Curse

Symon Butterthingers · Sep 03, 2006, 05:50 PM // 17:50

Title says most of it...
I used my ele for this build with a pretty good rate of success. Basic idea is to aggro and hold both groups of Luxon warriors for as long as possible. This will prevent new turtle squad from spawning, so if your team is good enough to kill first turtle you should be good to win (i was in teams that managed to lose or let enemy break green gates while i was holding 8 warriors and one turtle outside, but whatever...).

Build itself:
glyph of concentration (just in case you facing heavy interrupts)
spirit bond
prot spirit
RoF (didn’t know what to put here) - edit: swapped for mend alignment to remove deep wound
aura of restoration (cover-up for strips and diversion)
obsidian flesh
essence bond
balthazar spirit

Attributes:

Gear:
any event headgear (i use dragon mask) with sup earth rune
5/15 AL gloves and boots for ES and vigor runes
Yes, we go almost naked

Any +20% enchant duration weapon (i use galigord's staff)

Usage:
I usually run up to orange teleporter, hold Ctrl and wait for turtle to show up. Then jump into teleporter, cast SB and prot spirit and run across to the purple side aggroing warriors on the orange side. This way you avoid fighting players before aggroing luxon warriors (your main source of healing).
Then you run up to the turtle squad on purple side and stop there. Turtle will most likely break outer gate, but it doesn’t matter. You can hold 8 warriors and one turtle there for the rest of the match giving your team nice advantage... if nothing goes wrong. Make sure you inform your team not to kill warriors before match starts (doing so few times in caps helps =\)

Something does go wrong:
Luxon player realized something wrong here and trying to kill you... I was surprised how many people though I'm 55 and tried to degen me. I laughed

Basic rule when being pounded by players is not to chain skills like mad man - that just begs for Diversion or Disrupting Shot. If you see mesmer or necro coming close to you, target him and see what he does.

Degen - ignore him, he is wasting his time.

Diversion - just wait for it to wear off, or if your prot spirit or SB are wearing off just use RoF or AoR. I was able to sustain mesmer echoing diversion just fine.

Single strips - hit AoR, pay attention to your enchantment list and renew missing ones asap. Don’t try to move - KD from Covard! can slow you down just enough...

Rend enchantments - hit Obsidian flesh and pray... OF is your last line of defense. Use it carefully because adding 20 armor will reduce healing from SB by quiet a bit. At the same time in 24 seconds OF gives you many things may change.

Well of profane - just make sure there are no corpses around you. Sometimes MM will try to kill his golem next to you and use his corpse for Well. That works 50/50, depending wherever or not luxon warriors decide to perma-KD you while you trying to move away from it.

Spirit of disenchantment - simple, just move away.

You could also try to trap luxon warriors behind turtle spawn points, but i found it being unreliable, plus it is damn hard and annoying trying to walk thru the whole map while being KDed on every step.

If you got killed:
No worries, you still can get back on top of things and hold off at least one side. Trying to kill you may slow down luxons just enough... remember the timer is working for you.

GL and happy tanking

Credits:
Ezekiel Prophet - for describing how SB works with prot spirit in http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10031183
Orinn - for giving me idea to use it in Aspenwood http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...4&postcount=40

LoyalSoldier · Sep 03, 2006, 07:37 PM // 19:37

Not a bad idea, but considering that Well of Profane has become the FOTM in Aspenwood all you need is one corpse to screw your build over.

Symon Butterthingers · Sep 03, 2006, 08:38 PM // 20:38

you stay outside, you dont kill anything, you kindly ask teammates not to kill warriors (not always work =\).
Aside from the golem trick described above where would corpse come from?

unholy guardian · Sep 03, 2006, 08:42 PM // 20:42

lol that seems awesome

Orinn · Sep 03, 2006, 09:37 PM // 21:37

It can be fun. I've been running Mo/Me spirit bonder for the last 2-3 days now. Grab warriors from one side, then head over and harass the commander on the other. I had the misfortune last night to run into several mesmers. while disruption wans't TOO bas, one was running shatterstorn, the other, signet of disenchantment.

I laughed at all the degen flying my way, though. Lots of rangers trying to poison me, too. And they ALL seem to not understand how a 55 monk can survive that degen. Too bad I have just over 400 HP.

Riotgear · Sep 03, 2006, 09:52 PM // 21:52

I think Wither/Malaise should be the new FOTM. Would certainly own this build. :P

Symon Butterthingers · Sep 03, 2006, 09:59 PM // 21:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Riotgear

I think Wither/Malaise should be the new FOTM. Would certainly own this build. :P

Sorry to disappoint you, but both are completely and utterly useless against this build

LoyalSoldier · Sep 03, 2006, 10:00 PM // 22:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Symon Butterthingers

you stay outside, you dont kill anything, you kindly ask teammates not to kill warriors (not always work =\).
Aside from the golem trick described above where would corpse come from?

