Curse

Divineshadows · Feb 21, 2006, 11:58 PM // 23:58

I find it quite amazing that neither mesmer has distortion and neither boon monk has guardian, since this seems like a scenario for the casters to end up with their face in the dirt -- often. Perhaps this can be overcome by the players via skilled positioning, observing when they have become the target, and good kiting/movement. In response to Avarre's comment about making this build available to every random team with no imagination, I actually think that guilds lower on the ladder would have great difficulty running this build with success. All of the warrior hate seems to be concentrated in Captain Danjing's build (with the exception of a few skills on the ranger), which means that other guilds trying to follow such a build verbatum would either get wiped or forced to give ground once this player falls.

Dual arcane thievery seems to introduce quite an element of randomness to the match, but I think that the other mesmer skills focusing on heavy energy denial explains how match 1 turned from a WM advantage to a win for EvIL. The dual divine intervention also looks strange. I wasn't paying close enough attention to the monks while watching I was more interested in their warriors' and mesmers' actions. How were the monks using this skill? Were they immediately following it up with a cover enchantment like holy veil?

DarkSpirit · Feb 22, 2006, 04:57 AM // 04:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Patrograd

I dont think I have seen a warrior in GvG WITHOUT a healing signet for quite some time now - well on a serious team anyway.

There are many GvG warriors who prefer to bring Endure Pain instead. This allows them to tank temporarily before their monks drop a heal.

Evil's build is not easy to copy because their members are all very skillful. Depending on the situation, their warriors or their rangers can flag. Their warriors and rangers are less dependent on their monks, who are then free to concentrate on the other members. You need very good co-ordination and experience to make this work.

But do I think they have the best build-planners? Not really, which is the irony of this thread.

Schorny · Feb 22, 2006, 05:16 AM // 05:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkSpirit

Look at warrior 4. W/E Last of Master. The only stance he has is Frenzy. He doesnt even use Sprint to cancel it so once he activates Frenzy he has to take double damage for 8 seconds.

That's the joy and fun of a metagame.

Look at LuM for example, they ran a heavy defense against warriors. because they knew that they will only facing warrior heavy teams.

and frenzy is in a warrior heavy environment no problem. Because a warrior cannot spike you that fast and unexpected. normally you are miles away from their warriors. so you know when you are safe to frenzy...

we used to punish frenzy warriors with our blinding flash bot using lightning orb, but it was impractical due to the high energy costs... at the moment you can only punish the use of frenzy by using dom mesmers... and if you are getting drained it's very likely that you won't have energy for sprint left anyway...

Quote:

Not to mention Healing Signets, which is rare for GvG warriors to carry with them as it reduces their AL. They must be using their warriors differently to make this work.

nah... the don't be able to cancel frenzy thing is a bit riscy, but not that big of a problem. europeans/americans try to play safe and be more flexible with their build, so you normally are trying to be able to cancel frenzy any time...

but healing signet or endure pain is pretty common in gvg... that's why warriors are so strong here...

DarkSpirit · Feb 23, 2006, 05:10 AM // 05:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Schorny

nah... the don't be able to cancel frenzy thing is a bit riscy, but not that big of a problem. europeans/americans try to play safe and be more flexible with their build, so you normally are trying to be able to cancel frenzy any time...

Having a safer and more flexible build doesn't necessarily mean it is a worse-off build than a riskier one. If you have a risky build, you need more skill to play effectively which means it is hard for noobs to copy.

Thus, my point above.

ange1 · Feb 24, 2006, 03:36 AM // 03:36

wow no distortion for mesmer and no guardian, that's something

LaserLight · Feb 27, 2006, 05:34 AM // 05:34

Definitely lots of different stuff from EvIL in this sucker. None of the otherwise disgustingly prevalent Gale Axemen; hell, they were sporting an ever-pooed-upon Whammo, and a damn good one at that.

Really, from what I saw the Warriors' skills and skill were key to EvIL's victory. I'm not sure I would have had the balls to run without a few of the Monk's global defense boosters, but it obviously ended up working.

I also like Captain Danjang's use of Heal Party. It gave EvIL a bit of pinch healing outside the ever-spiked Monks, and if anyone's going to act as a backseat healer, it's an El. Good stuff all around, lots of fun to watch.

Patrograd · Feb 27, 2006, 11:47 AM // 11:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkSpirit

Evil's build is not easy to copy because their members are all very skillful. .

We ran a copy of this build for a few days, as we wanted to see how it worked. You're right, its not at all an easy build to play. Although it looks like quite a defensive setup it actually has to be played incredibly aggressively and with mind bending flexibility and perfect communication

its not the sort of build where before hand you can say "We'll split like this in this situation, or we'll stay together unless such and such happens". Doesnt work. What you have to do instead is have eight people who know precisely the limitations and strengths of their characters and know this instinctively and intuitively. These 8 all have to have a good grasp of the tactical situation and just do what needs to be done in any situation. While you can say this is true of any build to a certain extent, it is the most demanding build I have ever played in this respect. .

Still, its a good build to run for training people in the skills of self survival, initiative and tactical awareness, even if you dont yet have the skills to win much with it. I think you'd learn more as a team from running this than spike for example, even if you lost every fight you fought (as we did

)

QuuTip · Feb 27, 2006, 12:24 PM // 12:24

I thought I saw Bloodlight Eyes in one of those matches change from hammer to sword for a short while. Can anyone confirm this or is my memory playing tricks on me?

Also, what would be the reason for this? Build up adrenaline faster with a sword to spike with hammer adrenaline skills?

Avarre · Feb 27, 2006, 12:36 PM // 12:36

Bloodlight did indeed switch to a Flameberge (of defence most likely) and a cola shield at times. When I saw him do that, once it was when he was cut off from the rest of his team behind a gate.

My guess is he uses the sword and shield for the armorboost when he needs it, more than anything else.

SaintGreg · Feb 27, 2006, 03:42 PM // 15:42

Yes, I believe the sword and shield are for extra armor when you need it. Typically if you wanted to build up adrenaline fast and could not afford to be all the way into their team to be raging on someone with your hammer, you would use a wand so that you could wand away from the safety of your own line, then rush up, spike and rush back.

DarkSpirit · Feb 27, 2006, 05:21 PM // 17:21

Bloodlight seems to be more of a strength-based warrior while last master, tactics, which makes sense in this build. It doesn't matter that he is a W/Mo, he can be W/X anything since he is not using his secondary profession anyway and an E/Mo with heal party is a common strategy in GvG, so nothing surprising there.

Not sure how many points Bloodlight has in tactics to use a tactics shield, or maybe he was using a strength shield with a fortitude sword.

LaserLight · Feb 27, 2006, 10:30 PM // 22:30

Hm hm, showing my rookieness then. I can't do much GvG, so I don't have any direct experience, just observations and theory. Yeah, means I need to shut up and never post in this forum again, but hey, a guy can learn, can't he?

JR · Feb 28, 2006, 12:23 AM // 00:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by LaserLight

Hm hm, showing my rookieness then. I can't do much GvG, so I don't have any direct experience, just observations and theory. Yeah, means I need to shut up and never post in this forum again, but hey, a guy can learn, can't he?

Willingness to learn is what makes the difference between people with potential, and people who will always be scrubs.

[/ot]

jtchans · Feb 28, 2006, 12:27 AM // 00:27

What was Soul Weddings Blood Weapon Set I could not identify it?

Needle and Hook Blood?