Curse

Drewfense · Jul 30, 2006, 05:39 PM // 17:39

One thing that I have always liked about GvG was there wasn't all of the rank nonsense you see in tombs (the usual, you aren't r9+ so your trash...but the r9+ guy IWAYed his rank so it would be surprising if he was better than you). Well I see that quickly happening with the Champion title.

Prior to Factions, GvG has always been fairly stable and not strongly influenced by gimmicks, but the rapid additon of new chapters is quickly ruining the state of GvG. New chapters will inevitably have unbalanced skills that people take advantage of to move up the ladder (thump n smite, sb/ri, ritualists, et cetera last chapter...right now the D/Mo and R/P). It seems that instead of worrying more about balancing these chapters, Anet is preoccupied with pumping out a new chapter every 6 months. This is further exaccerbated for GvG in that the release of each new chapter will likely coincide with the start of a new GvG season. It will not be long till GvG turns into HoH, were the gimmicks have become staple builds.

So, did you D/Mo your Champion title this weekend?

Edit: There are several threads on the forums, but they are generally something like this:

D/Mo
Mysticism 12+1+3
Wind 12+1
Protection 3

Balthazars Rage
Grenths Fingers
Heart of Holy Flame
CoP
Reversal of Fortune
Faithful Intervention
Avatar of Balthazar
Rez Sig

Teams normally have 6-7 with this build (the last spots are normally a boon prot and maybe a water flag runner). You spam the first three skills dealing 300ish AoE damage and then hit CoP to bring yourself back up to full energy with some condition/hex removal and healing (from the previous enchantments). The Avatar gives them the necessary speed boost and insane armor. The only way for balanced to do it is split, out yank, and hope for the best... If you want to see it in action, Spearmen and EnS were playing a lot of it yesterday and I am sure several more guilds will be playing it today.

Medion · Jul 30, 2006, 06:16 PM // 18:16

Care to explain what the D/Mo build is or give a link to which build you mean? Thank you

sixdartbart · Jul 30, 2006, 06:57 PM // 18:57

Medion; look here http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10014049

Drew; Very well stated.
We can only hope that they will address the obvious imbalances that have shown up during this live fire lab experiment before they actually release these new classes/skills into the game.

As someone who only plays GWs for GvGing anymore the idea of not playing for 3 days in order to not be blindsided by some new gimmick/imbalance was unthinkable,well at least until Friday when we lost 3 matches that we tactically outplayed our opponents and lost the matches and 52 rating purely from the fact that they found a new untested feature to take advantage of. (not complaining about it just stating facts and more power to them for finding something to give them an edge)
It seems to me that GvGs are becoming more about the newest trick that you can find and from time to time make an invincy character rather than who can as a team react to the opponents build and maneuvers.

Evil is a great example of a team who simply outplays there opponents tactically regardless of how well matched up their build is to who they are playing but those days appear to be coming to an end.

The Champion titles seemed to be something worth achieving after they put some reasonable reqs on getting the points for them and they will still probably be somewhat rare but if these new classes are allowed to be as overpowered upon release as they currently are the title will be meaningless and the players who wish to compete on a level field will have to either join the flock or quit playing.

Really looking forward to playing these same teams and all of the others who climbed the ladder over the weekend with this stuff on Monday

And yes we will be running our same old boring balanced team...

JR · Jul 30, 2006, 07:59 PM // 19:59

I couldn't agree more, Drew.

Guillaume De Sonoma · Jul 30, 2006, 08:27 PM // 20:27

My buddy watched an obs mode match where the spearman won in like a minute dispite the guild lord's amulet. D/Mo's need a fixing.

SFEley · Jul 30, 2006, 08:39 PM // 20:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by sixdartbart

The Champion titles seemed to be something worth achieving after they put some reasonable reqs on getting the points for them and they will still probably be somewhat rare but if these new classes are allowed to be as overpowered upon release as they currently are the title will be meaningless and the players who wish to compete on a level field will have to either join the flock or quit playing.

I find it fascinating how many people are predicting the end of the Guild Wars World based on a beta test weekend.

The whole point of this thing was for ANet to put some stuff out that they thought might work, so that several thousand eyeballs could review it and prove where they were wrong.

Well, stuff was found that wasn't right. Boom. Successful test. Why is everyone complaining about a system that worked?

neoflame · Jul 30, 2006, 08:52 PM // 20:52

Because permanent ranking titles probably shouldn't count beta testing?

Spook_Cell · Jul 30, 2006, 08:57 PM // 20:57

There's also a GvG season going on for prizes.

Drewfense · Jul 30, 2006, 09:00 PM // 21:00

It isn't just this weekend...imo there are still numerous balancing issues from factions that Anet has yet to address and does not appear to be interested in doing so

sixdartbart · Jul 30, 2006, 09:12 PM // 21:12

SFEley are you just a troll or did you not bother to even read the part of my post that you quoted???

The point Drew made this thread about in the first place covers if people are getting Champion points on this "lab rat" weekend and if you take Spearmen as an example the answer is YES.

When a 12-9 rank 500 guild is able to break into the top 10 from using something like this seems to be a pretty good reason to not do these events during an open ladder season or at least freeze the ladder for the duration of the testing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drewfense

It isn't just this weekend...imo there are still numerous balancing issues from factions that Anet has yet to address and does not appear to be interested in doing so

And yet another fine point.
My favorite thing when trying to make nc soft aware of unbalanced skills is their standard answer of "post it on a fan site"
By all means I want to make everyone currently unaware of an overpowered gimmick aware of it asap so I am forced to change my entire team makeup to counter everyone that will be using it.

