Curse

Berzerk · Oct 16, 2006, 07:40 AM // 07:40

After the Rit Lord nerf, no one seems to use Rits anymore. The few that I do see, however, are all Rt/R with Attuned was Songkai and Serpen'ts Quickness for energy and recharge. That got me thinking, since Serpent's is Wilderness Survival, and so is Storm Chaser and Troll Unguent, maybe a Rit could run flags. I don't know how effective it would be, or what kind of team setup you'd use it in, but seemed pretty cool.

Spawning Power - 11+1+2
Communing - 10+2
Wilderness Survival - 10

Attuned was Songkai
Serpent's Quickness
Shelter
Displacement
Union
Soothing
Troll Unguent
Storm Chaser

Attuned pretty much cuts casting cost in half, and Serpent's makes it so it can always be maintained. After your spirit chain, hit Storm Chaser while Serpent's is still active to go run the flag again.
Of course, this runner can't stop any sort of gank, and its one survival skill can be easily interupted, but I'm sure somone could find a use for it.

Wasteland Squidget · Oct 16, 2006, 07:43 AM // 07:43

Given that spirits like Shelter and Union need to be spammed to be useful, I don't see the point to putting them on a runner. An E/Mo runner provides better defense through Heal Party at range, along with better skirmish capability. I just don't see any point to this.

Oct 16, 2006, 07:55 AM // 07:55

I've been working on a rit runner as they have a great deal of utility and e management to work something like an e/mo flagger. I wouldn't use a spirit spammer tho. HOw would he handle a base gank? Place a 5 second shelter? I would look into the other rit lines for the runner. Remember, a flagger should be a strong solo char.

Muppet87 · Oct 16, 2006, 02:00 PM // 14:00

Back when SotW was around they used to use a Rit for a runner. This Rit runner had no survivability or speed boosts.

This was the concept:
Rit would wait at base for cap at flag stand, get second flag then when he reached flag stand he would put up all the spirits that we see Rits used today(Union, Shelter, Pain, Shadowsong, and Displacement). After laying spirits down the Rit would cap(or before he layed spirits, depending on the situation at flag stand). This would continue UNLESS the Air/Water hybrid flag stand Elementalist was fully exhausted. I believe this Elementalist was using Second Wind instead of Ether Prodigy, its been awhile so im not sure if thats correct but either way either skill would work fine. If the Elementalist was fully exhausted then he would take the place of the Rit on flag running.

Why this worked at flag stand:
This worked because you had the Ele at flag stand spamming blinds and snares across the board plus every 30 seconds you had a Rit coming in placing shelter, union, displacement, shadowsong, and pain add some relief of pressure with the max 10% damage and other defensive attributes by spirits.

Why this had some trouble:
Well quite frankly if you had a team that recognized what you were doing early enough they could send a ganker back to base to pretty much kill your flag runner with great ease. I played this Rit once or twice and was lucky enough to go against a dumb warrior, thankfuly I had enough time to place my Shadowsong so it was gg.

I witnessed so many times where our whole team had to loose good positioning to fall back and help a lonely Rit runner that was being ganged up on by 3way split. As you could imagine this was hell trying to cap, considering we were on the Ice Map 24/7 and the pilgramage over the ice to Flag Stand was an epic one.

Half the time we got owned the other half of the time we almost got owned.

This is my experience of having a Rit flag runner.

It can be good tactics if your team is using a Rit flagger with some survivability, Ive seen it work with less.

Well thats my experience..hope it helps.

Epinephrine · Oct 23, 2006, 04:23 PM // 16:23

I've run rit runners as well. I think though that you can't run the standard Shelter/Union stuff, it simply isn't valuable that way; I've run two versions.

Restoration Rit: Uses Recuperation/Preservation/heals. Can arrive at stand, put down strong healing spirits to bolster party, provide some healing support and help against ganks and so on. Not very offensive. Can invest in Channeling for a spike skill however.

