Curse

Lorelei · Jul 12, 2005, 01:08 AM // 01:08

In another game, where each and everyone looks the same, I am a stat freak. But somehow in this game, I find that my character may not be optimum, may not have the most worth armor or weapon, by good grace, she actually has a pet! But my character is probably more lifelike that way. Not everybody drives a BMW, not everyone has millions in the bank. And it makes me feel better that yes, my character survives despite her flaws.

Just that a knight boot, an escalon helmet and a gladiator chest piece looks like am piecing together stuffs I bought from bargain stores. Doesn't look good.

I guess I'll stay in PvE for a long time, so I don't need to have the best gears. Oh wait, it may look cool to have the rag-tag look of mismatched armor gear. I didn't think about that. Yeah, she woul buy a piece of armor at a time, whenever she could afford it. A lay-away plan....

Happy stat-ing people.

Phades · Jul 12, 2005, 01:27 AM // 01:27

I have been skeptical about the issue of stacking in armor bonuses as well. Some things would imply by location, like the +AL bonuses, while others would imply universal in the cases of - damage received. If they didnt stack, it would make no sense at all to have shields in the game with - damage received while the runes exist, as the shield is applied to all damage. Then again there are redundancy issues with tanking, such as warriors using stances, or shout, with +def and a shield rendering the +def from the armor useless. This is much in the same stance that armor of earth doesnt really seem to benefit a warrior compared to using it with a caster.

Strong Fist · Jul 12, 2005, 04:50 AM // 04:50

Knight's armor doesn't look cool. Platemail is awesome, except the random/stupid warthog on it.

Tourist · Jul 12, 2005, 08:01 AM // 08:01

Platemail looks ok except for the shoulders of the chest piece...Utterly ridiculous, looks like someone stuck giant frisbee chunks onto your shoulderpads, maybe an attempt to play "peek-a-boo" with the local kids. Other than that it's ok, but in general Knight's looks a whole helluva lot less silly. That 15k Dragon Armor has kinda caught my eye though...

CHunterX · Oct 26, 2005, 09:32 AM // 09:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iron Amadeus

Platemail is 85 armor: Dmg taken from everything is 64.8%
no dmg absorbtion
+20 to melee is 105 armor: Dmg taken from everything is 45.9%

Platemail is +10 vs Melee, your whole arguement falls apart there. Knights would be better than Platemail, if the rest of your information is correct. Although Gladiator w/Ascalon Helm is the best overall. It has +20 vs physical and the energy boost.

pork soldier · Oct 26, 2005, 09:39 AM // 09:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by CHunterX

Platemail is +10 vs Melee, your whole arguement falls apart there. Knights would be better than Platemail, if the rest of your information is correct. Although Gladiator w/Ascalon Helm is the best overall. It has +20 vs physical and the energy boost.

Unless you wanted a denravi lt helm and glad set with knights boots for half length hexes

CHunterX · Oct 26, 2005, 09:49 AM // 09:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by pork soldier

Unless you wanted a denravi lt helm and glad set with knights boots for half length hexes

Denravi "LT" helm, I'll have to check this out. The first armor I ever bought was Droknars Forge, so I haven't checked out lower armors on my warrior. I will check now, though I doubt anything from Denravi has max armor.

Update: I did test it, it is halved. I'm starting to like this helm, except I already have a 15k Ascalon Helm, and it feels great to say: I have a full set of 15k armor, and the strongest shield in the game. Although I might start using the helm in mesmer-heavy battles. Thanks for the tip, pork soldier.

Mentalmdc · Oct 26, 2005, 10:31 AM // 10:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iron Amadeus

Here's the breakdown guys.

Now lets look at melee if i hit for 30dmg
Knights is 80 armor
has -2 dmg reduce
+10 to melee.

59.5% of 30 = 17.85dmg

Total melee dmg taken is 17.85 with knights

SHOULDN'T THIS BE 15.85 BECAUSE OF THE -2 DAMAGE REDUCTION?

Plate is 85
no reduction
+20 to melee

45.9% of 30 = 13.77dmg

Total melee dmg taken is 13.77 with plate.

So the is no difference in overall dmg, and platemail has an advantage over melee.

Advantage Platemail by 4 dmg.

my question is in caps in the quote....

