Curse

Zuranthium · Nov 12, 2006, 10:05 PM // 22:05

TIER 1:

1. Monks - Still the King; nobody is even attempting Rit Healers anymore. At least 2 in every team.

2. Warrior - The most trusted (meh, that does not mean best though) melee character and arguably the best solo gankers now as well.

3. Mesmer - A pair of them is quite common; shutdown is powerful as always.

4. Elementalist - They remain the most common flagrunners, loved for their Heal Party spam. Searing Flames is seeing play too.

5. Paragon - They are to GvG what Spirit Spammers were to HA...most teams are running one.

TIER 2:

6. Ranger - People moved away from Toxicity pretty quick but Thumpers are very strong and Cripshots/Trappers are used occasionally as well.

7. Necromancer - Their hexes are being used more but Taint is also way less popular as well. Either way they aren't widely seen.

8. Dervish - People are experimenting with one here and there but a Warrior or Thumper is more menacing.

TIER 3:

9. Ritualist - Can be powerful when several are used together but people just aren't trying at it. I've only seen one Rit team lately, although it was excellent. Other than that I haven't seen ANY Rits.

10. Assassin - Not quite as extinct as Ritualists, but still rare and certainly less effective.

skillsbas8 · Nov 12, 2006, 10:15 PM // 22:15

Agreed more or less.
I might move necros to tier 3, but meh.

fatboyslimerr · Nov 12, 2006, 11:04 PM // 23:04

How are warriors now arguably the best gankers ?
Assassins will always be able to beat warriors at ganking imo unless there's something I'm missing?

Skuld · Nov 12, 2006, 11:08 PM // 23:08

YAAhooooooooo maybe

Thom · Nov 12, 2006, 11:27 PM // 23:27

Has the meta game really settled down to the point where this type of analysis is helpful? At least in my guild, people are still sorting out what the best skills are for our style of play and which tactics work best against meta.

I like many of the new necro skills and could see necros becoming a large part of the metagame or at least the counter meta.

Eilsys · Nov 12, 2006, 11:34 PM // 23:34

I see Assassins somewhat frequently for splits and flag runs.

I wish there was a spirit that boosted the healing on Ritualist healing spells, but oh well.

Zuranthium · Nov 13, 2006, 12:53 AM // 00:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by fatboyslimerr

How are warriors now arguably the best gankers ?
Assassins will always be able to beat warriors at ganking imo unless there's something I'm missing?

"You're All Alone", as Skuld abbreviated (well, sorta, lol).

Riotgear · Nov 13, 2006, 01:15 AM // 01:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eilsys

I see Assassins somewhat frequently for splits and flag runs.

I wish there was a spirit that boosted the healing on Ritualist healing spells, but oh well.

The problem isn't the amount of healing they can pump out. After the latest buff, rit healing spells are extremely efficient. The problem is that they're very one-dimensional. Their ability to control hexes, conditions, spikes, and mitigate damage in ways other than just healing it off are very limited. The latter two can be somewhat taken care of by spirit spam, but that isn't exactly what you'd call a monk substitute.

Thom Bangalter · Nov 13, 2006, 03:06 AM // 03:06

eles tier 2? for serious? But rangers are tier 1?

Wasteland Squidget · Nov 13, 2006, 05:06 AM // 05:06

I would say maybe 1 in 20 of the builds we see do not have an ele, for Heal Party if nothing else. Those builds, almost without exception, die instantly because we have an ele spamming Heal Party and they don't. Monks at present are absolutely addicted to Heal Party spam, and most of the alternatives to Heal Party are elite or not as good.

I would tend to agree with the rest, though assassins could be tier 2 or 3. Ritualists are really in a class of their own.

Thom Bangalter · Nov 13, 2006, 05:17 AM // 05:17

HP spam and their running abilities put them in a higher tier than both mesmer and rangers. I'd be perfectly content in a balanced build without a paragon or a ranger, but as squidget noted, hp wins games by preventing your team from cracking under pressure. Unless you like dying due to searing flames/hex degen/condition pressure.

I'm shocked that you consider them Tier 2, moreso that you think they should be relegated to the land of assassins and ritualists.

Rangers, on the other hand, should be moved to tier 2. They're handy, but most builds don't NEED them. Their two strongest bars won't neccessarily be missed, but heal party would be.

