Curse

Everyname Is Taken · Jan 03, 2006, 03:58 AM // 03:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dzan

I;ve played against MATH and let me tell you, they are special. They play IWAY head and shoulders better than any other IWAY we've ever faced.

If you think you can steamroll them, why don't you give it a shot?

Thats cause all they play is iway all the time which is virtually no skill. Its pretty much just sending a bunch of warriors in and hope for an edge bomb.

I pwnd U · Jan 03, 2006, 04:29 AM // 04:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by ignis

We used an earth build vs iWAY in tombs once. When the animal lovers gather round, you nuke 'em with eq/as. This is what happens.

that is amazing. quite impressive. that is actually a good idea, but u have to keep up kinetic armor and armor of earth and all that fun stuff otherwise ua re in trouble. also u have to protect yur monks but if u can do that on a regular basis to an IWAY group that mite become a real popular build.

Dzan · Jan 03, 2006, 05:32 AM // 05:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Everyname Is Taken

Thats cause all they play is iway all the time which is virtually no skill. Its pretty much just sending a bunch of warriors in and hope for an edge bomb.

If you think that there is no play skill involved in their game then you are in for a surprise when (if) you ever play them. I'm not a fan of IWAY, but they play it better than anyone else and they are highly successful with it. If you think they have no game, I hope you get to play them and see if it changes your mind.

And thanks for the dumbed down for my level summary of IWAY strategy, apparently I had no idea what we were talking about.

Markov Ada · Jan 03, 2006, 09:24 AM // 09:24

On the day MATH rose up the ladder, I think many guilds made the mistake of assuming MATH was using a tombs version of IWAY.

With this mindset, many of them attempted to send either a single or small assassination squad to take out their monks. Unfortunately, once that squad got there, they were annihilated by MATH's cirppling shot Rangers.

If you're running a pressure build, the main weakness of your build will usually be when the opponent has a heal party spammer (and the energy to support it) - MATH runs two. So the only way to get through is to shutdown or overpressure their monks. Since MATH has their monks as far back as possible, as well as 2 teammates that can handle protecting them, the best strat in my opinion is to bring the whole battle to their monks. Since they are not a spike build and since most teams carry enough condition removal that will be sufficient to handle crippling shot (as it's their only snare), they cannot punish an apposing team if they push and continually push. With continually pushing, the only option they have is to retreat and further retreat. Once they retreat far enough, you can pull back out, and mantain control of the flagstand. Repeat when they come back out.

Remember, sloppilly pushing forward will not help, your condition removaller will have to be aware of who's being crippled while pushing forward, otherwise, similar to the fate that many guilds face while retreating, a straggler will get killed. Furthermore, you have to lure their warriors far enough in an open space such that you're whole team can actaully pass through them without getting body blocked.

This is in my opinion the best strategy, also, to use against a life barrier monk if you don't have enough enchantment removal.

Akhilleus · Jan 03, 2006, 09:55 AM // 09:55

smite balls can absolutly annihilate iway, and do fairly well vs various other groups; though they have a high weakness to skilled ranger spike teams (particularly teams that run 4 rangers with barrage/judges and 4 with punishing/tigers/cholking as some of the skills).
that ahving been said, when signet of judgement is massed up it can do a substancial amount of damage, then immidiatly followed by a smite. if they are idiotic enough to try and get close, you run symbol of wrath for mass players, and bane signet followed by holy strike if they hit with 2 melee players...run 2 mo/ws for shields-up/watch yourself, 2 mo/es for wards/AS, 2 mo/ns for weaken armor, 2 mo/rs for fs/pred season (with 8 monks running heal area in a small group pred doesnt hurt you half as bad as it hurts the enemy.)

Maddie · Jan 03, 2006, 10:58 AM // 10:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akhilleus

smite balls can absolutly annihilate iway.

Lol short answer on this..
Iway needs one trapper, and you are done.

tafy69 · Jan 03, 2006, 01:15 PM // 13:15

I think ensign really hit the nail on the head with the tactics, control flag stand use up their sigs and dp them till they not important

Not easy but I guess thats the strat to do

Manfred · Jan 03, 2006, 01:23 PM // 13:23

Shadow of fear + soothing images. Game over.

One curse nec using those 2 skills as well as some SS spam and one death necro or /N to use up corpses before the tainted hits them is my recommendation for the easier IWAY counters.

