Curse

Legendary Shiz · Jan 02, 2007, 12:37 AM // 00:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elements_of_Galaxy

Aw, there isn't 1 on 1!

VIMWAY and IWAY plus [MATH] died when it changed to 6 vs 6. They will get "ressurected" if they change it back to 8 vs 8. Also, a lot of other builds and guilds couldn't win because of the 6 vs. 6 changes. So... they should make it back to 8 vs. 8.

Vimway was somewhat stronger in 6v6, infact it was the most run build during the double fame weekend.

It died because the skill itself got nerfed, it had nothing to do with changing to 6v6. MATH had died before 6v6 came about as well. IWAY got an uber nerf from the tigers fury nerf, they also nerfed EoE and Eviscerate (if only a minor nerf).

But to be honest, who reallly cares about IWAY? Why spoil another thread.

ange1 · Jan 02, 2007, 10:14 AM // 10:14

i think watever is wrong with 6v6 ha, it's just gonna be as bad no matter what the number number is.

and anet should wait and see the effect of hero nerf

Julen · Jan 02, 2007, 11:27 AM // 11:27

The effect of the hero nerf is allready clearly visible. If you play 4 games before you reach halls, you had a good run. I tend to skip to hall after having played 1-2 or when im lucky 3 or 4 games.

And why? to find a variation, either hex or condition, of that spirit build holding halls every friggin time. Or in the case im really lucky, its some dumb build with 4 eles all echoing sandstorm and just spamming the altar with those and wards.

dirtydutch · Jan 02, 2007, 02:00 PM // 14:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Julen

The effect of the hero nerf is allready clearly visible. If you play 4 games before you reach halls, you had a good run. I tend to skip to hall after having played 1-2 or when im lucky 3 or 4 games.

And why? to find a variation, either hex or condition, of that spirit build holding halls every friggin time. Or in the case im really lucky, its some dumb build with 4 eles all echoing sandstorm and just spamming the altar with those and wards.

Yea we all know the anet should ballanced those skills.

I totally agree with you about the hero nerf. After a long while i like to play HA again.

Bacon Goes Monk · Jan 02, 2007, 04:46 PM // 16:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by ange1

i think watever is wrong with 6v6 ha, it's just gonna be as bad no matter what the number number is.

and anet should wait and see the effect of hero nerf

Haven't we waited enough?

Lord Mendes · Jan 02, 2007, 04:55 PM // 16:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by ange1

i think watever is wrong with 6v6 ha, it's just gonna be as bad no matter what the number number is.

and anet should wait and see the effect of hero nerf

I think we have waited too long. First thing that needs to happen is a skill balance (which is long overdue btw), then let the metagame settle for 1 week and if it is still crap you know you got a problem, and you know something drastic has to be done.
8v8 would be the best step from which further modifications can be made to HA, simply because there is absolutely no noticable advantage to having 6v6 (no easier party formation bullcrap por favor) and the game and the arena is better balanced for 8v8.
6v6 is only magnifying the problems with skill imbalances and stale maps and game objectives in HA.
I'm just waiting on Izzy to balance the skills, which would hopefully lead to more balanced metagame, and a more balanced arena (though 8v8 would speed up the process).

Royale · Jan 02, 2007, 05:11 PM // 17:11

Hell yea 8v8. Tombs is sucking the fat one with build staleness right now.

elektra_lucia · Jan 02, 2007, 11:49 PM // 23:49

Allows better builds in my opinion. If it becomes 8vs8, maybe make IWAY not work on pets. NOT because I think IWAY is lame or gay, and I do not want an IWAY argument to be made. I just think, some people are really put off by it (personally I find it easiest build to beat) and it'd make people learn more.