In a perfect world all the warriors will stay alive. The thing it, the world isn't perfect. All you need is one corpse or for one Luxon to die near by. If you stay outside you are going to get some company and Ob Flesh won't stay on forever.

Symon Butterthingers · Sep 03, 2006, 10:13 PM // 22:13

Player corpses dont stick around long enough to make Well of them. OF wont keep me immune forever, yes, but if nobody pushes inside the fort them kurzick players come out to fight outside. Hard part is to convince them not to kill luxon warriors, thats about it. I got owned by mesmers and necro while running this build, but that was like 3-4 times out of maybe 30 games. and even if this happen you just go and try again on different side - that *will* slow them down nicely. If you still lose... bah, just blame noob team

LoyalSoldier · Sep 04, 2006, 03:05 AM // 03:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Symon Butterthingers

Player corpses dont stick around long enough to make Well of them. OF wont keep me immune forever, yes, but if nobody pushes inside the fort them kurzick players come out to fight outside. Hard part is to convince them not to kill luxon warriors, thats about it. I got owned by mesmers and necro while running this build, but that was like 3-4 times out of maybe 30 games. and even if this happen you just go and try again on different side - that *will* slow them down nicely. If you still lose... bah, just blame noob team

I use player corpses all the time. Considering Spirit bond is your most spammed skill it will be easy to remove it or protective spirit.

dgb · Sep 04, 2006, 04:00 AM // 04:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Symon Butterthingers

you stay outside, you dont kill anything, you kindly ask teammates not to kill warriors (not always work =\).
Aside from the golem trick described above where would corpse come from?

I carry a double vamp weapon and a 55 health armour swap on all my characters for when corpses are needed urgently. I'll make the corpse.

Orinn · Sep 04, 2006, 04:49 AM // 04:49

Here's the trick: The SB monk runs out, say, the orange teleporter and beelines for the seige turtle. The warriors all follow the crazy monk, who cannot possibly, under any circumstances, actually KILL anyone.

The monk leads the warriors from the orange group over to the purple commander, and picks a fight there too.

Now: If the orange turtle dies, the group is still alive, and will not respawn. If the purple group dies, the commander is too busy fighting to send the purple unit out onto the battlefield.

If the monk is REALLY crazy, he can pick up the purple group warriors, too. The turtles are still a force to be reckoned with, especially if they have a player bodyguard, but one SB monk can conceivably remove 8 luxon warriors from the entire match, and prevent any future turtle respawns if the first 2 out happen to die.

Yes, I have done this. it's great fun, and results is SO many Luxons ragequitting when they realize the turtles aren't there to do all the work for them. Since you're FAR from the actual battle, the only real corpses to worry about are the occasional flesh golem, or players who can sac-kill themselves.

Symon Butterthingers · Sep 04, 2006, 01:54 PM // 13:54

LoyalSoldier
dgb
ugh, i dont know what you guys trying to prove... That it is impossible to do what I have done many times? Ummm whatever...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Orinn

If the monk is REALLY crazy, he can pick up the purple group warriors, too.

thats what i usually do, because im greedy

It is more dangerous tho... more KDs and better chance to get insta owned with one lucky strip.
Im not going for commanders, just pulling warriors away from turtle, so that my team can dispose it easily.

Orinn · Sep 04, 2006, 05:39 PM // 17:39

I run Mo/Me, instead of Mo/E. I have less protection if things go wrong, but ancestor's visage and sympathetic visage chained will keep the warriors from knocking me down. No adrenaline, no energy, no worries. The part I love most about doing this? Watching touch rangers try. They run in, lose all their energy, and then call ME cheap/noob/exploiter because they can't kill me with 4 warriors pounding on me, much less 8 + commander.

And yes, this setup has some pretty glaring weaknesses. Sad to say, a lot of the countermeasures luxons bring against life bonders, also work against spirit bond. I've seen mesmers with signet of disenchantment and shatterstorm, and assassins with shroud of silence. Those kill me, in less than a second, no questions. The ritualist with disenchantment got me, too. It can be beaten, the enchants are pretty fragile.

LoyalSoldier · Sep 04, 2006, 06:26 PM // 18:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Symon Butterthingers

LoyalSoldier
dgb
ugh, i dont know what you guys trying to prove... That it is impossible to do what I have done many times? Ummm whatever...

What I am trying to say it is a rather fragile build. All you need is for someone to strip protective spirirt at the wrong time and you are toast with that many warriors beating on you.

Symon Butterthingers · Sep 04, 2006, 06:31 PM // 18:31

ah yes, poor noob touchies... I totaly hear you on that *grin*

I'm getting better at timing my enchants tho. Almost makes me think to make Me/Mo and throw in interrupt or two to silence strippers.

