Curse

gafnalaz · Aug 25, 2005, 04:35 PM // 16:35

I just read the description for blackout, something like...

"All of touched targets skills are disabled for 7 secs and yours are disabled for 5 sec." (assumming 12 in linked mesmer skill)

I was thinking of using a W/Me combo to utilize this skill, but heres my question.

Do you gain adrenaline while blackout is in effect? If you can, do you think it would a good anti caster build? The idea is run up to the target, maybe use an attack skill or 2, then cast blackout, gain adrenaline during the 5 sec, and unload on the target when you get your skills back.

Thoughts?

Sarus · Aug 25, 2005, 04:37 PM // 16:37

YOu don't gain adrenaline under blackout. In fact you loose whatever you have when you use the skill. It's a pretty horrible skill to put on a traditional warrior since you're effectively lowering your DPS to nothing.

mr_boo · Aug 25, 2005, 04:37 PM // 16:37

No adrenaline whatsoever while you are blacked out. One plus aspect of Blackout, that you might not know about, is that it interrupts.

Red Locust · Aug 25, 2005, 05:09 PM // 17:09

Put it on a hammer warrior and slap it on the end of a hammer knockdown chain. You lose all adrenaline either way, and with a blackout tacked on at the end, you effectively disable the monk for ~10 seconds.

On any other warriors, the skill is just bad. You lose all adrenaline and are unable to build it up for 5 seconds.

Sarus · Aug 25, 2005, 05:11 PM // 17:11

okay I just tested it to confirm and blackout will also wipe out any adrenaline you had when you use the skill.

anti_z3r0 · Aug 25, 2005, 07:32 PM // 19:32

I do agree that Blackout is pretty insane after a knockdown chain.

Also, no one ever expects Blackout from the W/Me. Well.....they never used to.

Entropius · Aug 25, 2005, 07:58 PM // 19:58

Our guild has a Me/W Illusionary Warrior dude that uses it.

Sarus · Aug 25, 2005, 07:58 PM // 19:58

yeah I could see blackout at the end of a hammer chain being good.

Tigris Of Gaul · Aug 25, 2005, 09:32 PM // 21:32

If you're a W/Me running Blackout, don't expect much damage.

Ensign · Aug 25, 2005, 09:46 PM // 21:46

I'm not thrilled by Blackout on the end of a hammer chain - I'd rather start building up for the next one.

I do think that Blackout is *neccessary* on an IW Mesmer. You aren't dependant upon attack skills for damage at all, and the shutdown is excellent.

Peace,
-CxE

Red Locust · Aug 25, 2005, 10:03 PM // 22:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tigris Of Gaul

If you're a W/Me running Blackout, don't expect much damage.

What are you missing out on? Judge's Insight can be done by someone else, aftershock is half-decent to mediocre at best, and losing a few strikes of adrenaline is a fair tradeoff for having their monk unable to cast for an extra 6 seconds, especially when that 6 seconds comes right after a hammer spike.

Sarus · Aug 25, 2005, 10:12 PM // 22:12

Quote:

What are you missing out on? Judge's Insight can be done by someone else, aftershock is half-decent to mediocre at best, and losing a few strikes of adrenaline is a fair tradeoff for having their monk unable to cast for an extra 6 seconds, especially when that 6 seconds comes right after a hammer spike.

I think Tigris is referring to swords and axe warriors. On a hammer warrior having blackout at the end of a spike could work assuming there's only one monk so he doesn't get crossheals during the blackout. If you aren't getting a kill in the blackout window it isn't a good skill to bring since it will be slowing down your knocklock.

Even when he's blacked out you have to assume you're only going to get 1 or 2 hits in since the monk will be kiting. Is that enough to get the kill? Unfortunately I'm not sure.

zehly · Aug 25, 2005, 10:35 PM // 22:35

I tried this on a regular warrior with my axe.. it really pissed people off in the random arenas.

Sarus · Aug 25, 2005, 11:49 PM // 23:49

Quote:

I tried this on a regular warrior with my axe.. it really pissed people off in the random arenas.

Well there's no doubt there is nothing more annoying than having someone use blackout on you constantly. The trouble is you're doing more harm to yourself than you are to the person you're blacking out. If you're using blackout on an axe warrior it means you are hardly ever hitting with your adrenaline based attack skills. As a result, your DPS plummets along with your utility. If you're going to be using blackout then it should be part of a more defined shutdown character. We've used blackout before on characters but it was always combined with other things to ensure the target remained completely shutdown.

Blackout is still a good tool to use as part of a spike. Coordinate your teams spike on the target while they are blackedout. However, I would stash the blackout on a caster shutdown character. Not on a character that should be cranking out as much sustained DPS as possible. A mesmer primary with blackout can use interrupts and hexes to keep the monk shutdown inbetween blackouts cooldown. A sword or axe warrior won't be able to do this.

