Curse

CalypsoX · Sep 19, 2006, 07:58 AM // 07:58

Good luck trying to pick up stuff when you're pve'ing :P. You can add "another pack mule" as an additional requirement for making pve monks pvp ready (optimally, of course).

moriz · Sep 19, 2006, 02:08 PM // 14:08

i find using the Judge's armor on torso and legs and using shepherd's (the +hp one) on hands and feet to be quite effective. the the torso and legs are the two most likely places to be hit, so they deserve better armor. since the hands and feet are rarely hit, the +hp can be use to benefit the torso and legs without much increase in damage taken.

and yeah, it takes an arm and a leg to properly outfit a monk.

The Silver Star · Sep 19, 2006, 02:16 PM // 14:16

I use the health armor on a monk all the time as it can save your ass if you get spiked, the more health the merrier i say

JR · Sep 19, 2006, 02:22 PM // 14:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by moriz

i find using the Judge's armor on torso and legs and using shepherd's (the +hp one) on hands and feet to be quite effective. the the torso and legs are the two most likely places to be hit, so they deserve better armor. since the hands and feet are rarely hit, the +hp can be use to benefit the torso and legs without much increase in damage taken.

As stated before, I think this approach is pretty pointless. THe HP gain from the shepards armor scales with how likely that area is to be hit; so your arms and feet may not be likely to get hit, but they also give you less HP than a chest piece would. The chest piece being most likely to get hit, gives you more HP.

It is either worth running Judges, or it is worth running Shepards.

moriz · Sep 19, 2006, 02:41 PM // 14:41

let's assume the +health on the shepherd's set is equivalent to the +10 AL vs physical on the judge's set (they're probably not, but for comparism purposes, let's assume it)

with full judge's set, you get +10 AL vs physical on all body parts, as stated.

with judge's torso and legs, and shepherd's gloves and feet, you get +10 AL vs physical on the two body parts as well as the +10hp. since the torso and legs are the most likely places to be hit, you've just gained (essentially) an unconditional +10 hp.

think of it this way: the +10 hp from the shepherd's set might as well be applied globally; it's there no matter where you get hit. so if you get hit in the torso and legs, you will gain the +10 AL vs physical, as well as the extra 10 hp buffer; which is better than just +10 AL by itself.

of course, my reasoning is based on individual hits. it might not add up the same overall.

JR · Sep 19, 2006, 02:49 PM // 14:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by moriz

let's assume the +health on the shepherd's set is equivalent to the +10 AL vs physical on the judge's set (they're probably not, but for comparism purposes, let's assume it)

with full judge's set, you get +10 AL vs physical on all body parts, as stated.

with judge's torso and legs, and shepherd's gloves and feet, you get +10 AL vs physical on the two body parts as well as the +10hp. since the torso and legs are the most likely places to be hit, you've just gained (essentially) an unconditional +10 hp.

think of it this way: the +10 hp from the shepherd's set might as well be applied globally; it's there no matter where you get hit. so if you get hit in the torso and legs, you will gain the +10 AL vs physical, as well as the extra 10 hp buffer; which is better than just +10 AL by itself.

of course, my reasoning is based on individual hits. it might not add up the same overall.

You have to weigh up the unconditional +10 hp against every time you get hit in the arms or legs. I believe (I am at work, so I can't check) that if you add the percetage chances of being hit together, it comes out at around 33%. 33% of 30hp is 10hp~.

As such, you don't really gain any benefit, you are just at some compromise between the two. The way I see it; if it is worth running Judges, then it is worth running full Judges. If it is worth running Shepards, then it is worth running full Shepards. It depends on what you face, and what kind of hits you will be taking.

Blame the Monks · Sep 19, 2006, 03:03 PM // 15:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR-

As such, you don't really gain any benefit, you are just at some compromise between the two. The way I see it; if it is worth running Judges, then it is worth running full Judges. If it is worth running Shepards, then it is worth running full Shepards. It depends on what you face, and what kind of hits you will be taking.

I agree with JR 100%. Full sets are better. I typically run:

+ health if I am DPed, against blood spike/sbri, against a pure degen team (no wars), or if I am running a Mo/A with dark escape and a superior rune (the +health armor is more valuable when you can rely on DE to half your damage imo). I will also sometimes switch to my health armor at vod or in splits depending on the situation

+ armor v physical (judges) against any team with warriors. I spend probably 75%+ of the time on judges.

+ armor while enchanted when I am tombing with channeling or when I believe the other team has limited enchant removal and is not likely to strip and spike me

romO · Sep 19, 2006, 07:35 PM // 19:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blame the Monks

I agree with JR 100%. Full sets are better.