Battle Torn · Oct 26, 2005, 01:37 PM // 13:37

I wear Platemail with knights gloves and absorption rune and in my opinion that combo works best. I laso have -2 damage reduction from shield but im trying to test if that stacks ie -2 gloves -2 rune -2 shield = -6. Basically it makes sense to combine the greater al of plate with the global damage reduction of knights and lookes the best in my opinion.

Lim-Dul · Oct 26, 2005, 02:50 PM // 14:50

Yup - this is actually the best combination - that is Platemail + Knight's Gloves / Boots. And yes, the damage reduction from runes and shields (and skills for that matter) stacks on top of that.

When it comes to the calculations:

They're wrong anyway since the people have provided wrong data.

Platemail is AL85 + 10 vs Physical
Knight's Armor is AL80 + 10 vs Physical and -2 damage reduction

The question is actually NOT which set is better, but why one should wear a whole Knight's Set. The damage reduction from each piece doesn't stack with the damage reduction from the others so by actually wearing a Platemail Set with some low hit-zone-ish Knight's Pieces (Boots/Gloves) you get the best of two worlds. You can't do it the other way round, that is by wearing only Platemail Boots/Gloves you don't get any particular boni at all except for the increased armor on the given body part.

Should we really judge both armors on the basis of their usefulness, then it becomes immediately clear in what situation the given type excels. Knight's Armor protects better against low-damage attacks and Platemail protects better (and in fact MUCH better) against spike damage. Since steady low DPS is easier to deal with than a sudden rush of spike damage I'd go for the platemail armor anyway.

NEVERTHELESS I have to remind you yet again that wearing a whole set of Knight's Armor is completely pointless - unless you like the looks of it - which is sad, but true. You simply don't get any boni for wearing more than one piece, so why bother?

P.S. As for the gladiator armor fan boys out there. Yeah - it offers good physical protection and it gives you an energy boost. Nevertheless it is weaker against any kind of magical attacks which are in fact the ones that deal the most damage. By boasting with your additional defense against physical damage you would automatically admit, that as a warrior you spend your time mostly on beating up other warriors, which is pure nonsense. The energy bonus IS quite appealing and may be the real reason for choosing the Gladiator's Set. Nevertheless from my experience in PvP I've learned that the initial amount of energy you bring into the fight doesn't matter much. Well, yeah, you WILL be able to use a 5 energy skill one more time initially or a 10 energy skill and a 15 energy skill at once and you WILL be able to use some 25 energy skills (which usually cause exhaustion, which kind of makes them useless to warriors - no matter which armor you wear), but then what? Then you're stuck with your pitiful 2 arrows of energy regeneration (2/3 point per second) and then you can shove all your energy boni where the sun don't shine. Even worse - since you may have brought some high-energy skills with you, you will be saving your energy most of the time and meanwhile get beaten to death because your weaker armor.

To sum it up: While there might be some debate over the usefulness of the Gladiator's Set vs the Platemail Set, there surly should be no debate about the usefulness of the Knight's Set. It simply sucks as a whole. You need only one piece - the rest you can throw in the litter bin.

Yukito Kunisaki · Oct 26, 2005, 03:24 PM // 15:24

I searched and came up with nothing because nobody talked about it but...

Does Wyvern Hauberk resist magical damage the best of all the chest pieces? [since a majority of magic attacks strike your torso vs. your legs...]

I tested it but the numbers didn't seem 'worthy' enough as proof or just plain luck...

I wear Ascalon Boots [which have the reduced dmg modifier as well and I'm guessing it too works like knight boots] and a dragon chestpiece which I've read a while ago reduces damage dealt by a majority of auto-hitting magic attacks...

If Wyvern doesn't resist latently magical damage, I might just ditch it for a platemail chest piece... [i dislike getting hit by magic... a lot...]

Lim-Dul · Oct 26, 2005, 04:12 PM // 16:12

The Wyvern Armor has exactly the same stats as the platemail armor. And not all spells hit your chest - some hit e.g. your head. =)

CHunterX · Oct 26, 2005, 04:21 PM // 16:21

Quote:

Nevertheless from my experience in PvP I've learned that the initial amount of energy you bring into the fight doesn't matter much.

