Curse

JR · Sep 06, 2006, 11:41 PM // 23:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by phoenixtech

Thumpers have been around for HOW long? Just because a "fun" season was infested by thumpway we now want to nerf it?

When you can farm from rank 70~ to rank 18 in one night AT THE END OF A LADDER SEASON with Thumpway, something is wrong. Not only that, but you can do it whilst being impressively intoxicated.

phoenixtech · Sep 07, 2006, 01:32 AM // 01:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR-

When you can farm from rank 70~ to rank 18 in one night AT THE END OF A LADDER SEASON with Thumpway, something is wrong. Not only that, but you can do it whilst being impressively intoxicated.

Yes, but it was the end of a "fun" season where nothing of real importance was on the line, then again maybe some people REALLY wanted those skill pins. People weren't farming ladder with thumpers in previous seasons (discounting the 3 day smite/thump fest).

Patrograd · Sep 07, 2006, 06:48 AM // 06:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by phoenixtech

People weren't farming ladder with thumpers in previous seasons (discounting the 3 day smite/thump fest).

They were. The last week or so of season 3 was total carnage in this regard as teams fought for those playoff spots. This is when the triple smite/SBRI thing appeared for the first team really, and throughout that season a number of teams had been running dual smite with thumpers for the sole purpose of ladder farming, at least 3 or 4 of the top 20 at the end of that season had been running thumpers all season.

JR · Sep 07, 2006, 08:19 AM // 08:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by phoenixtech

Yes, but it was the end of a "fun" season where nothing of real importance was on the line, then again maybe some people REALLY wanted those skill pins. People weren't farming ladder with thumpers in previous seasons (discounting the 3 day smite/thump fest).

Yeah, obviously nobody cared about last season. Thus all the charges of ladder manipulation.

....Wait.

phoenixtech · Sep 07, 2006, 04:54 PM // 16:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR-

Yeah, obviously nobody cared about last season. Thus all the charges of ladder manipulation.

....Wait.

Yes people cared so much that you were able to farm from 70 to 18 with thumpway while being drunk. Maybe there's some sort of uber drunken thumpway skills that none of the ranked 19-70 guild knew about, because we all fought really hard for those uber leet skill pins that automatically makes your epeen twice as large.

Ristaron · Sep 07, 2006, 05:07 PM // 17:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR-

I think you have this backwards, Vampiric Bite and Vampiric Touch ARE skills, and as such are effected by expertise. Vapiric Gaze is a spell, and therefore isn't.

If you really wanted to 'nerf' touch rangers in a sensible manner, simply take out duplicate skills such as Vampiric Bite. They are largely pointless, and vastly overused in the case of touch Rangers.

It isn't Irresistible Blow that makes thumpers overpowered. It is the ability to spam Tigers Fury, and through that spam Bash. Irresistible is great on a thumper don't get me wrong, I wouldn't run one without it right now. However, neither do I think that making it slightly less viable would really hurt thumpers, at least not in a way that would also make it useless on a Hammer Warrior. Crushing Blow is fine.

I don't honestly yet know how you could tweak thumpers to be more balanced, without hurting Hammer Warriors or Beastmastery as a whole. It's a tricky problem, with no simple solution. The best I have yet to think of up to now would be making Tigers Fury black out adrenaline skills aswell. This has the interesting side effect of being a pretty big hit on IWAY, which I personally don't mind.

Thank you for the correction on the Vampiric skill/spell mixup, I was a little incoherent at the time. As for the Irresistable Blow remark, that wasn't to represent an actual game-change suggestion, merely to demonstrate easier changes that can be made to the game than redoing an entire attribute as the OP suggested. He complained about that particular skill so I mentioned a possible suggestion he could make.

moriz · Sep 07, 2006, 05:08 PM // 17:08

hmm, missed sarcasm, anyone?

Ristaron · Sep 07, 2006, 05:12 PM // 17:12

Somehow I doubt it.

JR · Sep 07, 2006, 05:53 PM // 17:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by phoenixtech

Yes people cared so much that you were able to farm from 70 to 18 with thumpway while being drunk.

If you want to farm a PuG guild to a high rank in the shortest time possible, Thumpers on Burning Isle with a Death Necro is the best way. Even when drunk.

Quote:

Originally Posted by phoenixtech

Maybe there's some sort of uber drunken thumpway skills that none of the ranked 19-70 guild knew about, because we all fought really hard for those uber leet skill pins that automatically makes your epeen twice as large.

