Curse

DarkAynjil · Sep 01, 2005, 07:53 PM // 19:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rey Lentless

The build isn't as bad as he tried to make it sound. Wastrel's is a good skill to use for this.

Wastrel's can do ~100 damage for 5 energy with soul barbs.

I wouldn't use wastrel's as a cover hex however.. something like parasitic bond would be good for that.

I'd rather Flare-Gun. It's just as pointless.

Glasswalker · Sep 01, 2005, 08:24 PM // 20:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scaphism

if there's enough demand for a "Casual" or "Theoretical" builds section we could probably add it

[DEMAND]

I think of this in terms of a company's Research and Development devision. Sure, the daily wage is going to come out of the tried and true business, but the exponential growth comes out of R&D. Heck, that's what I've been using thisforum for.

[/DEMAND]

Bast · Sep 01, 2005, 09:24 PM // 21:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rey Lentless

The build isn't as bad as he tried to make it sound. Wastrel's is a good skill to use for this.

Wastrel's can do ~100 damage for 5 energy with soul barbs.

I wouldn't use wastrel's as a cover hex however.. something like parasitic bond would be good for that.

I wouldn't use Wastrel's at all. Stop it.

Rey Lentless · Sep 01, 2005, 11:41 PM // 23:41

That's great, and why wouldn't you?

Tuna · Sep 02, 2005, 12:37 AM // 00:37

When DrkH ran a soul barbs + hex stacking build someone came up with ingenious idea of spamming WW. Then we started losing.

Bast · Sep 02, 2005, 12:48 AM // 00:48

Wastrel's Worry - Hex Spell
After 3 seconds, target foe takes 8-53 damage. Wastrel's Worry ends prematurely if that foe uses a skill.

1.) Unreliable damage
2.) What's the answer to it? Cast something, which a caster will be doing anyway. Bring stuff that requires a hard counter or something counter-intuitive at least.
3.) Lousy cover hex, as you said. This could have been a use for it, but WW is too shitty even for this use.
4.) You're stuck on one character spamming a useless hex instead of working on someone else and spreading the hate out.

Rey Lentless · Sep 02, 2005, 01:00 AM // 01:00

If they're backfired, they aren't casting something.

If you're forcing them to use a skill, then you're prepared for an interupt. You're drawing out a skill to use something like powerblock.

I'm not saying this is a great build, but wastrel's fit's what he's apparently trying to do.

Amused Observer · Sep 02, 2005, 04:59 AM // 04:59

Actually, I would consider using Wastrel if I'm running an axe W/Me w/ disrupting chop. Cast WW to force your target to use a skill, and then use disrupting chop to disable it for 20 seconds.

Edge Martinez · Sep 02, 2005, 05:01 AM // 05:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rey Lentless

I'm not saying this is a great build, but wastrel's fit's what he's apparently trying to do.

Was trying to do. But yeah, I think Scaphism had a good idea about a place to post theory builds. All the clear cut tested builds that people use had to start somewhere.

arredondo · Sep 02, 2005, 05:28 AM // 05:28

Man, I hate to see stuff like this. Edge, don't let anyone discourage you from trying out new stuff (well, at least new to you). A lot of useful things, big or small, comes from people like yourself who just like messing around with skill combinations and posting something you really like. Even if you came up with a rough idea that may have some issues, don't stop trying until you've ironed out as many kinks as you can before moving on to your next project. If Thomas Edison had stopped after 99 failed light bulbs...yadda yadda yadda.

Here is one of many average forum members offering a concept that he hadn't seen around and the response is to shove him into a rigid box that probably makes him feel silly for posting it. SOOOO many times I see either an elitist or overly discouraging attitude that has the negative effect of surpressing creativity instead of fostering it. Instead of saying, as an example, "copy the cookie cutter builds", how about working together to perhaps flesh out all that we can from his submission, based on our individual builds and experiences? Yes the established stuff works well, but he was trying to do something NOT already popularized.

Pointing him to a random build generator is a response full of poor taste. You guys should be all about helping the community get bigger as they enjoy playing the game. Sometimes part of that enjoyment comes from testing (and failing) at build construction as one combines skills for combat. Even in failure, one can learn a lot about the mechanics of the game as well as the various properties of the moves. Will he try to maximize a skill's use after it's been ridiculed as horrid, awful, unsueable, etc. by established players? I doubt it. The creative spirit has been punked for even trying, "so why continue to try using it?" will be many people's response.