Gimme Money Plzkthx · Jan 03, 2007, 03:30 AM // 03:30

I'm pretty sure a good 80-90% of people (that wanted it back) stated unconditionally that they wanted the 8v8 format back, simply because it was more fun. This means they find it to be more fun with the current system, fotms, etc. Personally, I would not be bothered if they kept the same maps (well, reinstituting burial and 1v1 b tower, maybe removing SE levers) and didn't nerf the previous fotms more than was already done. It is simply more fun, and from what I've seen, most people think they'd like it more with things like IWAY gone or map improvements, but they still think 8v8 would be a blast if it were reverted to the way it was. That is how I feel.

BenO_Under · Jan 03, 2007, 04:43 AM // 04:43

Ive been following this thread (and even voted for 8v8), and the whole time I've seen that around 75% of the community wants 8v8 back. (of this thread)

tomcruisejr · Jan 03, 2007, 07:59 AM // 07:59

I did some thinking. yes now i'm convinced that 8vs8 is good for all. implementing 8vs8 will back variety and the old useful players of HA who filled the HA districts. 8vs8 is a good thing.

if 8vs8 is implemented, i hope they nerf all the builds that other teams are running and the cheap builds that i can't beat so i can hold HA for like forever and get rank 12 at no time.

kopacha · Jan 03, 2007, 11:30 AM // 11:30

8v8 is clearly what I want to be back.

1. 8 team members = more options= more versatility= more interesting builds = more fun= HA is alive
2. I have too much good memories regarding 8v8 and just like it more.

Mental Leteci · Jan 03, 2007, 12:07 PM // 12:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by tomcruisejr

I did some thinking. yes now i'm convinced that 8vs8 is good for all. implementing 8vs8 will back variety and the old useful players of HA who filled the HA districts. 8vs8 is a good thing.

if 8vs8 is implemented, i hope they nerf all the builds that other teams are running and the cheap builds that i can't beat so i can hold HA for like forever and get rank 12 at no time.

HAH, SO FUNNEH.
(...)

Seriously, stop it.

Bastian · Jan 03, 2007, 04:20 PM // 16:20

I would like to recall my vote

I originally voted for the 6v6 because I thought it gave HA a new face, and would allow for some different types of creativity within 6 characters as opposed to 8. I also voted for 6v6 because I thought it would eliminate the number of similar builds that I constantly saw in HA (bspike, Iway, etc.).

I was wrong...

6v6, in my experience in the last month or so, has been as follows:

1) Whether it is the fact that NF skills have not been balanced yet, I'm not sure, but the 6v6 seems to encourage more mindless builds than 8v8 ever had.

2) Rank is so perverted that while I admit I am only r6, when forming PUG's or looking for extra needed players for r6+ groups, I find that many people within this rank range have so many skills still locked, and cannot competently use the ones they have unlocked. I feel this is from the overfarming of rank through mindless builds such as SF and VimWay. (i.e. had an r6 warrior, that refused to use TS and call adrenaline spikes, and when another member decided to switch to that spot, he could not fill the role of a PD mesmer because PD was not unlocked... just sad. Not to mention the fact that I was looking for a shock/axe warrior - and he came as a W/Mo - yes his title was showing too.)

3) The argument that 6v6 does not allow enough room for support skills is a fact. I like to run a balanced group, and I find that (like others have mentioned) HA has now become more about what skills are being brought - than the actual ability to use those skills correctly, or in strategic spots.

I could go on, but for these reasons, I would strongly like to have 8v8 back. Although, I think that ANet made the change to 6v6 in order to make HA better, it was a quick fix that, as I can see it now, was bound to fail.

I would like to see something more strategic for the HA maps. I know this has been said before, but cannot be emphasized enough. HA has grown stale because eventually, all it comes down to, is holding an alter. Of course, there is strategy invloved, but not enought for it to be as fun as it could be. And the strategy that was present in 8v8 has been slowly diminished by the pitfalls of 6v6.

Just my two cents...

BlackEagle · Jan 03, 2007, 05:00 PM // 17:00

I voted for 8v8 back.