Communing Rit: Used offensive spirits; agian, placing them in the back makes them harder to disrupt, and they end up focussing on warriors who penetrate the lines. With Pain/Bloodsong both lasting 2.5 minutes or so, and Wanderlust a minute you can easily use these three; Shadow song can be deposited before leaving the flagstand as well. The version I ran way back used Troll Unguent, Stormchaser and Barbed Trap with 4 spirits (Pain/Bloodsong/Shadow Song/Wanderlust) and Doom as a spike skill.

Wasn't an amazing runner by any stretch, but it was a pain in the butt for opponents in some areas. Doom is a decent spike with your spirits recharging.

clonmac · Oct 23, 2006, 09:01 PM // 21:01

We've used this Rit build with some success during the ladder lock and I found it to be fairly versatile.

Ritualist/Assassin
Level: 20

Spawning Power: 9 (8+1)
Communing: 16 (12+4)
Shadow Arts: 10

- Bloodsong (Communing)
- Pain (Communing)
- Wanderlust [Elite] (Communing)
- Boon of Creation (Spawning Power)
- Feast of Souls (Spawning Power)
- Dash (Assassin None)
- Shadow of Haste (Shadow Arts)
- Shadowsong (Communing)

You can run flags very quickly with Shadow of Haste and Dash to cancel it. With the speed advantage you gain, you have time to place some spirits down in the backline and then use Feast of Souls to provide a huge party wide heal.

If you see a gank squad going back to your base, you can Shadow of Haste back and that will give you time to get your spirits set up. With 4 Spirits up between them and the Guild Lord, there isn't much they can do unless they send more than a couple back. Hex Mesmer? Just get the spirits up and then leave since his hexes are useless against spirits.

If your team finds they could use extra damage, set the spirits up in the mid-lines and let the spirits add to your build's damage output.

It's fairly versatile.

unmatchedfury · Oct 24, 2006, 10:43 AM // 10:43

I've wondered why spirits aren't used offensively in GvG. Since painful bond is and aoe hex ihex on monks wont take care of all of it, so you actually need more hex r removal. also there are some communing channeling hybrids that are very very good at dealing dmg.

Even so. the rit really lacks finesse in everything he does except communing.His main attribute for one thing doesn't really help him out much like fast cast or expertise. as a class he is versatile but when it gets down to single builds in the restoration or channeling lines he lacks the utility spells like prot RoF, guardian, and CoP, Healing light, and quite a few other monk spell that aren't just plain dmg.and have extra uses.Also his heal spells may have the ability to be spammed with AwS but they are, Excepting spirit transfer, one second cast, and thus during a spike they come too late to help, making you rely on almost impossibly fast reflexes. In Gw time being able to Prot Spirit RoF in half a second is a 250 heal and lasting dmg mitigation, while spirit light,Soothing memories,mend body and soul, wielder's boon, all take far too long to cast.

Patccmoi · Oct 24, 2006, 06:13 PM // 18:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by unmatchedfury

I've wondered why spirits aren't used offensively in GvG. Since painful bond is and aoe hex ihex on monks wont take care of all of it, so you actually need more hex r removal. also there are some communing channeling hybrids that are very very good at dealing dmg.

Even so. the rit really lacks finesse in everything he does except communing.His main attribute for one thing doesn't really help him out much like fast cast or expertise. as a class he is versatile but when it gets down to single builds in the restoration or channeling lines he lacks the utility spells like prot RoF, guardian, and CoP, Healing light, and quite a few other monk spell that aren't just plain dmg.and have extra uses.Also his heal spells may have the ability to be spammed with AwS but they are, Excepting spirit transfer, one second cast, and thus during a spike they come too late to help, making you rely on almost impossibly fast reflexes. In Gw time being able to Prot Spirit RoF in half a second is a 250 heal and lasting dmg mitigation, while spirit light,Soothing memories,mend body and soul, wielder's boon, all take far too long to cast.