JR's statement was not an opinion. He was stating facts.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blame the Monks

+ health if I am DPed, against blood spike/sbri, against a pure degen team (no wars), or if I am running a Mo/A with dark escape and a superior rune (the +health armor is more valuable when you can rely on DE to half your damage imo). I will also sometimes switch to my health armor at vod or in splits depending on the situation

You just said that you understood (or at least that's what I take away from your "agreeing" with JR) that health from a certain piece of armor and the hit percentage of that piece scale accordingly. Why, then, would you use health armor only when DP'ed or with a superior rune? When you have DP or are under the effect of VoD, your health armor doesn't even give you as much health as it normally would, as the health gain from the armor will be reduced by the percentage of your DP or by 25% at VoD. If anything, that is all the more reason to run judge's in those situations, as the armor never loses it's effect, while health does. The damage reduction from the extra armor is always the same, and if you believe it is more reduction than 35 health in a spike under normal conditions (no DP, no VoD), then there is no arguement to ever change to health armor, as the advantages that you have stated of running physical armor will only increase over time. I think that looking to add to health when DP'ed or at VoD is simply a panic reflex. I'm not saying that you're wrong to do what you do, as I can't really tell you what armor will always be "best" for you, but I just wanted to point out the contradictions in that statement and a common misconception of many players.

I'm not going to comment on the Mo/A part because... yeah...

stueyman2099 · Sep 19, 2006, 07:53 PM // 19:53

Off topic.

I'm curious here, VoD reduce the armor bonuses you get from items too? I was under the impression that it took your total life and reduced that and didn't touch +hp mods.

sm2006 · Sep 19, 2006, 07:57 PM // 19:57

btw, sry to ask a noob question here but... what dose VOD mean?
i'm guessing its some kind of smiting and trapping build that dose high dmg but not sure.

Savio · Sep 19, 2006, 08:12 PM // 20:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by romO

When you have DP or are under the effect of VoD, your health armor doesn't even give you as much health as it normally would, as the health gain from the armor will be reduced by the percentage of your DP or by 25% at VoD.

DP doesn't reduce health from armor or items iirc. I don't think VoD does either.

Zui · Sep 19, 2006, 08:14 PM // 20:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by sm2006

btw, sry to ask a noob question here but... what dose VOD mean?
i'm guessing its some kind of smiting and trapping build that dose high dmg but not sure.

http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/%22Victory_or_Death%21%22

sm2006 · Sep 19, 2006, 09:09 PM // 21:09

cheers man

Tainek · Sep 19, 2006, 09:38 PM // 21:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by romO

JR's statement was not an opinion. He was stating facts.

You just said that you understood (or at least that's what I take away from your "agreeing" with JR) that health from a certain piece of armor and the hit percentage of that piece scale accordingly. Why, then, would you use health armor only when DP'ed or with a superior rune? When you have DP or are under the effect of VoD, your health armor doesn't even give you as much health as it normally would, as the health gain from the armor will be reduced by the percentage of your DP or by 25% at VoD. If anything, that is all the more reason to run judge's in those situations, as the armor never loses it's effect, while health does. The damage reduction from the extra armor is always the same, and if you believe it is more reduction than 35 health in a spike under normal conditions (no DP, no VoD), then there is no arguement to ever change to health armor, as the advantages that you have stated of running physical armor will only increase over time. I think that looking to add to health when DP'ed or at VoD is simply a panic reflex. I'm not saying that you're wrong to do what you do, as I can't really tell you what armor will always be "best" for you, but I just wanted to point out the contradictions in that statement and a common misconception of many players.

I'm not going to comment on the Mo/A part because... yeah...

at 30% DP, With 480 HP, You Have 336 HP
At 30% DP With 480+35 HP, You Have 371HP

Notice that the increase in % increases as you get DP? thats because +Health Mods arnt Affected by VoD, Or DP

+Armour is More effective when you have high HP, the advantage of +AL is that it reduces pressure, and with High HP, your at lesser risk of spikes.

at 500 or so hp, the + AL Armour and reduction in pressure is more valuble than the +hp, especially as % wise, the HP only adds 7% or so

When your DP'd, you are Much MUCH more vunerable to spikes, Pressure is less of a concern, spikes are more-so, so now +Hp Armour is more valuble, Especially as it now adds 10-13% More HP

Blame the Monks · Sep 20, 2006, 01:54 AM // 01:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by romO

When you have DP, your health armor doesn't even give you as much health as it normally would, as the health gain from the armor will be reduced by the percentage of your DP.

Incorrect Sir. Health loss from DP is calculated before +life from gear.

http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Death_penalty

romO · Sep 20, 2006, 04:58 AM // 04:58

I'm sorry. I was wrong. Finding flaws in my arguement = +10 street cred.

sm2006 · Sep 21, 2006, 06:55 PM // 18:55

post the weapons that monks use
like: +5 20% weapon and a artifact offhand?

romO · Sep 21, 2006, 07:34 PM // 19:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by sm2006

post the weapons that monks use
like: +5 20% weapon and a artifact offhand?

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10047977

comonnow · Sep 30, 2006, 02:18 AM // 02:18

well i think everything about the armor has been said. For weapons its ok to have that +5 20% enchant sword or axe, however i always have a +5 energy +30 HP too. If I'm not too pressured I will switch to the enchant to cast prot spirit and stuff along those lines, but if i'm under pressure I usually dont wanna fumble around with too many weapon swaps (although it comes with being a good monk) and just use my +30 HP since monks should have as much HP as possible.

Hybrid Theory · Oct 02, 2006, 12:56 AM // 00:56

i use full ascetics :P