Curse

Wasteland Squidget · Sep 08, 2006, 08:16 PM // 20:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Patrograd

I think this is a fair assessment of Dragon Slash as a skill. For me it is a niche skill that fits certain builds, but not others.

For example, although it is a really nice pressure character for the front of a degen team for example, is it stronger in that role than a thumper? IMO a thumper deals more pressure than a dragon slasher, which would mean you would only include such a character if there was a strong tactical reason for doing so (the inclusion of gale as you said might be one good one, or a better ability to reactively split might be another). You might argue that the ability to suddenly and repeatedly spike down heavily weakened targets makes him strong in that role, and you'd be right I guess, but I think a thumper would get the targets down quicker overall.

I think a thumper can be stronger pressure than a Dragon Slasher, no question. Ideally, you want to run a thumper in that guys place unless you're really using the utility skills the Dragon Slasher brings to the party. Thumpway is a perfect example of how terrifying Thumper pressure can be.

However, what I think some people forget is how much of Thumpway's pressure really comes from the death necro, and the synergy between him and the thumper. The tendency of pets to die to AoE is actually a benefit to Thumpway, because it gives them a functionally infinite number of corpses to exploit. If you took out the death necro and replaced him with another thumper, the build would have a lot more weaknesses and wouldn't apply nearly as much pressure.

You don't necessarily want to throw a thumper into just any build, because you'll put your offense at pretty serious risk. If the other team is running a lot of AoE (ie: smite) and you don't have a death necro to exploit the corpses, your pets will be spending a lot of time dead on the ground, weakening your thumpers. Worse, if you don't have a death necro and the other team does, Taints will drop your pets in seconds and you'll give them an infinite supply of corpses to use against your team. Putrids and Profanes add up quickly.

In short, running numerous thumpers without a death necro is more risky and less effective. Since death necros are decent pressure it's not usually too big a sacrifice to put one in a pressure build, but not every build will have room for one.

Thom Bangalter · Sep 08, 2006, 10:49 PM // 22:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wasteland Squidget

I think a thumper can be stronger pressure than a Dragon Slasher, no question. Ideally, you want to run a thumper in that guys place unless you're really using the utility skills the Dragon Slasher brings to the party. Thumpway is a perfect example of how terrifying Thumper pressure can be.

However, what I think some people forget is how much of Thumpway's pressure really comes from the death necro, and the synergy between him and the thumper. The tendency of pets to die to AoE is actually a benefit to Thumpway, because it gives them a functionally infinite number of corpses to exploit. If you took out the death necro and replaced him with another thumper, the build would have a lot more weaknesses and wouldn't apply nearly as much pressure.

You don't necessarily want to throw a thumper into just any build, because you'll put your offense at pretty serious risk. If the other team is running a lot of AoE (ie: smite) and you don't have a death necro to exploit the corpses, your pets will be spending a lot of time dead on the ground, weakening your thumpers. Worse, if you don't have a death necro and the other team does, Taints will drop your pets in seconds and you'll give them an infinite supply of corpses to use against your team. Putrids and Profanes add up quickly.

In short, running numerous thumpers without a death necro is more risky and less effective. Since death necros are decent pressure it's not usually too big a sacrifice to put one in a pressure build, but not every build will have room for one.

If you're not bringing corpse explotation when there's pets, you shouldn't be bringing pets. if you're not bringing pets, then I'm not that big a fan of thumpway, though 4 thumpers, two with charge two with backbreaker is pretty fun.

Byron · Sep 09, 2006, 02:01 AM // 02:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greedy Gus

Dragon slash wars are pretty backloaded in damage (take longer to get going), which is another reason I assume ensign says they're not good in splits/overextensions.

My W/R dragon slasher could take down NPCs or stranded characters in a hurry. But then again, any decent warrior build could do that.

shardfenix · Sep 10, 2006, 12:34 AM // 00:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zui

As already said, there's nothing wrong with Frenzy, if you actualy know how to use it anyway...

Chances are, if you're a warrior in pretty much any pvp environment, you will be the last person attacked anyway. My experience with warrior is that you are safe if your whole team is alive. Your opponent's primary concerns are monks and mesmers. If the other team tries killing a warrior off the bat, you will probably beat them anyway.

Thom Bangalter · Sep 10, 2006, 01:45 AM // 01:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by shardfenix

Chances are, if you're a warrior in pretty much any pvp environment, you will be the last person attacked anyway. My experience with warrior is that you are safe if your whole team is alive. Your opponent's primary concerns are monks and mesmers. If the other team tries killing a warrior off the bat, you will probably beat them anyway.

if the other team notices you like to spam frenzy, you are spike bait.

lapsus · Sep 10, 2006, 07:47 AM // 07:47

Idk i kinda like using Battle Rage, I get over 17 secs with it, i usually have dismember, penetrating attack and executioners. It gives you the adrenal benefit aswell as not having the draw back of frenzy. the shield i have also further helps it out, armor +like 14 or something in a stance, requires 1 tactics.
I know eviscerate does alot of damage in 1 spike but if i keep swinging and fighting i can keep renewing BR. Sure i lose alittle adrenaline, im not gonna renew it when i have alot of adrenaline left, so i can use executioner 1 more time before the cut-off.

Patrograd · Sep 10, 2006, 11:55 AM // 11:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by shardfenix

. Your opponent's primary concerns are monks and mesmers. If the other team tries killing a warrior off the bat, you will probably beat them anyway.

Your opponents primary concern is to stay alive and get kills. They will kill whoever is easiest for them to kill, and if thats a warrior then that's who they will kill. Taking out a warrior can relieve alot of pressure, there is often alot to be said for dismantling the other team's offence. The belief that they're invincible because of all that armour is what kills warriors more than anything else imo.

Byron · Sep 11, 2006, 05:18 PM // 17:18

Battle rage isn't so ineffective as an old school warrior might think. So here's a shameless promotion:

Rage Theory - New breed of DPS warrior

Otherwise, to quote many of those before me, Ensign is always right.

Thom Bangalter · Sep 11, 2006, 06:08 PM // 18:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Byron

Otherwise, to quote many of those before me, Ensign is always right.

it's always true. He's like a guild wars prophet.

additionally, the DPS warrior you posted is at best a sword warrior with an unusual elite, at worst a sword warrior with a wasted elite slot (empathic removal, charge, bull's charge anyone?)

Byron · Sep 12, 2006, 12:27 AM // 00:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thom Bangalter

the DPS warrior you posted is at best a sword warrior with an unusual elite, at worst a sword warrior with a wasted elite slot (empathic removal, charge, bull's charge anyone?)

Good point, but I'd advise trying the build at least once. I wouldn't be endorsing it as I am if I thought it was bad.