3 eles are rushing to the rear to spike the monk, they should be severely punished for it with bleeding, pin downs, blinds, backfire, energy drains, knockdowns, and anything your team can do to disrupt and delay. Defeating spikers is not, primarily, a monks job. They are wide open to attack when trying to setup a strike; play with some spike teams for awhile and you'll realize that many of them are not very good. They are slow casting squishies who have to be in spell range and highly coordinated to do a good job -- deny them by taking advantage of their casting time and any terrain that will be an annoyance.

A final thought on the Boon Healer outlined above, you can basically think of OoB as cancelling out the energy hit from Boon -- I don't have the math to back that up, but I'm just saying intuitively that it seems to work out that way. So, what are you left with? An extremely low energy healer with very high DF bonus -- not bad under normal circumstances. Except, you also have the Boon bonus that leverages those low cost skills into useful heals etc. This is the sports car of monks, very high power to weight ratio, responsive, and candy-apple red. Also, it breaks down alot less than a Fiat.

Ultimately, there's only one thing that can kill you in GW, and that's losing all your health. This is a brute force, though efficient, solution that applies to anything that could kill your teammates, which is why I would choose it over anything if I had to be the only monk.

lanilifar · Jul 22, 2005, 01:24 AM // 01:24

I had never played a monk until Tuesday night.
Since I don't have any monk skills unlocked, I used the template monk with OoB.
I chose the holy rod that gave a percentage chance to cast Healing spells faster and the Healing Ankh that gives +12 energy, +5 Def and +45 hp when enchanted. So with a basic 42 energy I started learning monkdom (I couldn't imagine losing the extra pip of energy regen considering I would already be losing one to the enchantment plus losing energy due to the enchantment).
I really love OoB now.

Quote:

The key to it is entirely rhythm, and casting it not when you're close to bottoming out, but more towards the midpoint of your energy spending.

That is the truest statement ever. At first I only used it when my energy was bottoming out. But I found I was ending in a place where with 5 energy I could either heal someone who really needed it and then have no energy, or try to squeeze the OoB in first then the heal. Obviously, this is not a good place to be. However, if I used it when I had 20 - 30 energy, I had much better success.
This base template healer is really sweet, it did help that I have unlocked a minor DF and a superior Healing Prayers rune (with my ranger, still trying to find a superior Exp or Marks rune of course).
I find that Arena play is really hard as a lone monk if you face a team that has a good mesmer and decent damage ability. I also have gotten a lot of advice about monks from a friend who has played them a lot, so I wasn't going in blind.

I don't know if it is possible to play both healing and protection with great Att in Heal, Prot, and DF, due to your obvious energy problems. It may be better to consider a 4 attribute build such as, 11 Heal, 9 DF, 8 Prot, 8 (Insp or Blood). Reversal of Fortune, Convert Hexes, Mend Ailment, Mend Condition, Protective Spirit, and Sheilding Hands still work well at Prot 8. You could put your superior into Prot as well and end up with 12 Heal, 10 DF, 11 Prot, 8 (Insp/Blood). This may work reasonably well for someone who wishes to try to heal and protect. Depending on your skills, of course, it may be better to put the 8 in DF and the 9 in Prot. Good Luck, and please post how it goes and where you ended up.

Ristaron · Jul 22, 2005, 02:13 AM // 02:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by theclam

It's really not. It's only better in certain situations. It completely disables a whole tree. Most of the time what happens is that a team keeps on hitting the player with MoP for another 1-2 seconds, before switching to another target. Then all your protection spells are useless, so you better have something else to do. Shield of Regeneration works better in most situations.

The only builds that I can think of are something like a Life Bond build or a Monk that uses very few Protection spells.

I happen to be a Lifebonder on my PvP char. So your argument only strengthened my position.
Also, my main monk I've turned into a farmer because the devs are nerfing everything so I need to get whatever wealth I can get left before I'm stuck up the creek without a paddle. And he only has two protection spells, one of them is Mark, the other is Reversal of Fortune (like Mark, but it's only applicable to the next attack -- I need a better one).
Most of the rest are smiting.

Though, your point is made that it disables an entire branch. However most of the time, PvP especially, there is only one target being attacked. And this is highly capable of keeping someone alive until the branch recharges (unless the victim gets a handful of DOTS that the healers can't get off him).

