Curse

fb2000 · Jul 29, 2006, 09:28 PM // 21:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by D I Z Z O

This was also the case of Unreal Tournament. The company (or companies) dont care about the people they care about sales and the MONEY. Its simple as that. Thats why when 2k3 & 2k4 came out they put in Bombing run, and Onslaught because it was simliar to all the other FPS games out at the time that were selling out and had 10x the amount of players playing at any given time. In came the waves and waves of newbs & underage kiddies smack talking and moving up the ladders because they played 24-7, used cheats, and had rich parents to foot the bill for their 6mb cable connections (or T-1,T-3s in college). So wonder how us old school players felt when we were overrun and didnt have what it took to compete anymore? Wherever you go its going to be like that. Every game has to expand and the options should be limitless. Therefore you draw in the masses. It just needs to happen in a balanced, logically, financially, mindful way then everyone can go home happy.

I wouldnt compare the progression of the unreal titles to the constant disbalances, broken engine, lack of enough PR to help fix bugs/xploits more often that most of the players experience in GW. the thing u mentioned about unreal adding new modes was just that- new modes of gameplay. on the competitive scene that changed very little - the players that dominated say Onslaught happened to be one of the best players in the "oldschool" TDM and CTF modes.no "noobs" ever got close to the top on any ladders.

In GW, anet is refusing to change some major problems with the "pvp modes", like how HA is "broken", major gameplay issues (getting stuck with no apparent reason..), and skill disbalances, which happen to apply to all "modes", be it gvg or whatever (though on different scale).

I know you GvG people are right, GvG is a more promising way to find some competitive gameplay, but this is simply because HA is considered "broken". Heck, even gvg isnt wonderland, ppl still whine how they get stuck, how the ritualist spams his spirit about a mile off the main battle, conveniently hidden behind something.

as for the players being assholes/playing only gimmicks, i think this emphacizes (jeez how do u spell that) the lack of interest on ANETs behalf. Just take a look at this weekend, I am sure that some people made like 1000 fame within 2 days, ive heard ppl say "thank you anet, before this build i never won after the zaishen, had 8 conseq with it today". DOGS and BvD have been sitting in halls literally _all day_ long today, i think we all know what their lineup looked like.. talk about "fame farm"

and i was hoping to get me the rest of the fame for r3 this weekend so that i could pug with some better success..

and on a side note, plz stop saying how IWAY takes no skill, how spikes take no skill,etc... its just a build, u have to get used to it.. like every build

art_ · Jul 29, 2006, 10:08 PM // 22:08

Pvp is dead, but it has been dead for a long time now.

HA is horrendous at the moment, and if you're not someone who can dedicate x amount of time every night at a precise time then its pretty difficult to find a competitive gvg guild even if the game didn't have its large number of flaws.

Realistically we basically have to accept that the game's more 'casual' team pvp HA, is dominated by joke builds which Arenanet refuses to do a thing about. The fame system is an utter joke, it should be reset every couple of months. In all honesty most people in this game have no idea whats going on, in part i put down to this game having both pvp and pve sections. I think that trying to make a game with high quality pvp and pve sections is impossible, because the two different groups of people demand different things. PvE will always have more players in an 'rpg-like' game such as guild wars so those are the players they most want to appease. Why else would they practically have encouraged iway all the time since it was created 9 months ago. Anet loves the idea of fame farming builds and supports grind in pvp because they think it is the only way to keep their customers. Emotes are a tangible reward and keep people interested in Heroes Ascent far longer than they might otherwise be. You only have to look at someone like Todbringende Saat, iway trapped all the way to r12. Do you honestly think that without the promise of an emote at the end he would have played to the extent he has? I doubt it. So few people buy this game primarly for pvp that grindable rewards are how Anet plans to attract bored pve-ers.

Therefore, whilst this game offered a new and exciting kind of pvp for me personally, I regard its attempt to create an enjoyable, competitive and accessible game for both pve-ers and pvp-ers a complete failure. People can be top players at this game and never find a good guild to play in unless they put aside their social lives and begin the grind. In HA there is a mindset amongst all players that rank = skill, and it is fair that experience should be related to skill, but it also makes HA practically impossible for new players and encourages all the trash builds as there is no way of playing how an individual gained their rank. As much a lot of GvGers like to think their part of the game is more accessible and varied, it really isn't. For the vast majority getting in a good gvg guild is based on who you know and your ability to ass-kiss in irc and vent, much less on your 'skill' level. In fact the idea that being successful in this game is based on skill is a total myth. A lot of the people who share their infinite e-wisdom on these boards and speak ill of the imba sb-ri spike etc are running equally questionable builds themselves.

PvP in this game is not for the casual player. The only people who can play this game with top players without themselves having had to grind out fame/ass-kiss certain people are ironically many of the games most vocal players; these people of course being those who have played pvp since the beginning.

The truth itself · Jul 29, 2006, 10:33 PM // 22:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frantic-Sheep

QFT

And its not ANET's fault, its the players

Exactly what i was thinking.

tomcruisejr · Jul 29, 2006, 10:44 PM // 22:44

its either you value rank or not. if you value rank, youll get annoyed by all those guys who get the highest ranks using the fast way and youll do anything to get that coveted rank asap. if not, you'll be gvging or doing anything for fun in this game now.

does it really matter if some people got rank 12 playing purely Iway ritualist or balanced monk or bloodspike necro or rangerspike orders or a lil mix of everything? no. its a team game. that means the team which they played with won a lot in HA (but the losses arent accountable for). are they skilled? maybe.

