Curse

Ado · Oct 04, 2006, 06:02 PM // 18:02

It are us, the players who are responsable for this change since we nearly all play gimmickbuilds. That includes balanced, since that is just as gimmick as all the other builds we see in HA. We've forced Anet to make such a radical decision cause we're unwilling to play new builds. However, the 6vs6 will have the opposite effect of what Anet wants. It'll result in even more gimmickbuilds and less variety.

Alazare · Oct 04, 2006, 06:02 PM // 18:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blame the Monks

As opposed to 3 monks minimum plus at least 1-2 other defensive builds?

Monk backlines will be forced to adjust and evolve. Most prevalent gimmicks will be forced to evolve or die. People will have to devise new builds. Holding spike can no longer dominate. (spike in 321. Good, now put up wards, aegis, fertile, simbi, and seed/SB the hero. K, now we wait for 15 minutes. I'm going to get a drink, brb. GG, have a sigil.). HoH will actually take more skill and be less about holding with an ubar defensive build now.

What exactly is bad about this? I'm very pleased with the change.

Plz dont post here if you don play HA.

Timoz · Oct 04, 2006, 06:03 PM // 18:03

As everyone saw during the event when this was previewed, many of the high ranked guilds came out and played, because this favours them in many ways with it being more individual rather than team based.

Although Anet's main principle was based on individual skill, they will lose a large amount of players, and btw, what shit timing losing the type of pvp with the largest following, when all they really needed to do was stomp up interest with a few pretty new maps or a new arena, lower sales for Nightfall FTL. If there was ever a show of intent that sucked the most(i.m.o), we are about to see it.

They wonder how they lost so many players since modding it in the first place, look at how much care they've actually shown towards it.. Decreasing teams on maps and leaving the maps completely un modded for over a year, including in halls.. leaving iway intact, which lost over half of my full f list from the game, all some fairly highly ranked pre iway. Anet just don't learn

DarkCloud · Oct 04, 2006, 06:06 PM // 18:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Minus Sign

Don't think it won't happen GvGers? Thats alright. Just keep in mind: last week I thought Anet knew better than to change HA to 6 man.

It would never happen to GvG because GvG is real PVP competition whereas Heroes Ascent or Tombs is garbage. GvG stakes are a lot higher than in Heroes Ascent. Anet cares more about GvG than the broken and corrupted heroes ascents.

JR · Oct 04, 2006, 06:08 PM // 18:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Divinus Stella

Yeh, whats with all the deleting? getting boring tbh, whats the point in having a public forum where peoples views get censored if they are not the same as yours?

I have already stated that I actually agree with the majority of people; in that the change was a bad thing. I do not 'censor', people are free to have any opinion they wish. As long as they express it in a way that is somewhere close to sensible.

That will be the last post debating this particular issue.

Mo Joe Joe Joe · Oct 04, 2006, 06:08 PM // 18:08

The draw of PVP for me has always been the challenge of battling other people. Builds that looked great on paper can get steam rolled because of how the foes adapts to your play. This is and always will be the appeal of PVP for me. I am not a fan of random arena due to many matches being decided by leavers that did not see their desired 4 man configuration. i am not a fan of team arenas, because until recently there was no point (gladiator title added, but I have not gone back yet). HA has fascinated me, I enjoyed it immensely win or lose (the emotes are nice and chance for loot from HA chest). I thoroughly enjoyed the 6 man weekend, but not because of the team #. Rather due to the metagame was in total flux for 2 days, all kinds of builds were pulled from the past and new tweaks attempted. The third day the metagame settled down and some routine was established once more.

I would like to see a fluctuating party number every week or so. I love change and wish some of you could stop berating Anet for forcing you to break from your routine. You have been challenged to adapt yor strategies or rage quit, which will you choose???

Mira Sticks · Oct 04, 2006, 06:08 PM // 18:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blame the Monks

K, now we wait for 15 minutes. I'm going to get a drink, brb. GG, have a sigil.)

What exactly is bad about this?

If you know nothing about how something works, dont make stuff up about it.

Lord Mendes · Oct 04, 2006, 06:10 PM // 18:10

I'm going to say this again, making a decision that will change an entire and popular (yes, many people play HA) aspect of PVP based on a single weekend that was even offering double fame is wrong.
Making a decision regarding HA based on polls taken by a majority of PvEers is wrong. Take W/Mo Eddie Ironfist Killer, he spends all his time farming FoW and wants start Haing, but can't because he is rankless. He will obviously vote for HA 2 b 6v6 because he thinks that finding teams will b easier. Now basing such a major change on many people like Eddie who might not even like or PLAY HA in the future is total BS.

You can see that most the people that have posted in this thread are regular HAers, and 90% want to keep HA 8v8.
Why change something so many people like.

