Curse

Nightsorrow · Aug 23, 2005, 06:56 PM // 18:56

I wasn't sure if this should go in questions + answers, or in here - thought it might be better off here.

Basically, me and a friend have played through the game together as a Monk duo, me Smiting and him Healing - we've reached the Crystal Desert now and I want to switch from Smiting to a more team-orientated area - so my basic question is, would it be better for me to switch to healing so that we always have 2 healing monks? Or would me changing to protection work better, so normally having 1 healing 1 protection.

Inevitable next question would be if protection, what sort of build would you suggest? Healing I'm fine with, have tried before - but protection I don't have a clue.

Thanks in advance.

Fr3sH · Aug 23, 2005, 07:09 PM // 19:09

Make sure you use aegis, rof, and prot spirit. Rest is up to you.

Scaphism · Aug 23, 2005, 07:39 PM // 19:39

Smiting is team oriented- you boost your team's damage in ways other characters cannot. You'll also be very useful in the desert mission where enemies often use Aegis, but your smiting spells wont be affected.

The area where smiting doesn't work is just outside the Amnoon Oasis, aka my least favorite part of the entire game. The run from the Oasis to Augry Rock is so filled with enemies using chillblains that you wont be able to use any enchantments effectively. My suggestion is to advance very slowly and only draw a little aggro at a time.

If you insist on switching to Protection or Healing, you wont be hurting anything. If you go into protection, be sure to bring Protective Spirit for Hydras. If you go into Healing, bring Healing Seed for everything. Make sure to coordinate with your friend when you use your "big" spells so you're not overhealing one target and wasting energy.

I've found the desert missions aren't very difficult at all, but the Explorable Areas between them are a pain.

If you want to do a little research on a protection monk here's something I wrote up a short while ago about protection monks in Tombs. Link. It doesn't always apply for PVE but it should be useful for getting a feel for what a protection monk should do.

Schorny · Aug 23, 2005, 07:40 PM // 19:40

In PvE 2 healing monks is fine. 2 heal/prot monks are finer

some key skills are: healing seed (only if the team is organized), aegis (always, it simple owns in PvE), Mend Ailment/Condition

If you both can manage to bring aegis, everything should go smooth. 2 healing monks in PvE is really neat - I won't bother too much on what is usefull to the team, but more on what you like to play.

I won't bother with protective Spirit in PvE, because hardly any enemy is doing more than 60 damage with one strike (only the mursaat eles). So a pure protection monk is IMHO a waste in PvE...

Nightsorrow · Aug 24, 2005, 08:36 AM // 08:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scaphism

Smiting is team oriented- you boost your team's damage in ways other characters cannot. You'll also be very useful in the desert mission where enemies the enemies often use Aegis, but your smiting spells wont be affected.

The area where smiting doesn't work is just outside the Amnoon Oasis, aka my least favorite part of the entire game. The run from the Oasis to Augry Rock is so filled with enemies using chillblains that you wont be able to use any enchantments effectively. My suggestion is to advance very slowly and only draw a little aggro at a time.

If you insist on switching to Protection or Healing, you wont be hurting anything. If you go into protection, be sure to bring Protective Spirit for Hydras. If you go into Healing, bring Healing Seed for everything. Make sure to coordinate with your friend when you use your "big" spells so you're not overhealing one target and wasting energy.

I've found the desert missions aren't very difficult at all, but the Explorable Areas between them are a pain.

If you want to do a little research on a protection monk here's something I wrote up a short while ago about protection monks in Tombs. Link. It doesn't always apply for PVE but it should be useful for getting a feel for what a protection monk should do.

That was great help, thanks alot

1 thing that did occur to me, would it be implausable to Arcane Echo Aegis to keep it up more of the time? Or is the energy drain going to be too much?

ElderAtronach · Aug 24, 2005, 08:59 AM // 08:59

I can't say for sure, but I think Arcane Echo may be too big of a drain on your mana supply to keep up indefinitely. My prot monk did use Echo {E} along with a 20% longer enchantments staff to keep up Aegis 24/30 seconds though, and in the FoW that's pretty good against hordes of skeletons, abyssals, etc.

Scaphism · Aug 24, 2005, 09:45 AM // 09:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nightsorrow

That was great help, thanks alot

1 thing that did occur to me, would it be implausable to Arcane Echo Aegis to keep it up more of the time? Or is the energy drain going to be too much?

Well you put the right words in there.
Energy Drain {E}.
It could certainly work, if the love affair with Aegis grows that powerful.
If you plan to run it that often I'd recommend looking into Blessed Aura as well.

Blessed Aura + Serpent's Quickness + Aegis, for example would work pretty well. Don't forget the + enchantment duration mod either.
If you're going Mo/R and you're good with switching stances, you might as well throw Draw Conditions + Melandru's Resilience in there. Melandru's + Quickness shouldn't conflict either- you should be able to alternate them to get full benefit from improved recharge times.

Unfortunately there's no protection staff in the game, so you're stuck with either a DF staff for the enchantment part, or grabbing the 20/20 protection focus and putting an enchanting mod on a one handed weapon (sword or axe).

I was a big fan of carrying Disrupting Chop on my Mo/W a while back- it's a free interrupt since the adrenaline is coming in anyways. (It was only 5A at the time, but the idea still works) Sometimes you *need* an interrupt to get past a nasty boss or enemy.

Acan Vishnu · Aug 24, 2005, 03:43 PM // 15:43

In PvE with a patient team you can handle post-fight downtimes without much of an issue so in some cases running out of steam is okay, but it really depends on your team. If you can find a group with enough killing power then who cares if you can only last for a while running at full capacity? The only problem with that is the unexpected -- when that extra group decides to agro or someone in the team messes up. At that point you need cheap spot heals, Dwayna's Kiss and Signet of Devotion come to mind immediately. If your going enchantment heavy Dwayna's Kiss can be absolutely invaluable, and Signet of Devotion (once you get used to it) can be a huge help.

