Curse

Sofia Sofia Sofia · Feb 06, 2006, 05:40 AM // 05:40

Call me noob but I was wondering why the switch from using wilderness to using Marksmenship to buff your arrows? I mean sure RtW has gotten better, but you can still do more damage with a wilderness build especially if you use something like Double Shot.

If you're going Marksmen you might as well go R/Mo and use Judge's. Why aren't more people doing that?

Nowadays I see ranger spike groups with using doubleshot with just RtW. All that gives you is a %150 shot for 10 energy and one skill slot. Sure if 4 rangers all hit one target this can be devastating, but wouldn't it be better with kindle and Conjure?

Also this spike build is somewhat weak against IWAY builds, I mean sure you can use Sympathetic or Shadow of Fear, but you can't damage very well, can you? I mean monks can RoF or Distortion (which is actually useless against Kindle) so killing them with a ranger spike is not easy. The warriors themselves take little damage from arrows.

Ristaron · Feb 06, 2006, 06:22 AM // 06:22

Variety? Functioning on 4 hours of sleep and tonight looking like the same amount, that's the only thing I can think of in the time it has taken me to start and finish this post.

-Submit Reply-

Siliconwafer · Feb 06, 2006, 07:13 AM // 07:13

Most rspike these days is run with orders, which explains with JI isn't kept up (doesn't stack)-plus, JI is energy intensive, whereas orders are easy to put up. If the calculations are done, I think you'll find that orders have far more damage potential than kindle/ignite ever did. I don't think anyone used conjure if not for the fact that putting your faith in an easily stripped and painfully reapplied enchantment is bad.

When you factor in two/three rangers under orders with RtW and a PP+SD along with the spike, it won't care about RoF, and will still often go right through distortion.

dargon · Feb 06, 2006, 07:16 AM // 07:16

The reason for RtW is so that OotV, OoP and a few other skills will trigger. They require that you do physical damage, not elemental. Kindle converts your damage to elemental, in addition to adding to the damage you do, meaning it doesn't trigger orders. Back in the first guild I was in, we had one of the original builds for Ranger Spike, we didn't even rely upon default arrow damage, we simply used the buffs from orders and RtW and we could take down pretty much any target we wanted provided our timing on the spike was good.

JR · Feb 06, 2006, 08:24 AM // 08:24

"Read The Wind" also turns your bows into regular railguns, with a perfect spike basicly instagibbing a target. And as stated, orders are key, they add a large amount of damage to a spike. Kindle or JI would cause the orders not to trigger, as they convert the physical damage to fire or holy.

Nerdy · Feb 06, 2006, 11:39 AM // 11:39

Yep, orders are the key to the perfect spike. Most decent spike teams only roll with 3 rangers, allowing a mesmer to be brought into the mix.

However, rumours are rife that orders are going to be nerfed in the next skill re-balance.

I'm not sure how much this will effect the ranger spike builds but i'm sure 3 man spikes will no longer cut it?

Interesting to see iA running a balanced build last night in tombs and also the recent increase of Necro shadow spiking...

twicky_kid · Feb 06, 2006, 11:01 PM // 23:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nerdy

Yep, orders are the key to the perfect spike. Most decent spike teams only roll with 3 rangers, allowing a mesmer to be brought into the mix.

However, rumours are rife that orders are going to be nerfed in the next skill re-balance.

I'm not sure how much this will effect the ranger spike builds but i'm sure 3 man spikes will no longer cut it?

Interesting to see iA running a balanced build last night in tombs and also the recent increase of Necro shadow spiking...

Don't be surpised to see any nerfs to the necro's dmg since they have NEVER been nerfed since release. Smiting got nerfed to hell and back but shadow is exactly the same but never touched.

JR · Feb 07, 2006, 04:58 AM // 04:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by twicky_kid

Don't be surpised to see any nerfs to the necro's dmg since they have NEVER been nerfed since release. Smiting got nerfed to hell and back but shadow is exactly the same but never touched.

I would hardly say blood spike is anything close to where smite was at in the old Ether Renewal days. It is still a fairly weak and gimmicky spike that people shouldn't have much of a problem beating.

Sofia Sofia Sofia · Feb 07, 2006, 05:10 AM // 05:10

Yeah, I was just listening on my new guild to be over TS. Prep, Order 3, 2, 1. Simple and elegant I suppose.

Now that I look at OotV and do some quick mental math I see what you all mean. Just to clarify though: Kindle does not convert arrow damage to elemental, only the extra damage.

But then again, if you rely on physical, things like chain casted Aegis or Distortion can really bum your day.

Murder In China · Feb 07, 2006, 05:19 AM // 05:19

Kindle Arrows Does convert the arrow damage and the additional damage to fire.

JR · Feb 07, 2006, 05:31 AM // 05:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sofia Sofia Sofia

Just to clarify though: Kindle does not convert arrow damage to elemental, only the extra damage.

Yes, it does. It was fixed in a patch a good while ago. Observe my testing of the three common preps:

First up to the plate, Ignite Arrows:

Adds the AoE fire damage to arrows, does not convert the arrow damage from physical. Proof is the two +12 heals I am getting from the "Order of the Vampire" life steal.

Second, Read The Wind:

Again, no conversion from physical, so you see the two blue +12 signs.

Lastly, Kindle Arrows:

No blue +12 signs, so obviously the arrow damage is being converted to fire.

wheel · Feb 07, 2006, 08:53 AM // 08:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sofia Sofia Sofia

But then again, if you rely on physical, things like chain casted Aegis or Distortion can really bum your day.

Neither Aegis nor Distortion discern between physical and elemental damage.

Manfred · Feb 08, 2006, 02:15 AM // 02:15

ok, so now the question is: does the damage from rtw stack with fw, or have they STILL not fixed that?

Divine Elemental · Feb 08, 2006, 02:20 AM // 02:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Manfred

ok, so now the question is: does the damage from rtw stack with fw, or have they STILL not fixed that?

It Does now, They Fixed It

wheel · Feb 08, 2006, 06:08 AM // 06:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Manfred

ok, so now the question is: does the damage from rtw stack with fw, or have they STILL not fixed that?

It's been fixed for a long time.

Fr_3_aK · Feb 08, 2006, 07:36 AM // 07:36

Could've sworn i had a post here before... Anyway, gentlemen, behold:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7...3_ak/spike.jpg

My best spike is 102+95. So yes, you should swap to Marksman.

JR · Feb 08, 2006, 09:36 AM // 09:36

That's not a spike, this is a spike:

(With a Wilderness Survival prep, I might add)

<3 Wheel and Savio for assisting.

Fr_3_aK · Feb 08, 2006, 10:59 AM // 10:59

Mine was 1 man. 335dmg/3=jack all dmg compared to me.

JR · Feb 08, 2006, 12:33 PM // 12:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fr_3_aK

Mine was 1 man. 335dmg/3=jack all dmg compared to me.

But surely any real ranger spike would be using orders =) Admittedly the curses necro was overkill, but it was just experimenting, and the additional damage was negligible. I have little doubt that the arrow damage alone, with Ignite, Winnowing and Favorable would have topped yours anyway.

richirich · Feb 08, 2006, 06:11 PM // 18:11

cant you just roll the orders and curses necro into one? that would make things so much simpler...