Frantic-Sheep · Jul 30, 2006, 11:02 PM // 23:02

This night I observed some matches, and each (not lying) had a D/Mo team facing them. Only one seen getting ownd was by a R spike team (sorry cant recall the team ;o). The rest just died so quick.

I think this weekend was similar to the qualify weekend.. just grinding with imbalanced builds (altho this tops it by far). *shrugs*

OMFGimCUTE · Jul 30, 2006, 11:14 PM // 23:14

i dont see anyhting wrong with R/P being unbalanced, its not that over powered. But the Darvishes are...

Coocks · Jul 31, 2006, 01:02 AM // 01:02

It was the worse weekend ever. Me and my guild decided to play GvG friday night just like any other night, starting from a nice 50ish place in the ladder. So we went on, won a match or two, then the dervishes were on to us. We met like 2 or 3 dervish teams on which our balanced build couldn't stand. So we went on, dropping to 90ish, but we said hey wth, rank isnt everything. So we decided to play Saturday night too, this time facing MORE D/Mo teams pwning us and dropping till 150+. Then we just said screw this, so we'll wait till the weekend is over to play GvG.
I hope from all my heart that we'll meet The Spearmen or any other guilds which got to top 50 by using D/Mo builds, to see how good they are at tactics and at playing a balanced build.
As for the Champion title, i was aiming for it too, but after this weekend, im just playing for fun, experience in GvG battles and faction to get to UAX. Just too many people having it

Clusmas · Jul 31, 2006, 01:22 AM // 01:22

To me Guild Wars seems to be getting more unappealing everyday. Mostly, I think, for reasons such as this.

It seems Anet is focusing on making rpg players happy more so than the pvp community which gives the game its signature competitive nature. Oh well, can't blame them really, with a vast majority of the community never touching pvp they're just reaching out to where the money is.

One thing I know about my attachment to the game is prior to the release of factions I would log in everyday without fail. Now I'm lucky to login more than once per week for gvg. It wouldn't surprise me if the release of Nightfall removes my interest in GW completely, aswell as many other's.

Wasteland Squidget · Jul 31, 2006, 01:27 AM // 01:27

I have nothing against teams like The Spearmen who farmed their way up with the D/Mo builds this weekend. They were playing to win just like everyone else. While they were obviously winning on the strength of their build, they did win the game they were given.

It comes down to an issue with Arenanet randomly throwing in a bunch of unbalanced skills during an open season. It wasn't as big an issue in the Factions weekends because the classes were much better balanced, but with the D/Mo build GvG became a joke. My guild rage-PvEed on saturday instead of trying to play GvG under these kinds of conditions.

In future, hopefully Arenanet will save these weekends until frozen ladder season. I'd have been happy to play with all these things then, finding the imbalances without worrying about rating. They could have had the event a few weeks earlier when the ladder was still frozen, or waited a few weeks until the season was over. That would have made me enjoy this weekend a lot more.

Coocks · Jul 31, 2006, 01:37 AM // 01:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wasteland Squidget

I have nothing against teams like The Spearmen who farmed their way up with the D/Mo builds this weekend. They were playing to win just like everyone else. While they were obviously winning on the strength of their build, they did win the game they were given.

It comes down to an issue with Arenanet randomly throwing in a bunch of unbalanced skills during an open season. It wasn't as big an issue in the Factions weekends because the classes were much better balanced, but with the D/Mo build GvG became a joke. My guild rage-PvEed on saturday instead of trying to play GvG under these kinds of conditions.

In future, hopefully Arenanet will save these weekends until frozen ladder season. I'd have been happy to play with all these things then, finding the imbalances without worrying about rating. They could have had the event a few weeks earlier when the ladder was still frozen, or waited a few weeks until the season was over. That would have made me enjoy this weekend a lot more.

Agree. /clap

fiery · Jul 31, 2006, 01:44 AM // 01:44

Originally Posted by Wasteland Squidget
I have nothing against teams like The Spearmen who farmed their way up with the D/Mo builds this weekend. They were playing to win just like everyone else. While they were obviously winning on the strength of their build, they did win the game they were given.

It comes down to an issue with Arenanet randomly throwing in a bunch of unbalanced skills during an open season. It wasn't as big an issue in the Factions weekends because the classes were much better balanced, but with the D/Mo build GvG became a joke. My guild rage-PvEed on saturday instead of trying to play GvG under these kinds of conditions.

In future, hopefully Arenanet will save these weekends until frozen ladder season. I'd have been happy to play with all these things then, finding the imbalances without worrying about rating. They could have had the event a few weeks earlier when the ladder was still frozen, or waited a few weeks until the season was over. That would have made me enjoy this weekend a lot more.

/applauds

TadaceAce · Jul 31, 2006, 02:08 AM // 02:08

I was messing around in guild scrimmaging, me and another dervish (on jade isle) cleared the footman and two archers and proceeded to their base. Between the archers and the entire lord room were talkin maybe 45 seconds for TWO dervishes.

Dervishes are completely broken, they have to completely redo the class.

JR · Jul 31, 2006, 02:11 AM // 02:11

I'm afraid this weekend has really done nothing but make me wonder what kind of monkeys they have in alpha...

Drewfense · Jul 31, 2006, 02:23 AM // 02:23

Edited by Dralspire: This information is subject to a non-disclosure agreement.