In 10 HA runs today, only had 2 fights in Underworld, and often skipped many, many maps. This is because not enough people are playing, and I think 8v8 will bring back more players. 8v8 will bring back some of the old gimmicks, but there are many gimmicky builds now (By gimmick builds I mean that the build is the reason for people's success, not player skill) Also, 8v8 will allow the reintroduction of balanced, as IMO in 6v6 you can't make a build that is balanced. All a build can do is pack in counters for the FOTM.

6v6 also highlights the imbalanced skills, because it means less can be done to counter these skills.

6v6 doesn't even really help setup teams, especially for low ranks, which I think was partly Anets intention when introduces 6v6 - make it easier for unranked to get teams. This is because if you are a low rank, and less skilled, then in 6v6 your incompetency is more difficult to cover up with more competent players, so it means that ranked groups are less likely to take unranked than before.

Bacon Goes Monk · Jan 03, 2007, 08:49 PM // 20:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by tomcruisejr

I did some thinking. yes now i'm convinced that 8vs8 is good for all. implementing 8vs8 will back variety and the old useful players of HA who filled the HA districts. 8vs8 is a good thing.

if 8vs8 is implemented, i hope they nerf all the builds that other teams are running and the cheap builds that i can't beat so i can hold HA for like forever and get rank 12 at no time.

You fail at life.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackEagle

6v6 doesn't even really help setup teams, especially for low ranks, which I think was partly Anets intention when introduces 6v6 - make it easier for unranked to get teams. This is because if you are a low rank, and less skilled, then in 6v6 your incompetency is more difficult to cover up with more competent players, so it means that ranked groups are less likely to take unranked than before.

Extremely true. We refuse to take pugs now because of this.

master_of_puppets · Jan 03, 2007, 11:13 PM // 23:13

When 6 v 6 was first implemented on a stupid, rash decision that was based on a completely flawed and biased test that only lasted 4 days, I didnt think Anet would ever restore 8 v 8. But now I'd be surprised if they didnt, they'd have to be extremely stubborn to stand by their decision and overlook the declining numbers, the shitty state of the game, and all the people in favor of 8 v 8.
With all the people that were screwing around with the poll and voted 6 v 6, 8 v 8 is still in the lead by far. Not to mention a lot of people that voted for 6 v 6 have stated they want to change their vote to 8 v 8.
I seriously think its even harder now for unranked people to get fame now then it was during 8 v 8.
Anet, admit your mistake, and set things straight.

Teh Mighty Warrior · Jan 04, 2007, 01:11 AM // 01:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by tomcruisejr

I did some thinking. yes now i'm convinced that 8vs8 is good for all. implementing 8vs8 will back variety and the old useful players of HA who filled the HA districts. 8vs8 is a good thing.

if 8vs8 is implemented, i hope they nerf all the builds that other teams are running and the cheap builds that i can't beat so i can hold HA for like forever and get rank 12 at no time.

Could you do us all a favor and stop posting? 8v8 please so tomcruiser can go back to iway and quit posting on guru.

No seriously, 8v8 is much more enjoyable. I would rather play bspike and iway every day of the week then this spirit spam bullsh!t we've grown so fond of...

Bring back 8v8 and you bring back the days of 6+ international districts and 10 minutes trying to get into id1.

Nilator · Jan 04, 2007, 02:05 AM // 02:05

I vote 6v6, spike teams, SF, and most likely spirit spam teams would be to over powered.

bhavv · Jan 04, 2007, 03:32 AM // 03:32

Nurse I am trying to give my reasons why 8v8 is bad thank you. If that means disscussing why in terms of builds, why cant I do that without being called ignorant and being insulted for having a different point of view to the others?

Also I'm not opening a thread just to say 8v8 should not come back because of these builds because that will just get closed. If I may please upload the pics of 2 builds I took to exemplify this so that the devs may see clearly why I dont like the idea of 8v8 returning.

You are as much biased towards me as the others because you want 8v8 to return, that shouldnt stop me from being able to post my reasons why not if they are build based.

In response to below, I added the build discussion to my previous post.