As far as investing alot into keeping Aegis up, its my feeling that it just isn't worth it. I've come to view it in PvE as a PuG crutch that should only be picked up in extenuating circumstances. Unless your team is an absolute mess you will not be getting nearly enough benefit from it as even a half decent tank can keep the majority of monsters on themselves and of the few that still target other players, only the warrior or ranger types will even be protected against by Aegis. Not to mention that the skill is balanced for 8 players on your team and you've only got 6 at that point, but thats really just an sidenote.

The only other thing is that you won't get Energy Drain until the Southern Shiverpeaks, so if your looking for heavy energy management in the Crystal Desert you'll have to look someplace else.

Scaphism · Aug 24, 2005, 06:40 PM // 18:40

I don't think it's worth trying to get perma-Aegis either, mostly because it requires either Echo (your elite) or Arcane Echo (energy).
If you really want it up all the time,. get someone else to carry a second copy.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acan Vishnu

I've come to view it in PvE as a PuG crutch that should only be picked up in extenuating circumstances. Unless your team is an absolute mess you will not be getting nearly enough benefit from it as even a half decent tank can keep the majority of monsters on themselves and of the few that still target other players, only the warrior or ranger types will even be protected against by Aegis.

I can't agree with this. What are you trying to do, make your life more difficult as a monk? Aegis saves you a ton of hassle, and monsters definitely spread out their aggro. Aegis makes your life easier- take it or leave it. The first 10 seconds are the most crucial of any encounter with a pack of mobs- if you can prevent a bunch of damage without having to expend a lot of energy/focus on each indivdual target that should give your team the time it needs to take out a few of the enemies and reduce the threat level to managable levels.

I don't think there's any "crutch" in this game- sounds like you're trying to make it more difficult than it has to be. If that's what makes the PVE more fun for you, go ahead, by all means- another bonus of instanced maps.

There are a ton of ranger and warrior mobs in the game- I'd be surprised if it was less than 60% of all mobs in the game. Your Aegis will definitely get a workout if you use it.

Acan Vishnu · Aug 24, 2005, 07:53 PM // 19:53

My point though was that if your team understands how to control agro much of Aegis' effect is wasted. An average PvE team has two warriors, if those two warriors are allowed to do their job properly then your spending 15 energy for two people to have a 50% chance to block for 10 seconds; which is exactly why I called it a PuG Crutch, you can't rely on PuGs to handle agro properly so you bring Aegis to save yourself one hell of a headache. There ARE cases where Aegis is a good skill even if you have a good team, but still, I generally find that there are better choices for a monk to bring if your team knows whats going on.

stumpy · Aug 24, 2005, 08:24 PM // 20:24

im sorry but arcane vishnu ... did you notice they put in Lina in the desert. That wasn't by accident. She uses Aegis as soon as it is up. Maybe a pug crutch, but definately worth putting in a protection monks bar, along with mend ailment/condition and inspired hex (assuming that we are talking about the desert, pre-matyr). True with proper agro life is easier, but with proper agro and aegis life is that much easier for a healer. I'm not saying its not possible to go without Aegis cause it r00x0r, not anything of that matter at all. Just saying that it is definately an asset in a protection monks bar. Why chance the loss because your too proud to make an easy game easier. Don't let pride or ego blind you to the fact that the only thing between your team winning and losing could be 1 accident. I'm sure you have gone through the game many times over like myself ... but this skill is a staple in any protection monk.

To the OP ... 1 healing and 1 protection is far better than 2 healing. It prevents overhealing targets, manages energy better ... not at first glance but in the long run it does.

Out of curiousity, which will likely kill this cat, what would you prefer a protection monk in the desert to bring?

Off the top of my head I would have to say (assuming you have no elites cause your in the desert) Mend Condition/Ailment, Aegis, Guardian, Reversal, Inspired Hex, Energy Tap, some sort of res as back up is good in pve, and free slot.

ElderAtronach · Aug 24, 2005, 10:31 PM // 22:31

Heh, talking about proper aggro control in a PUG is like talking about winning the lottery - probably ain't gonna happen. Aegis is a life saver, mana saver, and affects a greater area than wards.

Soiled Egg Roll · Aug 25, 2005, 12:04 AM // 00:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scaphism

I don't think it's worth trying to get perma-Aegis either, mostly because it requires either Echo (your elite) or Arcane Echo (energy).
If you really want it up all the time,. get someone else to carry a second copy.

Plus, you probably won't have access to Echo, as the boss that has it is on the Fire Island.

Nightsorrow · Aug 25, 2005, 05:44 PM // 17:44

This has to have been the most helpful response I've ever had on a forum for any game, ever - thanks alot guys

Sadly, my problem has now switched from how to skill / play a Monk, to how to find a PuG that isn't full of complete morons

octaviancmb · Aug 25, 2005, 06:26 PM // 18:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nightsorrow

This has to have been the most helpful response I've ever had on a forum for any game, ever - thanks alot guys

Sadly, my problem has now switched from how to skill / play a Monk, to how to find a PuG that isn't full of complete morons

ROFL, good luck on this new problem. My only advice is to remember than henchmen are your buddies, and in almost all cases more intelligent than PUGs.

My protection monk found that, in situations in which Agro was controlled (say with, oh, the henchman warriors), I was using Guardian and RoF to better effect than Aegis and Protective Spirit. Combined with a mid-to-high Divine Favor, you'll be doing your healing monk a HUGE help. I usually go full protection, anyway, so I run all 4 and use what I need when I need it. But your mileage may vary.

cmb