Curse

Tronny07 · Jan 13, 2006, 12:59 AM // 00:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by XvArchonvX

I think a spiker team is the only team that can get away with dropping frozen before ensuing in battle since they kill so quickly (when done right). All builds can benefit from it as long as they keep a good eye on the battle and drop it at the right time.

id like to disagree,spike teams are only as good,as the other team...trust me...ive gone against a good random build team...our teams spike took lesst hen 1/4 of theri bar,and this is with 2 healers,order,and 5 spikers(not usually my build,friend wanted to see it in action)...and appearantly in tombs,ive been seeing this often,2 bodners,2 healers,1 trapper,3 warriors...and if u ask me,its one of the best builds ive ever seen(unless ur an ele spike group,using obsidian falme,and so on,but going against it in spiking,sucks)usually,its either 1 order,or tainted,isntead of trapper...but ill go on...the bonders seem really experienced,cause 3 warriors rushed us,did the usual build,someone choking,then another incenidary(interrupt build,was expecting monks,but we played on,cause it was 5-6 in the morning,and we starting getting tired...)k,well we almost hit topk,but that unique team went against us,in a 4v4/2v2-2v2...and bonders,appearantly bonded the warriors amazingly,they rushed us,took out frozen soil,winnowing,and fw...and as it went on,we got raped and raped...so frozen soil,isnt only for spike groups only...but not to wrong,yes i agree almost all spike teams use frozen soil,but im jsut saying most of the time it doesnt work

Lambentviper · Jan 13, 2006, 01:09 AM // 01:09

meh, my IWAY group got owned by this necro spike/Elementalists' Wards group.

Guardian of the Light · Jan 13, 2006, 01:15 AM // 01:15

What about the Shield of Judgement ^_^

"LETS GET THIS MONK!!!!! WHAT THE HECK WERE ALL GETTING KDed.....THEY MUSST BE HACKING!!!!!!!!111"

Also running in circles when the IWAY warriors are on you does pretty good ^_^.

a cadet · Jan 13, 2006, 01:46 AM // 01:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Divine Elemental

Will be Bad.
leaving him imobile

Much less imobile than a bonder; compare the 2 second casting time of Blessed Signet with the 3/4 second casting time of Restore Conditions.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Divine Elemental

and Spam Restore?....
id rather Take SoD it solves all ur needs
itll also put alot of pressure on his energy.

I think people underestimate the extra healing Restore Conditions can do; against a heavy condition team (such as IWAY), Restore Conditions is almost like a Heal Other.

Ranger Li · Jan 13, 2006, 02:12 AM // 02:12

*Gasp* maybe we should use hexes!!!!

Shadow of Fear, Faintheartedness, Spiteful, Blurred Vision, I could go on forever

defences? - Ward Melee, Aegis, Bonders, Shield of Deflection, Guardian

Dont be a noob team - key requirement, if your team is seasoned even the least bit, everyone knows steps that must be taken ex reduce spirits, make sure EoE's dont get up, immoblize adrenaline upkeep, kite if needed, i can again go on forever...

I won't cause im tired.

LifeInfusion · Jan 13, 2006, 02:17 AM // 02:17

If you cannot defeat IWAY it usually means you didn't come prepared with debuffs and defense.

Most damage dampening and defense works against IWAY, as well as mesmer and necro debuff hexes.

My fav's : Ward vs. melee, Ward vs. Harm, Armor of Earth, Insidious Parasite, Spiteful Spirit, Enfeeble, Soothing Images.

Tronny07 · Jan 13, 2006, 04:27 AM // 04:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ranger Li

*Gasp* maybe we should use hexes!!!!

Shadow of Fear, Faintheartedness, Spiteful, Blurred Vision, I could go on forever

defences? - Ward Melee, Aegis, Bonders, Shield of Deflection, Guardian

Dont be a noob team - key requirement, if your team is seasoned even the least bit, everyone knows steps that must be taken ex reduce spirits, make sure EoE's dont get up, immoblize adrenaline upkeep, kite if needed, i can again go on forever...