Lykan · Oct 04, 2006, 06:12 PM // 18:12

I cant beleive the stupidity of Anet thinking this is what people want.
Yes 6vs6 weekend was popular but as a gimmick nothing more.

You might get a few more people coming back and a few newer players, but they will just leave again.

The e drama and rank discrimination wont change, newplayers still wont get into top groups and still wont get past the first 2 maps.

6vs6 is goin to limit team creation so much there will de just VIM and Degenway left. I seriously doubt full dervish and paragons will even get a look in. 6 slots with 10 profs to choose from and 2 monks at least for a stable backline. Way to limit diversity.

Bankai · Oct 04, 2006, 06:19 PM // 18:19

I'm really annoyed by some people. Who? There are two ones.

A). The rank 9+ that only farm iway (note: if this doesn't apply to you, don't feel offended.). Because they aren't able to run the build they've been running for the past month for a week or so until a new iway mod has been found, they think this is crap. Without saying why. Yes, HA was broken, and yes, I think this was needed. And no, not everybody who isn't rank 9+ or gets 300 fame a week is noob. And no, people that like this change aren't 'pve noobs' or hardcore gvgers.

B). The ones that are whining about the fact that HA is getting 'nerfed' while gvg stays unharmed. Don't you see why? 80 percent of the freaking people in HA is making Iway/vimway/Bspike groups. Yes, only about 40% of the groups you see are vimway/iway/bspike. However, the ones that aren't are A) Guildies or B) Rank 9+ guys that want to run something different, but have enough contacts to be able to do so. Yes, you run into the occasional balanced that's not one of these. Yes, sometimes they win. But I'm talking about the majority. And gvg? Look at observer mode. Play with some guilds. Yes, you will see the same type of guys. However, it's not something like Iway. Instead, people are still varying. Instead of blatantly copying a known build, most people in gvg mod it into their own way (note: The whole time I'm actually not talking about those that mod vim/iway and make their own kind of build. I give creds to those guys. They're trying to change while still making it easy to form a group.). Yes, you will see e/mo runners a lot. However, you'll also see me/w runners. Cripshotters. And the main body can be even more varied. While yes, there is a kind of fotm (degen with MA and cripshot), it's not played by a lot.

Hmmm, I had more in my head, but I forgot.

DarkCloud · Oct 04, 2006, 06:20 PM // 18:20

I dont agree or disagree with Anet's change from 8 vs 8 to 6 vs 6 because they are only trying to revive Heroes Ascent. If any of you HAers actually play HA, you should all know that the players in Heroes Ascent is at a declining rate. The only time when there were a lot of turnouts in HA was during the 6 vs 6 event. On regular basis 8 vs 8 heroes ascent, there is a MASSIVE SKIPPING. It is like no one plays the Heroes Ascent part of this game. I hope 6 vs 6 will reduce the skipping, but it's clear a lot of playes disagree with 6 vs 6. I hope things works out

subterra · Oct 04, 2006, 06:22 PM // 18:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lykan

I cant beleive the stupidity of Anet thinking this is what people want.
Yes 6vs6 weekend was popular but as a gimmick nothing more.
[/qoute]

IMO, it was only so popular because of the 2x fame. Is this so hard for them to understand.

You might get a few more people coming back and a few newer players, but they will just leave again.[/quote]

Exactly, the people who play tombs day in and out are the ones who will continue to play in halls. New players interested in Tombs will get in groups one way or the other. The majority of the people that vimway'd to r3 the preview weekend probably dont play HA any longer.

Quote:

The e drama and rank discrimination wont change, newplayers still wont get into top groups and still wont get past the first 2 maps.

If anything this will make it worse. And you're correct, any new players wont make it past Burial.

Quote:

6vs6 is goin to limit team creation so much there will de just VIM and Degenway left. I seriously doubt full dervish and paragons will even get a look in. 6 slots with 10 profs to choose from and 2 monks at least for a stable backline. Way to limit diversity.

This game is balanced around 64 skills. That's the way it has always been and the way it should be. I have no clue still why they think this is for the best. Tombs was stale, but 6v6 isnt going to refresh tombs.

Alazare · Oct 04, 2006, 06:24 PM // 18:24

Most of the people you see posting on this thread are not iway/vim noobs but high ranked ballanced players.

Wilhelm · Oct 04, 2006, 06:24 PM // 18:24

I won't particularly comment on the 6 man format now, but take a look back on one of the major changes that Anet did before factions was released.

At the time everyone thought they had destroyed Minion Masters, but once factions was released, everyone saw why they changed many of the death necro skills.....to save Alliance Battles. (ex. limiting amount of minions)

Now I can't remeber many of the other skill balances that were released that update, but they were ultimatly for the better of the Factions Pvp area.