He has a direction he was going in... let him at least feel it out the best he can before discouraging or slamming him for making the attempt. Yes, share your experiences, but evryone's experience has limits. Perhaps he is someone who can take an idea a little further than you thought of.

Absolutely, positively NO ONE here has tested all the various combinations of skills together,with all the classes with all the possible team make ups. True, the majority of stuff may not have any long term use, but not everything has to be a grand slam home run. Sometimes, even in poor builds, you can find one decent nugget of usefulness in what someone posts, and from that who knows how well a single idea may work in the right situation.

This isn't so much about this particular suggestion, but just about the attitude altogether. I dunno... maybe this sticks out to me because I used to teach for a couple of years. Learners grow better with encouragment while nudging them to explore both the depth and limits of their ideas. He'll be a better "builder" as time goes on if he isn't made to feel bad just for trying.

Spura · Sep 02, 2005, 12:04 PM // 12:04

So as a teacher you encouraged people when they went into the wrong direction to just ride it out and see where it takes them?

Photeus · Sep 02, 2005, 12:15 PM // 12:15

Why not? If someone comes up with the wrong answer when they are running thermodynamics calculations, and can't seem to get it perfectly right with the current formulas...why not ride it out and see where it goes? Yeah, you'll probably find out where your errored in the end (teaching you how to not make that error again) or you'll discover something previously undiscovered.

Let people explore their ideas...some ideas have been around for so long people haven't explored all the possibilities of them yet. Sometimes new ideas really are plain bad...but maybe the person coming up with them will learn that, then be able to turn a bad idea into a good one.

Nash · Sep 02, 2005, 01:49 PM // 13:49

What then, is the point of this forum, if we are all to allow everyone to make the same mistakes over and over? I guess we should close this forum then, so everyone can do trial and error and noone can learn from others' experience.

If that's how you feel, begin with yourself, and stop posting here. Bye.

asdar · Sep 02, 2005, 02:16 PM // 14:16

Well said Arredondo and Nash you might know GW a fair amount but you have a lot to learn about life. You added nothing to this thread and should just get out and start an elite mesmer thread where I'm sure someone will appreciate you.

Nash · Sep 02, 2005, 02:23 PM // 14:23

I have offered valid input, in my own fashion. You people have stated you find offering any input on builds is bad, and effectively that this forum should be abandoned.

I guess you can join arredondo and his fan club and leave this forum too then.

asdar · Sep 02, 2005, 02:42 PM // 14:42

Scaphism offered input, you flamed. The difference between the two posts is pretty obvious. He gave valid reasons for why he felt the build wasn't as good as it could have been and tried to show what might be a better way.

Your post was a flame fest and didn't add a thing. Your post hurts this whole Gladiator's section of these boards because now other people that want to post builds will avoid it because they don't want people like you to do exactly what you did to the original poster.

If you have absolutely nothing to add to a thread you should move on. There's no requirement that I know of to post rudely on every single thread.

Nash · Sep 02, 2005, 02:46 PM // 14:46

Ah, the irony. Scaphism pretty much posted the same thing I did, just in a different way, and more extensively. I guess you don't know what a flame is. I may be blunt or even rude, but it's not a flame.

Ah well, everyone has their opinion. Fortunately I don't have to abide by everyone else's.

Sekkira · Sep 02, 2005, 02:51 PM // 14:51

Eh, I didn't see any flaming or personal attacks in Nash's first post here. All I saw the the complete and absolute truth. Other then his first line saying that all the skills there are trash. I'm sure some of them could be used in different skill sets to be effective. But I really cba looking to find out exactly what they do again. *is bad with names*

Nash · Sep 02, 2005, 02:57 PM // 14:57

Actually, I've started working a bit on a list of all the trash skills you should never use, and Soul Barbs and Wastrel's Worry are both prime candidates.

White Designs · Sep 02, 2005, 03:04 PM // 15:04

A flame generally contains a personal element to it, not just a blunt criticism to the build that was posted.

More Useless Skills: anything starting with Mind (Freeze, Shock, Burn, Wrack)