Curse

SlipknotOFA · Oct 30, 2006, 06:59 AM // 06:59

I love six man I hope they dont bring it back <3

Vindexus · Oct 30, 2006, 07:38 AM // 07:38

The henchway problem has nothing to do with the change from 6v6 to 8v8. They are seperate issues.

phasola · Oct 30, 2006, 09:14 AM // 09:14

Henchway was present during 8 v 8 and it was never a problem. Heroway wouldn't have been a problem with 8 v 8 either...

Mental Leteci · Oct 30, 2006, 09:33 AM // 09:33

They made it 6v6 so you can go inside without anyone. Just you,heroes and henchies. In that movie Gale won't stop talking about new HA and how good it is. I guess she's just ignoring us all + moderators aren't helping at all, every good thread there was about situation in HA was locked, this is the only one that's left - probably because it was opened by moderator.

JR · Oct 30, 2006, 09:43 AM // 09:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mental Leteci

I guess she's just ignoring us all + moderators aren't helping at all, every good thread there was about situation in HA was locked, this is the only one that's left - probably because it was opened by moderator.

Every good thread? You mean every thread opened by someone who just wanted to cry in caps lock about how dumb Anet is? Right.

And no, we don't need a thousand threads on the same issue, so I opened one that covered it all.

Seriously, cry less. It's pathetic.

Mental Leteci · Oct 30, 2006, 10:03 AM // 10:03

Nope,it's not the same issue. As we can all see 8v8 isn't coming back and now they added heroes. Heroes have nothing to do with 6v6. And I'm not crying, I'm just making my point, why should I cry? I sold my account. If ANet presented this game as MMOCPG why don't they make it a MMOCPG? It has nothing to do with whining, it's common sense. This is just a discussion opened for all, imagine if someone wants to buy GW now and he reads it's MMOCPG, but when he buys it he realizes he got tricked. Sorry, I think that people have right to know what they're buying.

p.s. Don't even try to avoid this subject with: If you sold your account why are you on forums?

I'm on forums because I'm still playing (farming rank to my friend) which means I can discuss every change inside the game.

phasola · Oct 30, 2006, 10:06 AM // 10:06

JR try and go for a run into HA. Don't play, just see how many people connect.
It's just sad. Tombs killed in 1 month. Gj anet.

JR · Oct 30, 2006, 10:31 AM // 10:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by phasola

JR try and go for a run into HA. Don't play, just see how many people connect.
It's just sad. Tombs killed in 1 month. Gj anet.

Again people assume I am disagreeing? Why? Where in my post did I say that I think Heroes Ascent is fine?

I can tell you for a FACT that if you wish Anet to read and take notice of this forum and the threads in it them the attitude of the average poster has to change a lot. They do not take notice of childish whining and posts that often border on trolling. If you have a point that you wish to make and wish to be listened to then you simply have to do it in a sensible and mature manner. I realise how much of a struggle that may be for some of you, but you can always try.

The simple truth is that at the moment all of your angst ridden posts are nothing but a waste of space, with such a bad attitude you will achieve nothing. I completely agree that heroes are a problem in HA, but I personally argue the point through other means because I don't honestly think Anet would bother reading this section of the forums at the moment. To be quite honest I wouldn't blame them if they didn't either.

This is why I cleared the forum and condensed the ranting about changes to Heroes Ascent into this one thread previously. It is far more likely to be read when presented in a much more sensible manner, without all of the spam and trash in the other threads.

Vindexus · Oct 30, 2006, 10:44 AM // 10:44

6v6 and the henchway problem are unrelated. The problem with henchmen is that the required percentage of players in comparison to henchmen and heroes was lowered with the change. Raise the minimun number of players per bots, not the maximum number of people in a party.

You don't fix this henchmen problem by changing HA from 6v6 to 8v8, you fix the henchmen problem by fixing the henchmen problem.

luilui · Oct 30, 2006, 11:36 AM // 11:36

Let's all go kiss anet's buttom, give them ideas how to improve their game (or not to ruin it to be exact) and handover our hard-earned money.

no, if they made stupid decisions because of whatever stupid reasons and piss everyone (i do mean everyone) off, nobody can say anything bad to them.

Talk about attitude, Anet certainly have the "customer is always right" attitude.

If i get paid i might do something more constructive, if i dont i'll just cry, why should i do something when it's not my responsibility. Anet should be glad that some people still bother crying.

(do delete this post if u think it falls into the "bad attitude" cateridge, after all only anet has the power to change things.)

JR · Oct 30, 2006, 12:37 PM // 12:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by luilui

Let's all go kiss anet's buttom, give them ideas how to improve their game (or not to ruin it to be exact) and handover our hard-earned money.

no, if they made stupid decisions because of whatever stupid reasons and piss everyone (i do mean everyone) off, nobody can say anything bad to them.

Talk about attitude, Anet certainly have the "customer is always right" attitude.

If i get paid i might do something more constructive, if i dont i'll just cry, why should i do something when it's not my responsibility. Anet should be glad that some people still bother crying.

(do delete this post if u think it falls into the "bad attitude" cateridge, after all only anet has the power to change things.)

As long as you realise that you are achieving absolutely nothing by doing that, feel free. You could actually make a difference if you made an attempt to be sensible about it though.

It is the people who take the time to write mature arguments that are inspiring change in this game, not the ones who just whine. If you expect Anet to change the game on your suggestion, then you have to at least make your argument suitable.

hyro yamaguchi · Oct 30, 2006, 01:08 PM // 13:08

I feel a flame war coming :P

But anyway, Anet, it's very simple:

Either you choose permitting only half the party to be henches/heroes, or you ban them from all types of pvp (except offcourse hero battle) completely.