They will get you laid in korea.

Thom Bangalter · Sep 07, 2006, 06:02 PM // 18:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR-

If you want to farm a PuG guild to a high rank in the shortest time possible, Thumpers on Burning Isle with a Death Necro is the best way. Even when drunk.

They will get you laid in korea.

sadly, this is all too terribly true.

Byron · Sep 07, 2006, 07:03 PM // 19:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR-

Kyune gave me an interesting and possibly more viable idea though... what if Expertise didn't effect stances?

Zealous hammer?

JR · Sep 07, 2006, 08:22 PM // 20:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Byron

Zealous hammer?

Who doesn't already use a Zealous on a Thumper?

yesitsrob · Sep 08, 2006, 12:07 AM // 00:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR-

Who doesn't already use a Zealous on a Thumper?

people who use life stealing? since when do you need a zealous hammer on a thumper?

tomcruisejr · Sep 08, 2006, 12:12 AM // 00:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by yesitsrob

people who use life stealing? since when do you need a zealous hammer on a thumper?

when you got no $$ to buy vera, ice breaker, sundering mursaat hammer of fortitude.

seriously, zealous hammer is good for non-ferocious strike thumpers, imo.

Phoenix Arrows · Sep 08, 2006, 12:15 AM // 00:15

This seems like another Toucher-hate thread...Expertise is good the way it is.

yesitsrob · Sep 08, 2006, 12:51 AM // 00:51

it's a thumper hate thread imo. no one gives two shits about touchers except the bloodspiker.

i suppose with enraged zealous might be ok... i still didn't find myself needing it... but when running ferocious i definitely didn't need it, and i'd choose the +5 damage any day tbh.

Dark Tykane · Sep 08, 2006, 01:01 AM // 01:01

Most people who think something in this game need to be changed don't know what effect it would have in other places that they aren't immediately seeing thus if Anet listens to the population often it would cause results that they would have to move back or it would effect too many other things in a bad way.

In other words if you don't work for Anet don't say something "should" be changed, don't request for something to be changed it gets you just as much as this post will get me..nothing

STFU and please all you people who think they have looked farther into something than most the population would do not make another thread and do not whine more.

yesitsrob · Sep 08, 2006, 01:21 AM // 01:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dark Tykane

Most people who think something in this game need to be changed don't know what effect it would have in other places that they aren't immediately seeing thus if Anet listens to the population often it would cause results that they would have to move back or it would effect too many other things in a bad way.

In other words if you don't work for Anet don't say something "should" be changed, don't request for something to be changed it gets you just as much as this post will get me..nothing

STFU and please all you people who think they have looked farther into something than most the population would do not make another thread and do not whine more.

this is a pvp discussion thing. therefore we discuss our opinions on skills and builds that are currently dominating pvp... and it's largely the community that finds out certain skill combos that might be a bit too good.... skill balancers at anet do watch observer mode a _lot_ to see what people have come up with. because izzy isn't going to find out every single broken skil combo or build by himself....

it's not whining, it's actually a pretty common opinion, and don't go tell people to stfu for sharing theres.

Thom Bangalter · Sep 08, 2006, 01:25 AM // 01:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by tomcruisejr

when you got no $$ to buy vera, ice breaker, sundering mursaat hammer of fortitude.

seriously, zealous hammer is good for non-ferocious strike thumpers, imo.

yeah, like enraged lunge. Zealous War Hammer of Fortitude ftw.

Evilsod · Sep 08, 2006, 01:41 AM // 01:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR-

Kyune gave me an interesting and possibly more viable idea though... what if Expertise didn't effect stances?

Or heres a better idea. Stop whining about expertise and leave it alone, nothing you can do to expertise won't hurt rangers in other ways too, how in gods name would Tigers Fury even be usable costing 10 energy a time for a ranger on top of attack skills? Nerfing Tigers Fury will make it less useful in all builds and probably just ignored. Nerfing Iresistable Blow may just hurt Hammer Warriors. Nerfing Ferocious Strike would make it be replaced with Enraged Lunge, thus making thumpers even more deadly if they used a Zealous Hammer instead for spiking.

Just because people are using Bunny Thumpers in high end GvG means they get nerfed? Where as if they were the most overpowered thing PvE had ever seen Anet wouldn't give a flying RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO. Unless something in PvE is game breaking it doesn't even get touched. Hell if they nerf Expertise and its still affective on a PvP front they probably won't care about PvE.