Curse

Wasteland Squidget · Jun 28, 2006, 06:08 AM // 06:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Poison Ivy

Just split up when you meet up against a SB.

SB is a pretty strong split build when played properly. In 4v4 they can do spikes which are far beyond what a single boon prot can deal with, though they're very limited by the recharge on Soul Barbs. They also usually have a lot of movement control in the form of water hexes, and can survive for a while against a squad of four with general-purpose hex spam.

Splitting can be a strong strategy against them, but ultimately it depends on the map. In thief maps their single spike can drop your thief and seriously limit your ability to move around the map. Split is a stronger play in maps like Druids or Frozen where you can move around freely. It's technically easier to fight 4v4 than 8v8 if you can force them to split rather than just locking you out and dominating your team at the flagstand.

Apok Omen · Jun 28, 2006, 06:37 AM // 06:37

Dragannia, umm, with NR in the build, the Hexes you suggested will be useless. NR = disasterous for Smite. Tranquility pushes Smite off the edge. Thats why I want to use as less damage/disabling as possible. With the long casts, interrupt is key here.

Healing Seed is NEVER used in GvG, for its long cast time, long recharge, short duration, and conditional healing. Putting that on a mesmer, even with 16 FC, is just asking for an interrupt. Diversion is a 3 1/2 second cast time to a Mesmer with NR up, so its asking for an interrupt as well.

And if anyone needs to Blackout being casted on, its the real threats: Monks. Wars are alrdy covered, more from the Flag-runner version.

Shadow of Fear is bad, as Mesmers, believe it or not, are the first targeted in GvG, not monks.

Believe me, I have put a lot of thought into this build whenever I change it.

And dude, I notice that you havent checked out my latest version, as if you would have, then you would have seen that Feedback WAS taken away, since this build had too many enchant removals to begin with.

Dragannia · Jun 29, 2006, 12:15 AM // 00:15

Hm, forgot about the NR. Problem with NR is that it hinders any team, not just the enemy's. You don't have enough healing output without a proper boon-prot, though if you had a Rit you might be able to manage (unless of course, they take Unnatural Signet, which I've seen many SB/RI do). Against a Blood Spike, Ranger Spike or a proper Balanced you'll get mightily disadvantage. Remember, SB/RI and Tripple Smite, while now proliferant, aren't the only builds out there with a power. I'm thinking Blood Spike right now. 3 interrupts are only going to take you so far; I wouldn't rely on them since they're far too slow to recharge to provide a defence against Blood Spike, or even FC Air Spike.

Apok Omen · Jun 29, 2006, 06:14 AM // 06:14

NR only hinders a team if theyre build focuses on enchantment and hexes in order to win. With my build, we dont use enchantments, and if we did, we would be smart and cast them OUTSIDE of the spirits range.

Yes, a Rt. would be good for this... thats why I stated that there were 2 versions of this build: Defense and Flag-running.

The Defense version has a Rt. in it, so it works out.

As for the other spikes, here are the possible strats:

B-Spike: Send two wars to two of their necros, and they will spend all the time healing one another. Thats about all that is needed to take down B-spike.

R-Spike: The reason as to why I placed an Infuser in the build. Plus, wars render the Rangers here, and the Orders necro is spending 4 second cast times per each order. Flag version, use BF to annoy the rangers. Defense version, Shadowsond, Union, and Shelter are R-spikes enemies.

FC Air Spike: Infuser, e-surge(not that effective, but oh well) war pressure (although they do carry conditions, but we also have condition removal) thats about it. Also, NR+ Tran will take care of their beloved enchantments.

Balanced: What does every balanced group use? Boon/prots, Hex Mesmers, etc. NR+Tran will hinder them, just not as well as what I was aiming for.

How many times must I say this??? Boon/prots in an NR/Tran build is BADDDDDDDDD!!!! This is the reason I and every other NR/Tran Guild out there use Heal Monks, its cuz using boon/prots is hazardous to them! 2 second gaurdian, 2 energy regen, etc.

*note* no build is going to have the perfect counters for every situation. No one is really prepared to face every other build out there. As I said, this is a counter to SB/RI and Trip Smite, so not really prepared to face B-Spike or R-Spike(though after the spirit-soul reaping nerf, I havent seen B-Spike in GvG at all. R-Spike is still in there, just hardly ever seen...) And Balanced is hard enough to face, especially with a build such as this.

frickaline · Jun 29, 2006, 01:49 PM // 13:49

I'd say that build looks pretty good, but if I were you, I'd remove channeling. I'd go with drain enchantment to provide further enchantment punishment, plus its better energy mgmt for a GvG, particularly in case of a split. Also, it seems to me you may have gone a bit overboard with the hex control. I know sb is a whole lot of hexing but you already have convert there, which would deal with a lot of it, then you have expel, remove, blessed light (x2), and inspired (x3). That seems a bit much to me. You could probably remove some of them and add in a bit more damage since this build hasnt got a lot of pressure.

Apok Omen · Jun 30, 2006, 08:54 AM // 08:54

Frickaline, the link at the first post isnt the current build. Read on thru the posts until u see the last link. That is the final build.

kryshnysh · Jun 30, 2006, 04:35 PM // 16:35

Yesterday's update:

Quote:

Fixed a bug that allowed the Retreat skill to activate in response to dead Spirits.

Guess no more Rt/W's with Retreat.

Aug · Jun 30, 2006, 07:39 PM // 19:39

They should just stop all skills from activating off spirit deaths unless they were explicitly created with that in mind. They keep "nerfing" skills related to issues with spirit deaths... I'd rather they'd just nerf 'em all and buff the skills that suck w/out employing spirit spamming.

Apok Omen · Jun 30, 2006, 11:08 PM // 23:08

Yeah, about the update, I guess we can only use the Flag-runner version now.
Oh well...
I don't get why they didn't fix RI yet...