ICURADik · Jul 22, 2005, 02:24 AM // 02:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by ElderAtronach

Sotsume, I don't think you're thinking of the correct spell. Protective spirit is 10 energy, lasts upwards of 18 seconds, and its target can't lose more than 10% health from any attack, which neuters air spikes significantly. You are thinking of Life Bond, which halves damage to the target, and the other half is directed to you but reduced by X amount, and costs a pip of mana regen to upkeep.

Life bond only works on physical damage, so it does nothing to ele spikes.

If you want to reduce ele spikes, Life Barrier{E} is the spell to use.

Ristaron · Jul 22, 2005, 02:48 AM // 02:48

Protective Spirit is another good one to use against spikers... unfortunately you can't do it to the entire team at once like Aegis.

"Protective Spirit:
For 5-19 seconds, target ally cannot lose more than 10% health due to damage from a single attack or spell."

Not 'physical' damage, any damage.

Life Barrier is the best way to protect your team against spikers, but it, like the non-elite, but popular Lifebond, costs alot to maintain on your entire team (excluding you).

Ollj · Jul 22, 2005, 03:19 AM // 03:19

Protective spirits is NOT only against physical!
It is only against attacks, so mostly against warrior and ranger skills and players that just attack with their weapon.
but attacks can do all kind of damage (with mods on the weapon).
And yes, protective spirit ignores all the elemental skills, hexes and such.

heres a hint:
never ever get more than 13 atributes into healing unless you use live-vicariousity or virgrous spirit.
Most healing skills numbers do not ascent fast enough to be worth what you need for more atributes (only the 2 healin skills above do).
healing is actually something ALL monk secondarys can do just as good.

Im not talking about divine favour here, that healing bonus IS good for any kind of monk.
Divine is something you either have at 5 (as primary healer, using aura of faith or unyielding aura) 10 (protector with peache and harmony (or smither)) 15 (as smiter with divine spirit (or protector)).
Read that skills and you get the point...
Peache and harmony runs most effective with 10 divine.
Signet of devortion and divine spirit with 15 divine.

Balthazars aura and aegis BTW are "only" worth around 7 atribute points in it because their numbers ascend so slowly.

The first number in this list shows how much atributes you should spend for this skill only (ignoring all other skills and combos in your bar).
Its calculated by how fast the green numbers of this skill ascend: (12attr-0attr)/(12attr+0attr)*18

Code:

0	Divine	Ench M1	E	Unyielding Aura
6	Divine	Ench	E	Aura of Faith
8	Divine	Ench	-	Divine Boon
9	Divine	Ench	E	Peace and Harmony
9	Divine	Ench M2	-	Blessed Aura
10	Divine	Ench	E	Spell Breaker
12	Divine	Ench M1	-	Watchful Spirit
13	Divine	Signet	-	Signet of Devotion
13	Divine	Signet	-	Blessed Signet
14	Divine	Ench	-	Divine Intervention
15	Divine	Skill	-	Contemplation of Purity
16	Divine	Ench	-	Divine Spirit
16	Divine	Spell	-	Divine Healing
2	Healing	Spell	-	Infuse Health
5	Healing	Spell	-	Restore Life
8	Healing	Ench	-	Healing Breeze
9	Healing	Ench	-	Mending
9	Healing	Spell	-	Orison of Healing
9	Healing	Spell	-	Healing Touch
10	Healing	Spell	-	Dwayna's Kiss
11	Healing	Ench	-	Healing Seed
11	Healing	Spell	-	Heal Party
11	Healing	Ench	E	Healing Hands
11	Healing	Spell	E	Word of Healing
11	Healing	Spell	-	Heal Other
12	Healing	Spell	-	Heal Area
15	Healing	Ench	-	Live Vicariously
15	Healing	Ench	-	Vigorous Spirit
0	Mo-Gen	Ench	-	Essence Bond
0	Mo-Gen	Ench	-	Holy Veil
0	Mo-Gen	Spell	-	Light Dwayna
0	Mo-Gen	Spell	E	Martyr
0	Mo-Gen	Spell	-	Purge Conditions
0	Mo-Gen	Signet	-	Purge Signet
0	Mo-Gen	Spell	-	Remove Hex
0	Mo-Gen	Spell	-	Resurrect
0	Mo-Gen	Hex M1	-	Succor
0	Mo-Gen	Ench	-	Vengeance
4	Prot.	Ench M1	E	Life Barrier
5	Prot.	Ench	E	Shield of deflection
6	Prot.	Ench	-	Protective Bond
7	Prot.	Ench	-	Aegis
7	Prot.	Ench	-	Guardian
8	Prot.	Ench	E	Shield of Regeneration
8	Prot.	Spell	E	Amity
8	Prot.	Spell	-	Convert Hexes
9	Prot.	Spell	-	Rebirth
9	Prot.	Ench M1	-	Life Attunement
10	Prot.	Hex	-	Pacifism
10	Prot.	Spell	-	Draw Conditions
11	Prot.	Ench	-	Vital Blessing
12	Prot.	Ench	-	Reversal of Fortune
12	Prot.	Ench	-	Protective Spirit
12	Prot.	Ench	-	Shielding Hands
14	Prot.	Ench	-	Life Bond
14	Prot.	Ench	E	Mark of Protection
14	Prot.	Spell	E	Restore Condition
15	Prot.	Spell	-	Mend Ailment
15	Prot.	Spell	-	Mend Condition
0	Smiting	Ench	-	Balthazar's Spirit
3	Smiting	Ench	-	Holy Wrath
3	Smiting	Ench	-	Retribution
6	Smiting	Signet	-	Bane Signet
7	Smiting	Ench	-	Balthazar's Aura
8	Smiting	Spell	-	Banish
10	Smiting	Skill	-	Holy Strike
10	Smiting	Spell	-	Symbol of Wrath
10	Smiting	Ench	-	Judge's Insight
10	Smiting	Hex	-	Scourge Sacrifice
11	Smiting	Signet	E	Signet of Judgement
11	Smiting	Hex	L	Scourge Healing
12	Smiting	Attack	-	Smite
14	Smiting	Spell	-	Smite Hex
14	Smiting	Ench	-	Zealot's Fire
14	Smiting	Ench	-	Strength of Honor
14	Smiting	Ench	E	Shield of Judgement