Wasteland Squidget · Jul 29, 2006, 10:51 PM // 22:51

Moving this to HA because it has nothing to do with any other PvP gametype.

HA is and always has been dominated by gimmick builds just because the way it's constructed rewards gimmick builds. If you want to run a gimmick build and grind, go play HA. If you want to play a game where actual player skill is seriously involved, play GvG.

Getting into a GvG guild can be tough, but it's possible. Post on the boards and check out IRC, make connections, and try to guest as often as possible. Once you know a few people it's much easier to get invites to decent guilds, especially those newly starting out. Once you're in a guild that regularly GvGs with the same players you should improve quickly, regardless of your initial skill level.

Another means of making connections and getting good is training guilds like XoO. Contact them and they might be willing to teach you some things and help you meet some people.

Formosa · Jul 30, 2006, 12:37 AM // 00:37

If you're an r10 balanced player complaining about iway I doubt you're any good... Warriors have the highest DPS in the game for a reason, which is that there are so many counters to it. I can agree with several of your points, although several of your presumptions are a little...bad. For example, I can guarantee you MATH is on vent when they play iway (I've seen them adrenal spike before). I can admit it does bug me at times seeing people who have done nothing but iway for their rank doing things like guesting for an r9+ GvG guild. I recently saw an R10 iwayer flagging for a guild on observer mode (I had suspicions and added their main character's name and it showed that the name they were using was the name they were currently on), and I wondered how it was exactly that playing a W/R Tiger's Fury warrior and occasionally a N/Mo Soul Reaping Healer with an orders spell gives you the right to guest for a good GvG guild. If you're going to rank up from iway to flash your tiger around please just stick to iway :|.

I've got to admit it does bother me when teams of mine beat a MATH iway who flash their tigers/phoenixes before they die.. Beating iway is easy though, kite around in wards, wand the trappers, kill things slowly but surely, and you can flawless even MATH.

Yunas Ele · Jul 30, 2006, 12:39 AM // 00:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by hadenuff

Firstly pvp now seems to favour the "noob" player factor with builds such as iway vimway bloodspike smite and ranger spike , your guaranteed to meet these builds whatever time of day you tomb , they need no basic skill to run and i can agree with the point that "noobs" need to learn to play the game but the problem is some "noobs" never move on (seeing rank 12 iway phoenix from math players ) makes the ranking system a joke gg anet

You need to remember not everyone is playing to become a skillfull 1337 player. Majority of the time I'm playing a "noob" build. But you know what? I'm enjoying it and I know my team mates are too. Remember, this is a video game. Last time I checked video games were made to be fun. As long as I'm having fun, I really could give a **** if the 1337 skilled balance players think I'm a noob.

Quote:

Originally Posted by hadenuff

Im not bitching either because i havent got a phoenix , i have got all my rank 10 fame from playing balanced (mostly monking) kinda slaps you in the face seeing iways higher rank than you clicking buttons not even having to use vent and usually accompannied by the hahahaha raped or gg nubs??? etc crap 14 year old kiddy behaviour w/r mentality (stick to wwf and achne cream guys)

Does it really matter if someone has more fame than you? If I'm not mistaken you said you were 35 yet you are whining because someone used a less skilled method to get a higher rank than you? Really, it shouldn't matter.

I can tell you that not all IWAYers trash talk like that. And I've also seen balance/spike players with similar mentality (the hahahaha raped or gg nubs??? etc crap 14 year old kiddy behaviour). There are immature and mature people in Guild Wars, and theres really no connection between maturity and the builds the person plays.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silent Kitty

Guild Wars should make a rule of some sort, that only two of each profession may compete in the same group of players, unless it's RA.

Mix spike ftw.

Formosa · Jul 30, 2006, 12:46 AM // 00:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yunas Ele

You need to remember not everyone is playing to become a skillfull 1337 player. Majority of the time I'm playing a "noob" build. But you know what? I'm enjoying it and I know my team mates are too. Remember, this is a video game. Last time I checked video games were made to be fun. As long as I'm having fun, I really could give a **** if the 1337 skilled balance players think I'm a noob.

Does it really matter if someone has more fame than you? If I'm not mistaken you said you were 35 yet you are whining because someone used a less skilled method to get a higher rank than you? Really, it shouldn't matter.

I can tell you that not all IWAYers trash talk like that. And I've also seen balance/spike players with similar mentality (the hahahaha raped or gg nubs??? etc crap 14 year old kiddy behaviour). There are immature and mature people in Guild Wars, and theres really no connection between maturity and the builds the person plays.

Mix spike ftw.

Sorry but I've got to say that the amount of iwayers with a noob mentality is not proportional to the amount of iway groups there are. There definitely is a connection between the maturity of the people and the build they play, although there definitely are the exceptions (I can name balanced players who act like ****heads and I can name some very cool iwayers).

JR · Jul 30, 2006, 02:09 AM // 02:09

For every thread that degenerates into whining about IWAY, an angel loses it's wings.