I won't cause im tired.

not to be offensive,but i think ur stating the obvious,only thing is,if ur doing topk,and u have an iway setup build,and u go against a spike,ele,necro spike,well isnt that uselses?and obviously u want to stop adrenaline,and eoes,its not hard neither,all u really need is a good team...

Divine Elemental · Jan 13, 2006, 04:41 AM // 04:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by a cadet

Much less imobile than a bonder; compare the 2 second casting time of Blessed Signet with the 3/4 second casting time of Restore Conditions.

I think people underestimate the extra healing Restore Conditions can do; against a heavy condition team (such as IWAY), Restore Conditions is almost like a Heal Other.

... I'm not saying that Restore is a bad skill....
it indeed is good / but id rather have SoD which hmm dodges 79% or so?
Spammable Too

Restoring isnt bad.. its indeed better than martyr / but since... SoD is somuch useful and canc outner any Ranger / Warrior group.. id rather have it ^^
but Martyr puts less pressure on the monk...
a prot with sod can solve this alrdy
but a healer with martyr is viable too.

Blessed Signet eh... Its Recharge might take some time... but i mean cmon.. decency
every iway hits anyone. which Triggers Bals Spirit on bonder.. which results in a Shitload of Energy...
think about it. if ur prot cant maange 4-7 Bonds... i feel bad for him.

munkieix · Jan 13, 2006, 04:43 AM // 04:43

dont forget corpse control ^^ usually mesmer wit fast cast consume corpse = dead taint necro no wells, and putrid ^^

Divine Elemental · Jan 13, 2006, 04:47 AM // 04:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by munkieix

dont forget corpse control ^^ usually mesmer wit fast cast consume corpse = dead taint necro no wells, and putrid ^^

u dont really need a fast cast mesmer ;D

just a normal Nec would do

Stayfrosty · Jan 13, 2006, 04:51 AM // 04:51

get like 2-3 tactics Riposte warriors on your team.... that should be enough to take on 6 IWAY warriors easily

2_fingers · Jan 13, 2006, 05:14 AM // 05:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Divine Elemental

u dont really need a fast cast mesmer ;D

just a normal Nec would do

The argument for fast casting mes is that with a fast casting nec using nectrotic travesal consume corpse and/or putrid explosion, he will target corpses much faster than the necro - so much so that unless there's alot of bodies, the tainted flesh necro would be denied his corpses. I've played a tainted necro and its the fastcasting mesmers who annoy me

If you wanna go anti iway, u got to be prepared for iway - usually the biggest problem with iway is that its fast - if done correctly, the warriors drop their sprits and get to the enemy ASAP before they can organize themselves etc.

One thing though - Spiteful Spirit only works on idiot warriors. The better ones would stop attacking. Usually things like Shadow of fear + enfeebling blood would help provided u can get as many as possible, while trying to shut down their orders nec.

Aegis and Guardian cant help unless u got some means of shutting down their dmg. Similar with wards. They are more "defensive" in nature. Put it this way. Evading and blocking - the good warriors know what to do if they see that happening. Sure, it would stop alot of the n00b iway teams - bur not everyone.

A big % of the dmg comes from winnowing and the orders necro. A good orders necro is responsible for feeding dmg, health, (and adrenaline)- take out the orders if possible. The Trappers are there to annoy and protect the necros.The good IWAY team would try its best to hide the orders guy - either by charging the opponents so they got no time to be offensive or making sure the orders guy is out of sight. The spirits shut down your OWN monk and deal bonus dmg for them. Of course, this is what the better teams do. Most of ur tombs IWAY PUGS are not that versatile. (Watch Math in action-though they do have some minor differences from the regular iway team)

If you want to stop IWAY, be prepared - not only interms of skillset but do plan out what you guys are going to do if u meet iway - so that everyone knows exactly what to do when they meet iway (which is very likely in tombs). Take ur time before u click that "enter" to make sure everyone knows exactly what to do against iway.