But if you REALLY need this skill much for your build spend as much into it as you want, and spend less if you barely use it. But in that case you mught just change your build instead?

theclam · Jul 22, 2005, 03:36 AM // 03:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ollj

heres a hint.
never ever get more than 13 atributes into healing unless you use live-vicariousity or virgrous spirit.
Most healing skills numbers do not ascent fast enough to be worth what you need for more atributes (only the 2 healin skills above do).
healing is actually something ALL monk secondarys can do just as good.

Im not talking about divine favour here, that healing bonus IS good for any kind of monk.
Divine is something you either have at 5 (as primary healer, using aura of faith or unyielding aura) 10 (protector with peache and harmony (or smither)) 15 (as smiter with divine spirit (or protector)).
Read that skills and you get the point...
Peache and harmony runs most effective with 10 divine.
Signet of devortion and divine spirit with 15 divine.

Balthazars aura and aegis BTW are "only" worth around 7 atribute points in it because their numbers ascend so slowly.

I'm going to disagree here. Balthazar's Aura does 170 damage over 10 seconds with 7 points. With 12 it does 220 damage over 10 seconds. In fact, the gain is 100% linear. There are no breakpoints for Balthazar's Aura.

Why is Signet of Devotion at 15? Why not 14 or 16? 14 heals for 94, 15 for 100, and 16 for 105-106. I don't see any real breakpoint there.

Why is Divine Spirit best at 15? 14 does it for 10s. 15 does it for 11s. And if I'm not mistaken, 16 does it for 12s.

Why keep Aura of Faith at 5? Why not at 12, which gives you 45% more healing, instead of 33% at 5?

Aegis is a good example of a skill with breakpoints. Aegis works best at 0, 2, 4, 7, 9, 12, 14, and probably 16, but I don't have a Sup Protection unlocked to test that. I don't see why 7 is the best place to stop, at 8 seconds, when 4, at 7 seconds, or 9, at 9 seconds, would work well, too.

There are breakpoints, but your numbers look completely arbitrary to me.

Ollj · Jul 22, 2005, 03:53 AM // 03:53

Im also ignoring all the breakpoints in this calculation (but they wil lbe included) because i dont know all of them yet.
there are >176 different green-number-ranges in this game and the breakpoints are not rounded "logically" for a reason i can not see yet.

Balthazars aura gets only 7!!!
numbers go from 10 to 22 (0 to 12 atributes) thats what you get with that formula:
(22-10)/(22+10)*18 = 6,75
The lower it starts and the higher it ends, the bigger this number goes.
If it starts high and ends high (or starts low and ends low), the number goes down.
Give me a better formular that does the same.