Soooo, my speculation would be that the change to 6 man, is merely saving the dignity of Halls. Once people find creative, effective ways to use Paragons, and Devrishes, you'll find that killing 6 of them will be hard enough, let alone 8.

But of course there is always Guild Battles, which is far superior in everyway to Halls, and remain 8 man.

Minus Sign · Oct 04, 2006, 06:28 PM // 18:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkCloud

It would never happen to GvG because GvG is real PVP competition whereas Heroes Ascent or Tombs is garbage. GvG stakes are a lot higher than in Heroes Ascent. Anet cares more about GvG than the broken and corrupted heroes ascents.

You sure? You asked them this and thats the answer they gave DarkCloud? Did they say anything else while you were talking to them. Things like this:

They don't consider guilds using thump and spike builds to climb the laddar an issue? Champ point farmers aren't an issue for corruption? Using gimmick builds to puff your rank isn't a problem?

They haven't had to insistute resets in the past over rampant skill abuse? They didn't actually have to rest the laddar just recently then, right? I mean GvGers weren't using an exploit to kill off Guild Lords in seconds, right?

And they consider guilds (too many imho) basically copy and pasting their skillbars from what they saw in Observer the other night to be original and creative?

Fear the masses that don't/can't play your gametype. You should be quaking in your boots over what they're doing to HA--making it "more accessable" to the masses.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bankai

80 percent of the freaking people in HA is making Iway/vimway/Bspike groups.

Frankly i disagree with this. While a high percentage of PuGs advertising in HA may be running gimmick (and they run them because you can pick up any player you want and they'll know the build at a glance) most of the teams that hold Halls use Whisper and call in friends.

Recently I've seen fewer Vims, less B-Spike and only a hadful of IWAYs in games and observer. Maybe I've just been lucky (and admittadly, not playing that much; ladders open so gimme a break) but gimmicks seem like they've been going down, not up.

Lord Mendes · Oct 04, 2006, 06:31 PM // 18:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by subterra

The majority of the people that vimway'd to r3 the preview weekend probably dont play HA any longer.

Wow you couldnt have gotten it more wrong. I hope you realize that most people that are posting here are/were in top balanced HA guild. The r3 vimwayers welcome the change because it is easier to form parties and there will b no more bloodspike around.

azunder · Oct 04, 2006, 06:32 PM // 18:32

I think the only people who are badly hurt by this change are the ones in dedicated HA teams. People who aren't tied to a group of 8 are just going to experience a metagame shift similar to one that comes with a skill balance. Joe IWAY will just use some other build and will shout LFM a bit less. Teams of 8 who've stuck to HA for awhile will have less fun in HA though. Either two (or more) people will sit out when they play or they'll switch over to GvG.

If they just wanted to fix broken mechanics, some map changes would be enough instead of changing the amount of players. So, 6v6 seems like a quick and dirty fix. However, since they announced exciting map changes it could mean that this change was a well planned descision that goes beyond the number of players. If there's no difference, then anet just ended up antagonizing current HA groups in exchange for some pre-Nightfall excitement.

Bankai · Oct 04, 2006, 06:39 PM // 18:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkCloud

I dont agree or disagree with Anet's change from 8 vs 8 to 6 vs 6 because they are only trying to revive Heroes Ascent. If any of you HAers actually play HA, you should all know that the players in Heroes Ascent is at a declining rate. The only time when there were a lot of turnouts in HA was during the 6 vs 6 event. On regular basis 8 vs 8 heroes ascent, there is a MASSIVE SKIPPING. It is like no one plays the Heroes Ascent part of this game. I hope 6 vs 6 will reduce the skipping, but it's clear a lot of playes disagree with 6 vs 6. I hope things works out

This too. I haven't played a relic map in ages. And when I finally got one, the other team got an err=7 and they resigned.

subterra · Oct 04, 2006, 06:40 PM // 18:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lord Mendes

Wow you couldnt have gotten it more wrong. I hope you realize that most people that are posting here are/were in top balanced HA guild. The r3 vimwayers welcome the change because it is easier to form parties and there will b no more bloodspike around.

lol, I think I'm confused by your statement.

I completely understand that the preview event Vim/Iway r3's want the change.

What I'm saying is since AFTER the preview event, you do not see 15 Districts of Heroes Ascent. It's back to the normal 4-5 ID's. Most of the r3 vimwayers (etc) ARE NOT the people who play tombs day in day out. I dunno, I'm just saddened by this change.

Boofhead · Oct 04, 2006, 06:43 PM // 18:43

Maybe those people who are in teams of 8 can make 4 more friends and create 2 teams of 6?