We use Restoration Rt to replace monk, Channeling Rt as primary damage dealer and Communing Rt for offensive spirits pressure (no defensive spirits unless you consider Shadowsong) in GvG and we're on a 20 win streak or so in the off-season, beating a lot of top 100 guilds running all kinds of builds (KGYU pressure, oflame spike, 2 esurge balanced, hex heavy pressure, mass ganking, etc.). I know it's off-season but many were still trying seriously with standard setups.

Channeling Rts don't have a lot of utility i agree, but their nuking ability on single target surpass every other build i know. An Air ele can't sustain nearly as much damage pressure with nearly every hit above 100 and infinite energy. You just have to build around that.

We use a Communing Rt using Weapon of Quickening that he keeps on the Channeling Rt as well as whatever other utility we need the most. Against hex-heavy team? Throw it on the Resto Rt that uses Expel Hexes, at 6s recharge it's a LOT of hexes gone. Against casters? Throw it on the Mesmer to edenial more. Etc.

As for Resto Rt healing speed, it's fine. Spirit Transfer is what you will use first for a spike, and it's around 250 health instantly. If you need an 'afterheal', Mend Body and Soul is actually .75s (not 1s), heals for 121 AND removes conditions if you have spirits in the area (and considering we have 3 Rts, we more or less always do), so usually you'll get the Deep Wound of target if there was any which results in another 200+ heal. Prot-Spirit + RoF is still more than 1s to get both off considering there's an aftercast of .75s and none actually rivals Spirit Transfer for saving a spike. I think they have easily as good utility skills as monks too, if different. We give our Resto Rt Life, which is 3 Heal Party for 10E, though it comes 30s later (still EXTREMELY useful against pressure teams when you use it correctly). Mend Body and Soul with 3-4 spirits around acts like a Restore Condition while the elite is Expel Hexes, making condition/hex control arguably better than even BLight monks. Soothing Memories heals nearly as much as Healing Light for the same energy cost (2E). If you use Attuned for elite you might lack utility without dedicating your elite for it, but unless you're using Recuperation spirit there's absolutely no point in picking Attuned imo, Resto Rt have MUCH more energy-efficient spells than even monks and can afford to invest 12 in Inspiration too. A Resto Rt can easily spike heal with STransfer, remove hexes very efficiently with Expel, remove conditions very efficiently with MB&S (if you have a Communing Rt along at least), self-defense with Generous was Tsungrai (self-infuse ftw), Party-wide healing with Life, pressure healing with Soothing Memories at very low cost, etc. If you have spirits around to power your spells, imo a Resto Rt is more versatile than a healing monk can hope to be and possibly more efficient, and handles pressure better than a BLight. I wouldn't run 2 Resto Rt, but 1 Resto Rt + 1 BLight in my experience is superior to 2 BLights, again as long as you supply him with spirits.

Rts are possibly the most versatile class in GW now. Not in a single build like a Cripshot Ranger, but in the availability of roles they can play, and in the right conditions they are incredible at each of these roles. But since a lot of builds rely on spirits, you will often need more than one Rt together to achieve that potential, which is what we're doing now with great success.

As for the Ritualist Runner, i think that Shadow of Haste-Dash, likely dropping flag to someone else so he can run it afterwards to stand while you plant spirit and Dash back to base, is much better than going Rt/R. Your energy will all regen while you run anyway. If someone else in your team can come help in case there's a ganker, you shouldn't have too much problem. But that being said, i'd still take an E/Mo over it and keep the Rt in combat.

TheOneMephisto · Oct 24, 2006, 08:46 PM // 20:46

I agree that resto rits can be amazing characters when there are adequate spirits around. The problem is that when spirits are in short supply, they lose a lot of their efficiency and lose their only spike heal.

If you play against a resto rit properly and maneuver so that they don't get a chance to lay spirits or kill spirits (lol, fire ele), then they immediately become much less effective than a BL.

Despondency · Oct 24, 2006, 09:04 PM // 21:04

I completely disagree with the idea of having a rit as a runner. The class is based mainly around spirits. Being a flag runner is all about being mobile, and able to deal with a variety of sitations. That class just isn't meant for this kind of thing. Leave it to other classes.