YES balthazars aura itself is more effective with less smiting (and more atribute points in something else (especially because because it costs 25)) because its relative ascending of its green numbers is just not as good!!
I got kicked off teams for saying that but it wont stop me saying that.
Baltazars aura is for E/Mo and E/Ne, and not that much for Mo/W you gotta live with that!

JoDiamonds · Jul 22, 2005, 04:21 AM // 04:21

I guess if you want to keep your "secret" arena build, that's ok, but there's a lot of people in Guild Wars with a lot of experience already, and you'll almost certainly benefit more by sharing than by keeping "secret tech".

That said, you have't mentioned if you are running Divine Boon or not. If you are running all five mana spells, that's perfect. And you can run Signet of Devotion for some energy management also. I'm presuming you have a high Divine Favor, because otherwise, why are you a monk? =)

(yeah, yeah, runes etc., I know, but still)

theclam · Jul 22, 2005, 05:14 AM // 05:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ollj

Im also ignoring all the breakpoints in this calculation (but they wil lbe included) because i dont know all of them yet.
there are >176 different green-number-ranges in this game and the breakpoints are not rounded "logically" for a reason i can not see yet.

Balthazars aura gets only 7!!!
numbers go from 10 to 22 (0 to 12 atributes) thats what you get with that formula:
(22-10)/(22+10)*18 = 6,75
The lower it starts and the higher it ends, the bigger this number goes.
If it starts high and ends high (or starts low and ends low), the number goes down.
Give me a better formular that does the same.

YES balthazars aura itself is more effective with less smiting (and more atribute points in something else (especially because because it costs 25)) because its relative ascending of its green numbers is just not as good!!
I got kicked off teams for saying that but it wont stop me saying that.
Baltazars aura is for E/Mo and E/Ne, and not that much for Mo/W you gotta live with that!

That's an arbitrary formula. Let's take Channeling.
(46-8)/(46+8)*18=
38/54*18=
12.666...

It says I should take 12 or 13 points into Inspiration Magic. That's a complete waste. You don't need 45-50 seconds on Channeling, you only really need 25-30. Your points would be better spent elsewhere. How about another example, like Energy Tap?

(13-8)/(8+13)*18=
5/21*18=
4.3

This one says I should take 4 or 5 points of Inspiration if I'm just using Energy Tap. That's 10 energy. Why wouldn't I bump Inspiration up to 9, which would still give me enough points to have a good number of points into 2 other attributes.

Still not convinced? Now let's do Hex Breaker.
(156-60)/(156+60)*18=
96/216*18=
8

I should take 8 in Domination Magic in order to power Hex Breaker. This is also wrong. I'm a Mo/Me. 60s is more than long enough. Hex Breaker's damage effect is very secondary. The best way to distribute my points would be to put my 3 main attributes to however I would like them and put the remainder into Domination Magic.

Almost always, you're going to go with 3 or 4 attributes. There are only so many ways of distributing points between 3 or 4 attributes (this page lists many of them: http://guildwars.gameamp.com/guide/viewGuides/182.php). After you've got your attributes chosen, you're going to prioritize them. Then you have to pick how many points you're going to put into each attribute, watching out for breakpoints. If you're a Smiter, you're going to want as many points into Smiting as you can afford, without comprising any secondary skill trees. If Balthazar's Aura is something you cast often and if you rely on it for a major source of damage, you should put 10-12 points into it, not 7, just because the formula said so.

In conclusion, that formula sucks.

lanilifar · Jul 22, 2005, 05:41 AM // 05:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by theclam

Going with four attributes is unecessary and leaves your skills weaker than they should be.

Oh, I agree completely. I was just trying to point out alternatives for the OP to consider, since they asked for ways to manage energy while running both heal and protection. Depending what Protection skills you want to take, you really can get away with having a low-medium attribute in Protection. I am somewhat surprised you do not have energy issues though if you go DF/Heal/Protect, just using Signet of Devotion. However, my monk experience is still very limited, so I will just have to learn.

theclam · Jul 22, 2005, 05:45 AM // 05:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by lanilifar

Oh, I agree completely. I was just trying to point out alternatives for the OP to consider, since they asked for ways to manage energy while running both heal and protection. Depending what Protection skills you want to take, you really can get away with having a low-medium attribute in Protection. I am somewhat surprised you do not have energy issues though if you go DF/Heal/Protect, just using Signet of Devotion. However, my monk experience is still very limited, so I will just have to learn.