And about the 6v6: Either you choose to make both optional, or just change it back.

The hero problem is something that needs a fix very much. They are simply dominating HA. And although 6v6 isn't a big problem, 8v8 was more challenging, and had more room for builds.

Would this be a good summary of the topic?

Brother Redmund · Oct 30, 2006, 01:33 PM // 13:33

I'll start by saying I'm an average pvp player, not leet, but not shite. My comments may not necessarily be as insightful as some of the high-end players debating in here, but I understand issue/s sufficiently.

Issue 1: The change of HA from 8 man to 6 man certainly changed the meta in HA, for better or worse is up to the individual. It killed a lot of builds, and utility characters and their respective skills became a lot less prevalent. Generally you might see one of this type of character per party where there may have been two or three previously.

Overall though, this change hasn't ruined HA or the playability of it. There are still some decent balanced teams out there running amongst the gimmicks and FOTM builds. Either way, it can still be fun to run some halls.

Issue 2: This is going to sound very broken record-like, but heroes (or rather the current system and the way it is being used) is detracting in a serious way from the concept of pvp and what it is supposed to represent. Sure henchs/heroes have a place in HA for disconnects or topping up an incomplete party, however the method in which heroes are employed in HA presently makes running some halls not much fun at all. Obviously these points have been raised already but I will reiterate the a few that I think are detracting from the enjoyment of pvp in HA;

* NPC's and their godlike interrupting reflexes (considering you can stack a skill bar for this purpose now). There are some human players who are absolutely brilliant at performing this role - but few would consistently be as good as some heroes seem to be at this point. In short, its just not comparable as it was prior to this change when playing against enemies with interrupt capability.

* The "thrill" of the kill. It now feels diluted to a certain extent when defeating a team consisting of 4 or 5 AI controlled enemies. They can within reason hold their own and put up a good fight, but if/when you win it does leave one with the feeling that just isn't the same as beating a team of people.

* The concept of "pressure", for instance, doesn't apply to them. Against a team of humans, applying pressure would normally, with the exception of extremely good players, force a mistake which could lead to a winning edge in the game. With AI controlled characters, they will follow the same routine regardless, they won't as such make mistakes, you simply beat them down and score a win, without knowing that the pressure you applied caused them to crack and force the upper hand.

Well theres my two cents worth. Bear in mind, that being only an average player, I lose to NPC stacked teams once in a while, as well as thankfully beating them more often than not. No matter what the outcome is, I still sigh a little sigh when I realise my opponent is more computer controlled than it is human.

**Just realised half my rant belonged in another thread, apologies all round for that, this thread seems to have both issues converging in it**

The Silver Star · Oct 30, 2006, 02:27 PM // 14:27

Ok heres how i see 6v6 compared to 8v8, well the change from 8v8 to 6v6 was good in many ways nerfing builds etc. It is still fun to play in 6v6 but i am feeling it a little more repeatable and less fun mainly due to the fact that there seems to be less variety of builds. Another thing that i dont enjoy is that fact thats you only have 6 players in a team and not 8 purely because i cant play with as many of my in-game friends as i would want to making me "neglect" some people and having to turn people down frequently.

As for the whole heros thing they shouldnt be available in HA in my opinion even if it is "Heroes" Ascent, im not saying this because i get beaten by these teams but that fact that i play PvP to play players not NPC's. For example i hel halls the other day and only had to hold against "Heroways" most of the time making it a little easy and boring even if your getting fame.

Legendary Shiz · Oct 30, 2006, 11:17 PM // 23:17

To be honest, I don't see the point of letting us use heroes in HA if they created Hero Battles. The point of hero battles, is to show YOUR skill and how YOU can control a team. The point of heroes ascent, is to show your teams skill, coordination, and knowledge of what to do and when to do it.

Maybe it was the heroes thing that they got confused on?

ZiegDivine · Oct 30, 2006, 11:46 PM // 23:46

I can't wait until the next update:

"Heroes' Ascent has been renamed to 'Hero Battle v2'"

Nurse With Wound · Oct 31, 2006, 04:01 AM // 04:01

Basicly, Heroes Ascend was destroyed during last two months. Begining from the double fame weekend, then came the 6v6 nerf which caused massive exodus of the dedicated HA guilds, to the current "hero" problem, which basicly cleared the Halls from all good players. Rank system wasnt worth much before ( thanks to simple noob farming builds ), now its compleatly worthless - Ted the wammo and his 5 henches can farm this title just like he farmed the trolls before. Ha rank now means you can kill enemy bots with your own bots. This isnt PVP anymore, this is a joke, which does not include PLAYER VS PLAYER.

The only serious PVP now is GVG. Sadly, as those two arenas ( gvg and HA ) complimented each other nicely. Now, HA is gone, gone forever.

I'm 100% sure that the HA population now is half of what was before. Silence from anet in all the threads dedicated to those unfortunate updates is insulting to me, and lots of other PVP players. Game, that was advertised as PVP centered is quickly loosing its status as the serious Player vs Player competion, and its slowly turning into a big disaster. I know me, and others will be ignored by anet. Simply because all they care is quick profit, and they doesnt give a RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO about dedicated player-base. They are loosing it, day by day, quicker and quicker. I think Nightfall is the last Guild Wars for PVP players. Not many of us will buy another. I wont. There will be better PVP games with fantasy setting, in fact they are coming soon, and from developer who is well known for his support to the dedicated player-base.