Symon Butterthingers · Sep 04, 2006, 06:41 PM // 18:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by LoyalSoldier

What I am trying to say it is a rather fragile build. All you need is for someone to strip protective spirirt at the wrong time and you are toast with that many warriors beating on you.

i never said this build is invincible. In fact i mentioned all this in my first post.
Yet it works. Even if you facing heavy stripping, just respawn and do it again. Keep warriors busy and chase them away. It works.

Orinn · Sep 04, 2006, 08:54 PM // 20:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by LoyalSoldier

What I am trying to say it is a rather fragile build. All you need is for someone to strip protective spirirt at the wrong time and you are toast with that many warriors beating on you.

The chances of them getting protective spirit aren't as high as them getting spirit bond. Not that it really matters, though. Without prot spirit, you die immediately. Without spirit bond, if you're lucky, you can live 2-3 seconds. Yes, enchant stripping works against it. A lot of people see the prot spirit and immediately assume 55, though, so there's often a lot of wasted degen and poison coming my way.

You seem to misunderstand the point of this build, however. It's not meant to do much of anything. It doesn't take command points, or kill turtles, or even kill warriors. It is run so that the Luxon side has to waste time taking care of it. As several people have said, if the match goes on long enough, the kurzicks win. By running a SB monk, I force the Luxon side to devote resources, both in manpower and in time, to killing me. The warriors that are hitting me aren't charging the gate. The necro who's trying to degen me isn't degenning Gunther. The mesmer stripping my enchants is leaving the gate bonder alone. It's a diversionary tactic, but with enough force behind it that the Luxons MUST divert their manpower and time into stopping me from slowing them down, which, consequently, slows them down.

So if I die doing this, I come right back. And I do it again. And each time, it slows the Luxons down to deal with me, giving my team time to run amber, rebuild gates, or regain the aadvantage inside the fort itself. I'm not a threat to what I'm fighting, and I can be killed with the right skills, but each time you have to stop what you're doing, run all the way back to a command point, and kill me because I'm causing trouble with turtle respawns, you're losing time. The longer the match goes on, the more the Kurzicks gain advantage.

LoyalSoldier · Sep 04, 2006, 10:17 PM // 22:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Orinn

The chances of them getting protective spirit aren't as high as them getting spirit bond. Not that it really matters, though. Without prot spirit, you die immediately. Without spirit bond, if you're lucky, you can live 2-3 seconds. Yes, enchant stripping works against it. A lot of people see the prot spirit and immediately assume 55, though, so there's often a lot of wasted degen and poison coming my way.

You seem to misunderstand the point of this build, however. It's not meant to do much of anything. It doesn't take command points, or kill turtles, or even kill warriors. It is run so that the Luxon side has to waste time taking care of it. As several people have said, if the match goes on long enough, the kurzicks win. By running a SB monk, I force the Luxon side to devote resources, both in manpower and in time, to killing me. The warriors that are hitting me aren't charging the gate. The necro who's trying to degen me isn't degenning Gunther. The mesmer stripping my enchants is leaving the gate bonder alone. It's a diversionary tactic, but with enough force behind it that the Luxons MUST divert their manpower and time into stopping me from slowing them down, which, consequently, slows them down.

So if I die doing this, I come right back. And I do it again. And each time, it slows the Luxons down to deal with me, giving my team time to run amber, rebuild gates, or regain the aadvantage inside the fort itself. I'm not a threat to what I'm fighting, and I can be killed with the right skills, but each time you have to stop what you're doing, run all the way back to a command point, and kill me because I'm causing trouble with turtle respawns, you're losing time. The longer the match goes on, the more the Kurzicks gain advantage.

I understand perfectly what the build does so please don't play that card. I run the build in the underworld all the time. I am just saying it can be a waste quite easily because it really isn't all that hard to bring down. Gaze of Contempt or anything that can remove more than one enchantment will destroy the build. My biggest problem with it is just that it is just too conditional. Not to mention Enchantment removal has become quite common on the Luxon side.

Basically if I can take you down by pressing one button then the build needs work.

Orinn · Sep 05, 2006, 03:21 AM // 03:21

Sorry. I didn't mean to imply that you didn't understand how the build worked, or why. What I meant was, the purpose of playing this build in FA on the kurzick side is entirely one of diversion. It can break Luxon momentum, pressure them into bad choices ("Oh noes! Where are our turtles!?!?") and generally cause a headache for luxons who are unprepared for it.

If people have to come from the gates to the luxon backline to deal with me, I'm costing them time and taking them off the offensive. And while you are obviously smart enough to bring enchantment removal...

Not all Luxons do. When it works, it tends to work well.