I guess you're just used to Offering of Blood. I survived for 20 levels without one energy generation skill. I had to learn the hard way how to make a build. Protection spells are key to a pure Monk. For example, Reversal of Fortune, combined with high Divine Favor, can heal for as much as Heal Other. Without Protection, I'd be stuck using inefficient Orisons of Healing.

Mitsu Bishi · Jul 22, 2005, 07:51 AM // 07:51

RoF is very situational unfortunately. It can heal for a measly 70 (50 divine favor and 10 damage prevented + healed) but it can also "heal" for numbers in the 200 range (50 divine favor, 100 prevented, 50 healed @ ~7 protection). Yes, I like it a lot but you have to be a bit picky on when to use it. Much like Dwayna's Kiss, it's a great healing spell for 5 energy once you learn when to use it.

Still, energy generation is useful and if you can squeeze a good skill for it into your build, it ultimately will make your build better.

Ollj · Jul 22, 2005, 01:08 PM // 13:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by theclam

That's an arbitrary formula. Let's take Channeling.
12.666...
It says I should take 12 or 13 points into Inspiration Magic. That's a complete waste. You don't need 45-50 seconds on Channeling, you only really need 25-30. Your points would be better spent elsewhere. How about

Jeah sure, complete waste, thats why the devs made it last os long eh?
learn to use channeling.

Quote:

Originally Posted by theclam

another example, like Energy Tap?
4.3
This one says I should take 4 or 5 points of Inspiration if I'm just using Energy Tap. That's 10 energy. Why wouldn't I bump Inspiration up to 9, which would still give me enough points to have a good number of points into 2 other attributes.

Because you never ever tried points in 4-5 different atributes at once?

Quote:

Originally Posted by theclam

Still not convinced? Now let's do Hex Breaker.
8
I should take 8 in Domination Magic in order to power Hex Breaker. This is also wrong. I'm a Mo/Me. 60s is more than long enough. Hex Breaker's damage effect is very secondary. The best way to distribute my points would be to put my 3 main attributes to however I would like them and put the remainder into Domination Magic.

Face it, YOU just can not use long lasting mesmer skills the way they are meant to be used.

And balthazars aura is no high atribute skill!
Enjoy overusing it and spend more in it, thats just fine.

theclam · Jul 22, 2005, 07:44 PM // 19:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ollj

Jeah sure, complete waste, thats why the devs made it last os long eh?
learn to use channeling.

So you're saying that it's better for me to go something like 12 Inspiration, 9 Healing Prayers, 9 Divine Favor, just to use Channeling? Wouldn't 11 Healing Prayers, 11 Divine Favor, 8 Inspiration Magic work much better?

Quote:

Because you never ever tried points in 4-5 different atributes at once?

4 attributes works ok for something like a Ranger. For my Monk, it doesn't. If I spread my points around, an Orison will heal for 80, instead of 100. Elementalists and Necros feel the same way. They very rarely put points into more than 3 attributes.

Quote:

Face it, YOU just can not use long lasting mesmer skills the way they are meant to be used.

Why would a Monk use Hex Breaker for damage? I only use it because it's an instant cast anti-Hex spell with a short cooldown. 60 seconds is more than long enough. If I wanted to do damage, I'd get more out of putting 8 points into Smiting. It's better to go 12/12/3 or 11/10/10/1 than 10/9/9/8, just for Hex Breaker.

Quote:

And balthazars aura is no high atribute skill!
Enjoy overusing it and spend more in it, thats just fine.

It would be nice if you would actually give a reason behind your strategy, rather than saying your formula is right, no matter what. Back up your arguments, please.

Jul 22, 2005, 08:04 PM // 20:04

Ollj you are incredibly wrong. Just stop trying to find an efficiency formula because it's not working at all.

Ensign · Jul 22, 2005, 08:16 PM // 20:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ollj

The first number in this list shows how much atributes you should spend for this skill only (ignoring all other skills and combos in your bar).
Its calculated by how fast the green numbers of this skill ascend: (12attr-0attr)/(12attr+0attr)*18

Why should I treat this formula as anything other than some nonsense you pulled out of your ass?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ollj

Face it, YOU just can not use long lasting mesmer skills the way they are meant to be used.

Have you even read Hex Breaker?

Peace,
-CxE