Curse

glountz · Apr 12, 2006, 01:16 PM // 13:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greedy Gus

Have you never watched the top 100 on observer mode, or read any hammer discussion topics over the last 6-8 months? Devastating has always been used, and combo'ed with bash if it fit on the bar. The reason to use devastating hammer is that it's the lowest adrenaline cost elite KD: can be used every 7 hits if not chained with bash.

I have. And I have played with hammer warriors, too.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greedy Gus

Earthshaker was almost never used in high level GvG (as far as I know), until a month or so after it got boosted to 8adren, and FnlD Warskull started making a few topics about it and using it. It's still rarely if ever used in GvG due to the infrequency of landing multiple KDs, while Devastating hammer is used often. Though in the past 2-3 months backbreaker has overtaken dev hammer in popularity.

So you're basically saying that popularity makes efficience. Sorry, but I must say: not always.
I've tried both. If the "infrequency of Multiple KD" means 2 - 3 multiple KDs/ battle, (what I often obtain when I play), it's okay for me. In fact, it sometimes completely turns the tide of a battle. 7 AD against 8 AD is not such a difference for me. If AD was such a problem, then Backbreaker would never have been so "popular".
I hope the value of Earthshaker over Devastating will be recognized one day.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greedy Gus

Tired of reading horseshit in hammer threads.

Thanks.

JR · Apr 12, 2006, 01:26 PM // 13:26

Let's not start taking things personally.

DarkAynjil · Apr 12, 2006, 01:45 PM // 13:45

i take Earthshaker usually when i have room for something like "To The Limit!" on my bar - otherwise, I like backbreaker.

JR · Apr 12, 2006, 02:16 PM // 14:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkAynjil

i take Earthshaker usually when i have room for something like "To The Limit!" on my bar - otherwise, I like backbreaker.

That doesn't make sense. Surely you would value "To The Limit!" more with Backbreaker?

projectnavi · Apr 12, 2006, 03:19 PM // 15:19

Devastating hammer is gonna make a strong come back with faction with the skill Auspicious Blow.

i used the build in TA at the preview event, and it was insanely good. hammer war with energy management, thanks a.net.

Empirism · Apr 12, 2006, 03:30 PM // 15:30

I like Devastating too more than backbreaker, i think is more for what is your style to play. Just my 2 cents

Byron · Apr 12, 2006, 03:49 PM // 15:49

This thread has now amounted to what most threads do: it depends on the build (this should be pvp rule #1 IMO).

So, to throw someting else on the table, there is a skill that I've seen to be overlooked: Bull's strike. I can't remember the guild, it might have been iB, maybe EW, but they ran a hammer with Bull's strike and backbreaker. In this way, the big recharge on backbreaker is solved, since bull's strike is pretty consistent KD (and crushing blow recharges in, what, 3 seconds?). The sacrifice was irresistable blow, but I think the swap was well worth it.

Of course, its possible to run bull's with any hammer KD on the bar. But a bull's followed by a backbreaker puts an enemy on his/her back for 6 seconds, and that power can't be ignored.

DarkAynjil · Apr 12, 2006, 04:03 PM // 16:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR-

That doesn't make sense. Surely you would value "To The Limit!" more with Backbreaker?

Yeah. Sorry, you know what i meant.

SerasCain · Apr 12, 2006, 05:56 PM // 17:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Byron

This thread has now amounted to what most threads do: it depends on the build (this should be pvp rule #1 IMO).

So, to throw someting else on the table, there is a skill that I've seen to be overlooked: Bull's strike. I can't remember the guild, it might have been iB, maybe EW, but they ran a hammer with Bull's strike and backbreaker. In this way, the big recharge on backbreaker is solved, since bull's strike is pretty consistent KD (and crushing blow recharges in, what, 3 seconds?). The sacrifice was irresistable blow, but I think the swap was well worth it.

Of course, its possible to run bull's with any hammer KD on the bar. But a bull's followed by a backbreaker puts an enemy on his/her back for 6 seconds, and that power can't be ignored.

Or you could just do Bloodlight's build from GWWC...which I do think came before iB right?

Backbreaker, Irresistable, Crushing, Bull's Strike, Rush, Heal Sig, Frenzy
i forget the rest but yeah

Edit: erm, unless the rest is res sig >.>

sh4ft3d · Apr 14, 2006, 02:41 AM // 02:41

Backbreaker is MUCH better for chains, but if your looking for sheer KDs, I would go with Devastating, Crushing, Hammer Bash, KD bonus skill like Holy Strike or AS(a bit energy intensive)

Seef II · Apr 19, 2006, 01:18 AM // 01:18

GvG hammer warriors can't fit anything above Crushing in their build, usually...

SaintGreg · Apr 19, 2006, 04:38 AM // 04:38

Quote:

and crushing blow recharges in, what, 3 seconds?

crushing blow's recharge is 10 seconds, still plenty short for its purpose though. Energy control is really what hammer has to worry about. You'd love to stay in frenzy most of the time, bull's striking kiters whenever it recharges, and still keep enough energy in reserve to hit frenzy -> backbreaker -> crushing -> irresistible, but in practice that is basically not posssible. You pretty much have to either save frenzy for spikes or use bull's strike very limited (or both). And thats the reason hammers don't dps as hard.

I usually use mighty blow instead of irresistible just because energy hurts. Irresistible is really nice as a basically guaranteed hard hit at the end of a chain though

. Cant have everything.

Byron · Apr 21, 2006, 05:59 PM // 17:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by SaintGreg

Cant have everything.

Nay, my hammer warrior looks something like this at the moment:

Backbreaker
Mighty Blow
Crushing Blow
Bull's strike
Frenzy
Rush
Heal signet
Rez

For GvG use, of course. The deal is, prots = pwnge. Its nice in practice though, using Bulls->Crushing while under rush until you get backbreaker charged for the 6 second KD chain. As you've said, though, frenzy needs to be saved for the chains.

MAdnRisKy · Apr 21, 2006, 06:18 PM // 18:18

I say this as someone who does not regularly play hammer warriors in GvG.

however... Earthshaker would appear to not need to hit to cause knockdown, whilst backbreaker does. That is not a trivial mater...

(to save you looking it up:

Backbreaker If Backbreaker hits, you strike for +1-16 damage and your target is knocked down for 4 seconds. This is an elite skill.

Earthshaker All adjacent foes are knocked down. This is an elite skill. (50% failure chance with Hammer Mastery attribute of 4 or less.) )

Greedy Gus · Apr 21, 2006, 08:34 PM // 20:34

That's incorrect, earthshaker has to hit the enemy just like devastating or backbreaker.