Curse

Ensign · Jun 21, 2006, 05:10 AM // 05:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Divineshadows

I still have questions about Ward v Foes though. Why not play all 3 wards?

Why not play all four? Space, really. It's hard enough to fit the first couple wards into a build, let alone the third. One of the troubles with wards is that they're almost always a splash, the guy who you're putting it on has some other core job and the ward is a (very strong) 7th or 8th skill.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Divineshadows

Your elementalist always has the option to drop Ward v Foes on your opposition's midline making your own warriors much harder to kite/handle...This ward is also quite useful in helping hold for a moral boost (Warrior's Isle comes to mind) or on GvG maps with several confined spaces (Burning Isle and Isle of the Dead).

You really can't make the other team stay in your ward. Sure Foes is nice for a few seconds until they can get out of it, but after that they really don't have to go into it again (unless you manage to cut off an important choke point). For the purposes of restricting movement on someone who doesn't *need* to be somewhere, any sort of direct snare functions a whole lot better. Now, when an opponent *needs* to move through a particular area, such as to run a flag in, or on a relic map in HA, ward foes becomes really effective. Those situations really don't happen often enough to justify the skill slot though, especially when your normal snares function perfectly well in those situations.

Don't get me wrong, I don't think it's a bad skill or anything, but I haven't seen it played seriously in months. Only times I've broken it out was to help on relic maps in builds that otherwise had a poor game there. When talking about GvG builds I'd actually rate Ward Against Elements higher right now.

Peace,
-CxE

LoyalSoldier · Jun 21, 2006, 05:44 AM // 05:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by LightningHell

ETHER PRODIGY~!

Great skill except I get annoyed that I have all these great elite skills, but can't use them because I need it for energy management.

LightningHell · Jun 21, 2006, 05:49 AM // 05:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by LoyalSoldier

Great skill except I get annoyed that I have all these great elite skills, but can't use them because I need it for energy management.

I can't think of any other good Elementalist Elites that is usable in PvP.

ThePadawan · Jun 21, 2006, 06:29 AM // 06:29

Elemental Attunement + Regular Attunement - dual attunement is your friend. (:

Aiiane · Jun 21, 2006, 08:20 AM // 08:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThePadawan

Elemental Attunement + Regular Attunement - dual attunement is your friend. (:

And the friend of the enemy mesmer.

Phades · Jun 21, 2006, 08:00 PM // 20:00

Its just a friend to mesmers in general. Those skills used together largely makes the total amount of energy available kinda pointless and re-directs the focus on recovery similar to how rangers operate, except that expertise is better.

LoyalSoldier · Jun 21, 2006, 10:31 PM // 22:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by LightningHell

I can't think of any other good Elementalist Elites that is usable in PvP.

Ah, but I have. I built a Shockwave build that used assassin's Death Charge. I would shadow step to an unspecting foe and unleash Shockwave, Crystal Wave, Tenali's Crystals, and Shock/AfterShock combo. I would also use different Armor skills to keep myself alive. It owned the average warrior because they expected me to run. The addition of Silver Armor made Warriors kill themselves. Of course the normal interupt builds I would have trouble with, but that is Ele in general.

The only down fall of the build? ENERGY! I tried using a different elite skill, but of course then Shockwave was my primary DPS in the build.

Mind Shock I had used in a GvG ele spike build. Though of course all the mind skills need some form of energy management.

neoflame · Jun 21, 2006, 10:50 PM // 22:50

^ RA's are not considered PvP for the purposes of skill or build discussion, and the Mind spells just don't cut it.

LoyalSoldier · Jun 21, 2006, 11:03 PM // 23:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by neoflame

^ RA's are not considered PvP for the purposes of skill or build discussion, and the Mind spells just don't cut it.

Didn't I just say GvG?

Vindexus · Jun 21, 2006, 11:10 PM // 23:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by LoyalSoldier

Ah, but I have. I built a Shockwave build that used assassin's Death Charge. I would shadow step to an unspecting foe and unleash Shockwave, Crystal Wave, Tenali's Crystals, and Shock/AfterShock combo. I would also use different Armor skills to keep myself alive. It owned the average warrior because they expected me to run. The addition of Silver Armor made Warriors kill themselves. Of course the normal interupt builds I would have trouble with, but that is Ele in general.

The only down fall of the build? ENERGY! I tried using a different elite skill, but of course then Shockwave was my primary DPS in the build.

Mind Shock I had used in a GvG ele spike build. Though of course all the mind skills need some form of energy management.

LoyalSoldier · Jun 21, 2006, 11:12 PM // 23:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vindexus

Hehe that is what you think. I didn't tell you all the skills. There is a reason I have assassin as a secondary.

I am not so stupid as to think the enemy won't run.

LightningHell · Jun 22, 2006, 12:26 AM // 00:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by LoyalSoldier

Hehe that is what you think. I didn't tell you all the skills. There is a reason I have assassin as a secondary.

I am not so stupid as to think the enemy won't run.

But your build is exceptionally fragile, and a Shatter/Draub would make your dear Sliver Armor useless. Not to mention you'll be stuck in somewhere on their frontline, trying desperately to run back.