I was speaking from a PvE standpoint. I have 0.2% experience in PvP. In PvE your going to be TAKING a beating from Physical, whether your fighting a physical-damage enemy (unless you're a bad tank, have bad elementalists), thats why the +20 vs physical is handy. Also, some solo/farming builds rely on the energy boost from Gladiators, but again, this is all from PvE standpoint, I never seriously play PvP. Also, the original poster was asking about PvE armor (I think he said something about reaching the desert).

Miyamoto Orita · Oct 26, 2005, 05:12 PM // 17:12

The other day I was asked to help a friend out with a TA build. He asked me to build an Axe Warrior/Ranger. He listed the skills, attributes weapons and then the armor. I used the Axe Mastery +1 Helm with Sup Rune. Platemail Chest w/Sup Abs, Lengthen KD Gloves w/Major Strength, Patemail Leggings w/Sup Abs, and knights Boots w/Sup Vigor. I was little curious as to why 2 Sup Abs Runes, as we all know Sup Abs doesn't stack. His response was, "I know they don't stack, but if the damage is directed towards the leggings or chest, you'll reduce that site specific damage better than if you were to only have 1 Sup Abs on." Now I haven't tested this theory, nor will I try, but seeings as he's a rank 6 player, I figure him to know a little bout the game. Please let me know if this is accurate.

entropy · Oct 26, 2005, 05:22 PM // 17:22

Absorption runes go throughout the whole entire body. I am almost sure about this. He says he knows they don't stack but then he contradicts himself by saying the damage would be less with 2 runes. So if it doesn't stack what effect would it have? lol rank does not = skill or knowledge atm

Rancour · Oct 26, 2005, 05:22 PM // 17:22

Hmm, I believe there was made a test about that Mayamoto and I think your friend is wrong. Not that I tested myself...

It has been "decided" so to speak that the Absorbtion, wether from Knights, Ascalon or runes, is global, meaning that if you have -3 damage it will NOT stack and work all over your body no matter where you get hit.

I haven't tested but it sounds logical to me... Also, does it REALLY matter that much? I mean, come on. Having extra defence on your chest because you think you'll get hit more there sounds a little pointless. I know there's a bigger chance, no doubt, that you'll get hit on the chest but wouldn't it be a lot simpler and easier if you just got some max armor and used it all over, put a rune on one of the pieces to get the Absorbtion and leave it at that? Pondering wether it should be on the chest or the legs really doesn't matter that much, since there's only a, what, 12% difference in hit-chance?

sleazeh · Oct 26, 2005, 05:33 PM // 17:33

Runes of Abosrbtion are not location specific, and do not stack; they provide global damage reduction regardlesss of hit location.
So despite the Rank 6, the player is misinformed, and is wasting the second absorbtion rune.

smurfhunter · Oct 26, 2005, 05:34 PM // 17:34

my question is does mending stack with an absorbtion rune?

Lim-Dul · Oct 26, 2005, 05:35 PM // 17:35

Two runes make absolutely no difference whatsoever. He'd better spend his money on another kind of rune. Unless he's a total show-off and likes to brag around by using two expensive runes instead of one.

And as for the Gladiator's Armor and PvE. Yeah - that's absolutely right. Gladiator's Armor would be the best for PvE especially since you can regen your energy between fights. Nevertheless it becomes less useful in the Ring of Fire missions and the Fissure and Underworld where you will almost exclusively deal with non-physical damage.

Call me mister stupid, but I still like the superior protection my Platemail-Knight's Gloves-Superior Absorption combo has to offer. I mean - monsters in the Underworld dealing like 0-10 damage to me when using the right skills (doylak signet, armor of earth) can't be wrong. ^^

Quote:

my question is does mending stack with an absorbtion rune?

What has mending to do with damage absorption? It just gives you additional arrows of HP regen. So in that matter they stack, right - cause they are different things. ;-) But if you meant skills that give damage reduction, like Shielding Hands, then the answer would be positive too - they all stack with your items.

Alone) · Oct 26, 2005, 05:40 PM // 17:40

I say that the absorptional runes are still debatable. Test it for yourself and find your own conclusions.

And back to Yukito, Platemail and Wyvern are the same, in my opinion. Switched back and forth.