JR · Jan 03, 2006, 03:47 PM // 15:47

This thread is not about how to change your build to counter IWAY, because that would just be stupid. It is about the tactics needed to beat IWAY with any solid build.

rii · Jan 03, 2006, 05:21 PM // 17:21

Well, some general shutdown is never to be sneezed on, depending on your set-up. Tatically, Ensign said it all. Control the flag and take your time. Although, apart from trying to gank thats more or less the general strat used against everyone.

tomcruisejr · Jan 03, 2006, 08:50 PM // 20:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lews

I love how MATH has their rank in their guild tag. they're so proud.

yep. using a "shitty" build to make it to top 50 is something to be proud of.

i love how people try to conceal sarcasm on their posts.

dbgtboy · Jan 03, 2006, 09:28 PM // 21:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lews

I love how MATH has their rank in their guild tag. they're so proud.

lews, you shouldnt make fun of something you havent tried, just a little scenario i came up with to show you what you are actually doing, just pretend we are friends in the scenario.

me: Hey man you wanna try some pizza
you: No, pizza tastes like crap
me: Have you ever tried pizza?
you: No
me: Just try it ffs
you: No, it tastes like crap
me: *in my mind* what a dumbass

back on topic, what ensign said is good but in order for that tactic to work you need to be able to kill the iway at the flag, because were gonna just keep exchanging flags at the stand right? so the team that dies at the stand usually ends up losing.

Kariston The Swift · Jan 04, 2006, 06:27 AM // 06:27

Also alot of top guilds are using very warrior heavy builds so naturally Iway will steamroll them with only a two monk backline. I watched Math's fight against WM and WM was running 6 W/Es and 2 Mo/Ns and naturally they got steamrolled because they tried to fight them straight out. If you ever come into this situation. You're only choice is to stay very close to your npcs and keep the flag stand until you dp them out like Ensign said. Over-extending is probaly the worst thing you could do against Iway.

Akhilleus · Jan 04, 2006, 06:28 AM // 06:28

i tried to psot the following earlier, but comcast, in its infinite greatness, decided to disconnect me...

Quote:

1: if you have an observant team they'd see a trapper and spike him, problem solved.
2: iway is an offensive build, trappers are not...they dont mix all that well
3: ONE trapper might be the cause of pain in CA or 4v4, but ONE trapper wont do that much in tombs, especially with EIGHT monks...aka X8 heal area, X4 mend ailment...

gotenks · Jan 04, 2006, 07:46 AM // 07:46

In 3 days, thanks to the observer mode I have seen Countless IWAYS (including MATH 6-7 times) defeated Flawlessly or very easily by various other builds. Almost 95% of them had one thing common :

- They all had a curse necro with SS/malaise/parasitic bond
- They all had a Warder
- They all had a Tainted/Putrid/well of profane Necro

Seems to me that these three enable you to be Anti-IWAY without being too specialized and loosing out to other builds. Although all teams that are observed are top notch, so player skill is definately something that is most important to being Anti-IWAY

Ensign · Jan 04, 2006, 07:53 AM // 07:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by dbgtboy

in order for that tactic to work you need to be able to kill the iway at the flag

If you can't kill players with minimal, if any, monk support, your team has problems much deeper than iWay.

Peace,
-CxE

Patrograd · Jan 04, 2006, 07:55 AM // 07:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by tomcruisejr

yep. using a "shitty" build to make it to top 50 is something to be proud of.

i love how people try to conceal sarcasm on their posts.

You see I dont understand the mentality of posts like this.

Do you have any concept of what is involved in getting anywhere near the top 50 of the rankings? if you think that you can get there with a 'shitty' build then you are sadly mistaken.

While it is true that GvG is more about tactics than it is build, you still need to have a solid build, especially in the top 200, more especially in the top 100. All MATH has done is take advantage of the current warrior heavy GvG metagame with what is the ultimate warrior build and as has already been said there is no-one plays IWAY as well as MATH. We have played a few IWAY teams in GvG and its always really easy to beat them, you dont have to be a genius to realise that MATH are playing it really well, much better than the other IWAY teams out there They have clearly changed something as they were rank 200ish until very recently.

credit where its due and good luck to them.

How to beat them? I would guess a solid tombs pressure/ss/migraine team with one of the monks converted to a runner is probably your best best bet against this and other warrior heavy formations.

BigTru · Jan 04, 2006, 12:27 PM // 12:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by tafy69

why is it that everyone thinks they are so good? seriously tho they run the same IWAY as 99% of the other noobs.

To make it to the top 50 with a build that is normally concidered "shitty" means you are a skilled player.

Just a few days agao, I saw XoO beat in GvG by a top 10 team (forgot who) of all Pre-made Paladins (except one, who was carrying Martyr and "To the Limit!").

Tell me that isn't skill...

C N Ro · Jan 04, 2006, 01:16 PM // 13:16

oh Maddie....i think noone likes us

its ok guys....if u dont like MATH...than...try to beat us :P

krammit · Jan 05, 2006, 09:27 AM // 09:27

LOL @ math. Mad respect for using IWAY in GvG that takes both moxy and skill. I laughed the 1st time we GvG'd against [MATH], as tafy mentioned they were incredibly impotent in dealing with a 2 team guild - the build that is being played by most top guilds these days. This isn't to say they are impotant however, I should give them the credit that they did efficiently mow down a path of unsuspecting guilds to get where they were.

They beat all the predictable guilds that run GvG spike, because then it becomes a close combat battle ground like HOH, and that's where they excel, and deserve to be exactly where they are in the standings through hard work and talented warcries.

Pretty much what protograd said