To sum up, blackout on an axe or sword warrior is downright awful. Axe on a hammer warrior can arguably be okay but I think I'd still prefer to free that slot up for a different skill and speed up the knocklocks.

Red Locust · Aug 25, 2005, 11:58 PM // 23:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sarus

I think Tigris is referring to swords and axe warriors. On a hammer warrior having blackout at the end of a spike could work assuming there's only one monk so he doesn't get crossheals during the blackout. If you aren't getting a kill in the blackout window it isn't a good skill to bring since it will be slowing down your knocklock.

Even when he's blacked out you have to assume you're only going to get 1 or 2 hits in since the monk will be kiting. Is that enough to get the kill? Unfortunately I'm not sure.

Right, blackout's usefulness dwindles if your team isn't able to make that effort to kill the monk during your chain. But after all, disabling a monk makes it that much easier for the rest of your team to finish the job. Combined with snares, a second hammer warrior on another monk and some ele or ranger damage, you can get some quick kills with little to no healing from the enemy monks.

Plus, there are some neat little tricks you can do, like blacking out a meteor shower or maelstrom, or the ghostly hero during his altar cap

Tigris Of Gaul · Aug 26, 2005, 12:09 AM // 00:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sarus

Well there's no doubt there is nothing more annoying than having someone use blackout on you constantly. The trouble is you're doing more harm to yourself than you are to the person you're blacking out. If you're using blackout on an axe warrior it means you are hardly ever hitting with your adrenaline based attack skills. As a result, your DPS plummets along with your utility. If you're going to be using blackout then it should be part of a more defined shutdown character. We've used blackout before on characters but it was always combined with other things to ensure the target remained completely shutdown.

Blackout is still a good tool to use as part of a spike. Coordinate your teams spike on the target while they are blackedout. However, I would stash the blackout on a caster shutdown character. Not on a character that should be cranking out as much sustained DPS as possible. A mesmer primary with blackout can use interrupts and hexes to keep the monk shutdown inbetween blackouts cooldown. A sword or axe warrior won't be able to do this.

To sum up, blackout on an axe or sword warrior is downright awful. Axe on a hammer warrior can arguably be okay but I think I'd still prefer to free that slot up for a different skill and speed up the knocklocks.

Maybe you'd want to run it on a hammer, but I still think the Blackout W/Me is purely a shutdown, utility type character. Like a "Fear Me!" spammer with less effectiveness.

Hamstring
Blackout
Savage Slash
Distracting Blow
Flourish*
Signet of Humility
Resurrection Signet
Sprint

Swords because Savage Slash is energy, and that helps Flourish out a lot. You'd probably be better off running Energy Drain though. Axes I don't feel are very good at all because it's solely adrenaline, and I just can't see it at the end of a chain like with hammers. Like you said, if a warrior is focused on damage, Blackout is not the way to go. But if you want a pure shutdown character, try the W/Me.

Hart · Aug 26, 2005, 12:21 AM // 00:21

As a side note, not only do YOU lose all adrenaline, but your TARGET uses all adrenaline. At one point I tried bringing a 0s blackout on my Mo/Me specifically to shut down W/E aftershockers. They'd hit me 6 times, I'd black them out before they got the adrenaline to do any real damage. Unfortunately it shut me down for too long to be useful in that context, but blacking a Hammer warrior out can really @$%# his DPS if well timed.

anti_z3r0 · Aug 26, 2005, 12:54 AM // 00:54

Knocklock chain -> Sprint -> Blackout

That will give you a speed buff for the duration of Blackout so that the kiting doesn't suck so much.

I'm going to try this out now.

Zeru · Aug 26, 2005, 01:03 AM // 01:03

frenzy 5
crushing 5
irres 5
sprint 5
blackout 10

will need near max energy before starting it and a zealous weapon.

with QZ up its:
7
7
7
7
13

You wouldn't be able to pull it off even without the sprint.

Savio · Aug 26, 2005, 01:09 AM // 01:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by gafnalaz

"All of touched targets skills are disabled for 7 secs and yours are disabled for 5 sec." (assumming 12 in linked mesmer skill)

I was thinking of using a W/Me combo to utilize this skill, but heres my question.

Just to address the OP, you can only get 7-second blackouts if you had 15-16 Domination magic (the linked attribute). W/Me's would only be able to get a max of 12, which barely gives them 6 seconds.

Interesting, Hart. But, Sympathetic Visage can do the same thing, so you wouldn't have to lose all of your capabilites. It's also in the Illusion line.

anti_z3r0, try to time it when they're casting something; the hidden interrupt is a nice bonus. Also, make sure to coordinate spikes beforehand with your team, or the Blackout could go to waste.