munkieix · Jan 13, 2006, 06:05 AM // 06:05

when all those pets die ... lots of bodies fast casting helps alot, or if u using a necro remeber those bOOts

Divine Elemental · Jan 13, 2006, 06:36 AM // 06:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by munkieix

when all those pets die ... lots of bodies fast casting helps alot, or if u using a necro remeber those bOOts

u wont need every single corpse

i know the purpose of Fast Cast Mesmers... right before R SPike was invented..
having a necro with Consume is enough.. and it dedictaes more use than a fast cast mesmers.. [ thats just me tho]

thats just my 2 cents..
that id rather have a Utility Necro w Consume + Profane rather than a Fast Cast.
either way Th Corpses are Removed.

JR · Jan 13, 2006, 09:54 AM // 09:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by munkieix

when all those pets die ... lots of bodies fast casting helps alot, or if u using a necro remeber those bOOts

The boots are useless at the moment, untill Anet impliments corpse exploitation skills with a cast time of over 3 seconds.

Elrodien · Jan 13, 2006, 12:28 PM // 12:28

Well, there are big rumours going around Euroland that IWAY is getting a nerf after all. So, all this effort may come to nought.

Maybe the frog has been talking ?

Patrograd · Jan 13, 2006, 01:50 PM // 13:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2_fingers

One thing though - Spiteful Spirit only works on idiot warriors. The better ones would stop attacking.

Thats fine with me. A warrior that isnt attacking is a warrior thats as good as dead. My experience would be that there arent that many warriors good enough to even notice, its a bit like (off topic) scourge healing....

TheOneAndOnlyX · Jan 13, 2006, 02:13 PM // 14:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elrodien

Well, there are big rumours going around Euroland that IWAY is getting a nerf after all. So, all this effort may come to nought.

Maybe the frog has been talking ?

No the frog said he is MORALLY opposed to IWAY which means he is offended that iway sacrifices animals to use the the skills IWAY

a cadet · Jan 15, 2006, 04:30 PM // 16:30

The corpse control isnt entirely a matter of how long it takes the spell to cast.

Its a bit more complicated, if you have 1 person on a team just sitting there, waiting for a corpse to pop up (it hardly matters if hes using a game pad, it isnt that important), even if his fastest casting spell is 1 second you can easily get the corpses faster than a mesmer with Consume Corpse. Mostly because the mesmer isnt usually waiting for corpses too, especially if a corpse comes up mid-cast, most mesmers will complete the spell and then consume the corpse. Probably not as true vs IWAY since there the mesmer is most likely waiting for corpses, but in either case its a comparison of 2 people; 1 is expecting corpses and is ready to use the appropriate skill, the other can deal with them faster, but isnt as actively watching out for them.

Then theres the question of energy. As a Necro, if you take several corpse related skills, you *should* have enough Soul Reaping to be able to always use that spell. A mesmer with Consume doesnt nescessarily have the energy to use it, so there is also that slight advantage.

However, vs IWAY the corpse necro shouldnt really be alive. In a build with no healing, and as the only soft target required to stay within spell range of the corpses, there is no reason the necro cant be interupted/killed.

And the last comment on the skill Restore Conditions - its a great, spammable heal. On many occaisons, ive been able to save important players with the healing from it, while the Heal Monks were either dead or out of energy. Shield of Deflection is just a better version of Guardian, a skill i would only take in tombs out of nescessity (you simply cant capture the altar vs a ranger with Savage Shot otherwise). Ive had more success using Restore than Martyr, but its your choice in the end.

(Dont get me wrong - its not that Restore is always better than Martyr. In fact, if your team relies on physical damage from rangers and warriors, i would take Martyr over Restore. Its just from the standpoint of a balanced build, its more useful in my opinion)

darkMishkin · Jan 15, 2006, 05:54 PM // 17:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2_fingers

One thing though - Spiteful Spirit only works on idiot warriors. The better ones would stop attacking.

Pets are all idiot warriors.