LoyalSoldier · Nov 13, 2006, 06:23 AM // 06:23

I generally see Assassins used more as secondary professions(Such as the dark escape monk) than primary. While the primary types are still common enough to be noticed, not very many teams run them.

Zuranthium · Nov 13, 2006, 06:33 AM // 06:33

Here's my problem with judging Elementalists:

If you look at them as Heal Party bots, they are certainly Tier 1. Almost every team uses that character.

If you look at the actual Elementalist skills being used, they are Tier 3. The true essence of what an Elementalist is supposed to be is not what's reflected in their usage. Without Heal Party, a monk skill, Elem runners would be used FAR less.

As a comprimise I call them Tier 2. I would be tickled to death if Heal Party was moved to Divine Favour.

Vengal · Nov 13, 2006, 06:37 AM // 06:37

I see far more assassins the rits currently. IMO, i think people under value them, but thats neither here nor there.

Thom Bangalter · Nov 13, 2006, 06:50 AM // 06:50

I still don't understand that assessment when you note rangers and their strength as a thumper. i.e. A ranger that uses a lot of warrior skills.

Secondly, Blinding flash has always been strong enough to run a flagstand ele. Elementalist's large energy pool allows it to use overpriced monk skills without batting an eye. It's part of game design (allowing classes to use secondary class skills) and as such, they will always be a tier 1 character until another profession comes along that can compete with them.

Also, I still see a ton of searing flames teams. So I'm not so sure what you were referring to when you said that it has died down. If I went through the guild battle history, I'd estimate 85% of the teams we've faced have had searing flames somewhere.

just rude · Nov 13, 2006, 07:05 AM // 07:05

Mesmers tier1 really?

I love mesmers, but I rarely see then outside of the top 100. If you are trying to generalize the top1000 guilds, mesmers would be tier 2 easy if not 3.

Other than that put the ele's in tier 1, and I agree.

On a side note, the inablitily to strip weapon spells, shouts(not so much before now), echos, and chants is an in balance to the game. Until NF everyother good spell could be countered, if they wanted mending to be that powerful they should just had made it unremovable, and energizing finale please how unbalanced is that, blows the half the nrg management ascpect of a non ele caster right out of the water. 3 nrg every 5 secs is an extra 36 per minute and this can be re appiled ad noiseam.

yikes sorry to get off topic

LightningHell · Nov 13, 2006, 07:09 AM // 07:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zuranthium

Here's my problem with judging Elementalists:

If you look at them as Heal Party bots, they are certainly Tier 1. Almost every team uses that character.

If you look at the actual Elementalist skills being used, they are Tier 3. The true essence of what an Elementalist is supposed to be is not what's reflected in their usage. Without Heal Party, a monk skill, Elem runners would be used FAR less.

As a comprimise I call them Tier 2. I would be tickled to death if Heal Party was moved to Divine Favour.

E/Mo using Monk skills is still E/.

Also, people HAVE been experimenting with Mind Shock runners.

Thom Bangalter · Nov 13, 2006, 07:11 AM // 07:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by just rude

Mesmers tier1 really?

I love mesmers, but I rarely see then outside of the top 100. If you are trying to generalize the top1000 guilds, mesmers would be tier 2 easy if not 3.

Other than that put the ele's in tier 1, and I agree.

On a side note, the inablitily to strip weapon spells, shouts(not so much before now), echos, and chants is an in balance to the game. Until NF everyother good spell could be countered, if they wanted mending to be that powerful they should just had made it unremovable, and energizing finale please how unbalanced is that, blows the half the nrg management ascpect of a non ele caster right out of the water. 3 nrg every 5 secs is an extra 36 per minute and this can be re appiled ad noiseam.

yikes sorry to get off topic

1) I agree about the ele statement.

2) the reason they're (mesmers) not run as often on the lower part of the ladder is because, frankly, most people can't play them properly.

3)Expect a re-balance of energizing finale after this season is over.

4) Weapon spells, generally, aren't good enough to need to be removed. item spells can't be traditionally countered, either. Diversion is generally the answer to everything though.

just rude · Nov 13, 2006, 07:20 AM // 07:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thom Bangalter

Diversion is generally the answer to everything though.

QFT
Diverson spam FTW, what a bitch!

Xero Silvam · Nov 13, 2006, 07:27 AM // 07:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by just rude

QFT
Diverson spam FTW, what a bitch!

WTB: Holy Veil.