LoyalSoldier · Jun 22, 2006, 01:30 AM // 01:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by LightningHell

But your build is exceptionally fragile, and a Shatter/Draub would make your dear Sliver Armor useless. Not to mention you'll be stuck in somewhere on their frontline, trying desperately to run back.

I took that into consideration. Like I said. You haven't heard all of my skills. Besides name a ele build that a Shatter/Draub doesn't have an effect on. Ether Prod, Attunement, ect.

The build is mainly for taking out casters who aren't paying attention. Warriors are a bonus. I built it for hit and runs in Aspenwood. It has worked in AB as well.

LightningHell · Jun 22, 2006, 02:41 AM // 02:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by LoyalSoldier

I took that into consideration. Like I said. You haven't heard all of my skills. Besides name a ele build that a Shatter/Draub doesn't have an effect on. Ether Prod, Attunement, ect.

The build is mainly for taking out casters who aren't paying attention. Warriors are a bonus. I built it for hit and runs in Aspenwood. It has worked in AB as well.

Ether Prodigy isn't that bad when stripped.

Attunements...well...I was never a fan for them.

And which caster or Warrior doesn't pay damned attention?

You aren't playing serious PvP if there are players who don't pay attention.

LoyalSoldier · Jun 22, 2006, 04:46 AM // 04:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by LightningHell

Ether Prodigy isn't that bad when stripped.

Attunements...well...I was never a fan for them.

And which caster or Warrior doesn't pay damned attention?

You aren't playing serious PvP if there are players who don't pay attention.

I used the term loosely. I generally mean that you shadow step on them, say in the middle of casting or when their attack is focused at another. If you hit Shockwave the instant you shadowstep you will almost always get them with the full blast. You then follow up with Shock/Aftershock and then a crippling skill so you can get the other two off. For safety in case of the Shatter Mez or I get in too deep I use Recall. In Aspenwood Recall works great for hit and run. A few other skills are added to round it off depending on the arena.

This build may not be choice in GvG or HOH, but it works well in just about everything else. I hardly use my elementalist in GvG or HOH anyways. My Necro and Ranger get more work there.

LightningHell · Jun 22, 2006, 04:51 AM // 04:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by LoyalSoldier

I used the term loosely. I generally mean that you shadow step on them, say in the middle of casting or when their attack is focused at another. If you hit Shockwave the instant you shadowstep you will almost always get them with the full blast. You then follow up with Shock/Aftershock and then a crippling skill so you can get the other two off. For safety in case of the Shatter Mez or I get in too deep I use Recall. In Aspenwood Recall works great for hit and run. A few other skills are added to round it off depending on the arena.

This build may not be choice in GvG or HOH, but it works well in just about everything else. I hardly use my elementalist in GvG or HOH anyways. My Necro and Ranger get more work there.

Such a huge aftercast...

And I think we were thinking of hugely different scenarios. I was thinking more of GvG.

LoyalSoldier · Jun 22, 2006, 04:58 AM // 04:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by LightningHell

Such a huge aftercast...

And I think we were thinking of hugely different scenarios. I was thinking more of GvG.

It does have a huge recharge, but the whole idea of the build was a hit and run. And with recall you can get back to safety. Though the energy issue was a problem.

It is priceless to do this on an elementalist who is using metor shower.

LightningHell · Jun 22, 2006, 05:04 AM // 05:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by LoyalSoldier

It does have a huge recharge, but the whole idea of the build was a hit and run. And with recall you can get back to safety. Though the energy issue was a problem.

It is priceless to do this on an elementalist who is using metor shower.

No, not recharge, although also that.

Aftercast. Aftershock has over one second aftercast, and Shockwave would have it, if it's anything close to the other PBAoE spells.

Ristaron · Jun 22, 2006, 05:08 AM // 05:08

Eles are a highly resilient class. Properly prepared they can outdo any class/build that isn't specialized against casters.
It's why nukers are in high demand in AvA right now, there is a large number of melee characters (such as touch rangers) who can be taken out in one swoop when they gang up on a monk for a few seconds.
An air ele with blinding flash can wipe the floor with a soloing warrior, and render an assassin's entire skillbar useless by catching him before he lands the first hit of the combo.

In PvE, AoE is a very powerful tool, especially AoE that doesn't cause mobs to disperse (Incendiary Bonds, Meteor, etc). I can't count how many times my Ele has played a pivotal role in a fight when all the monsters are at half health and crowded around her. Phoenix FTW.

Sadly, there are drawbacks to the Elementalist class. The first is long cast times that make them especially vulnerable to interruption, the second is their weak armour - which means they have to either avoid melee (kiting) or find a skill that fits on their bar that allows them to take hits (armour of earth, for example).

Basically, it's how you play an Ele that makes the difference.

Yes, I realize my post contributes nothing to the ongoing specific discussion. It was intended to be a broad answer, just as it's in response to a broad question.

LoyalSoldier · Jun 22, 2006, 10:56 PM // 22:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by LightningHell

No, not recharge, although also that.

Aftercast. Aftershock has over one second aftercast, and Shockwave would have it, if it's anything close to the other PBAoE spells.

Oh I see what you are talking about. You mean the animation after the cast. It hasn't really effected me much.