Curse

Sinful Doom · Apr 11, 2007, 01:14 AM // 01:14

Ok Anet, will you at sometime come to the realization that teleportaion is simply a bad game mechanic and either nerf it into oblivion or remove it from the game period. These are the type's of things that make PvP just that much more crap. At the moment I'm directly pointing my middle finger at RECALL!

Zuranthium · Apr 11, 2007, 02:05 AM // 02:05

I hope this thread gets locked REAL soon.

~Z

Ipo · Apr 11, 2007, 02:17 AM // 02:17

What's wrong with shadow stepping?Its a perfectly fine. I'm with Zuranthium, this deserves to get locked.

Farin · Apr 11, 2007, 04:22 AM // 04:22

Shadow stepping is a broken mechanic. Recall is pretty broken, it's a little more manageable now but still broken.

Neo-LD · Apr 11, 2007, 05:09 AM // 05:09

OP is right.

/endtopic.

Living Parasite · Apr 11, 2007, 05:10 AM // 05:10

This thread won't take off the ground. Too bad he's right how shadowstepping shallows the game up instead of adding depth.

The Ernada · Apr 11, 2007, 06:26 AM // 06:26

I agree. Teleporting is a crap game mechanic.

For those that can't understand why: A lot of the skill in GW is positioning and movement. Teleporting throws all of that out the window. It adds nothing to PVP except lameness.

Bankai · Apr 11, 2007, 06:37 AM // 06:37

The only teleportation skill that isn't bad for the game is Return.

Lord Natural · Apr 11, 2007, 06:54 AM // 06:54

Switch Dash to a warrior skill and we can just delete assassins from the game entirely.

Sinful Doom · Apr 11, 2007, 08:52 AM // 08:52

I'll repeat myself from a post I made somewhere else. Prior to Factions and Nightfalls movement and positioning had to be carefully thought out. Bad positioning often times meant "your dead". Teleportaion too often negates this principle. If you honestly think teleportaion is fine look back not too far at all the problems it caused defending gankers in GvG. Fortunately SoH was nerfed enough to see it removed from use but we still have Recall, Shadow Prison, Shadow Walk etc... to deal with.

Thom Bangalter · Apr 11, 2007, 09:50 AM // 09:50

I concur. Sins are dumb.

Seamus Finn · Apr 11, 2007, 07:44 PM // 19:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sinful Doom

we still have Recall, Shadow Prison, Shadow Walk etc... to deal with.

Shadow prison took a fairly large hit in the nerfing of black spider at least. Recall, although slightly too powerful not to be elite and yet clearly not as good now as aod, isn't a huge problem anymore if you have a mesmer. I personally don't find the remaining aggro bubble shadow steps a huge problem. They really don't cause a huge problem in defending a base gank and tend to be interesting on other classses(return on monks). Also, the mobility provided by say shadowwalk is pretty balanced. A warrior can't use the skill due to wanting to stance on any kind of telespike and it gives sins a modicum of defense at the stand if he can use it competently as well as not providing any reasonable IAS for a 4 hit combo that a decent RC monk shouldn't have problems with anyhow. It gives a sin a caster spike quality I suppose, but with the design of the class I can't say he doesn't need it. Is the protection granted from shadowwalk at the stand any stronger than nat stride on a ranger?

If they were to remove recall from the game that would be fine by me, but I still think there are many more "game mechanics" that I would rather have removed (necro hexes for instance). I still get surprised by everyone who likes to take the "delete all the new classes from the game" stance, seeing as how necros are a prophesies class and have never had any business in a build that wasn't lame and still haven't(and probably never will). As lame as sins,rits,gons, and dervs can be at times, if I got to axe one class from the game, I wouldn't think twice about my decision...

Patccmoi · Apr 11, 2007, 08:18 PM // 20:18

I agree that i find Necros much more prone to be part of incredibly lame builds...

For shadowstepping, i'm divided on the issue. It DID take away something from the game more than it added imo, but i think the biggest issue is really just the long range shadowsteps. Limit shadowstepping to earshot range instead of radar range and it might prove much less ridiculous. I also think that the 'shadowsteps randomly in a nearby location' skills were a good idea but just end up all being sucky because of their stats/effects. If Heart of Shadow had 8-10s recharge for example, i think it'd be a great shadowstep/self heal that would add something more than it takes out.

The non-elite offensive shadowsteps are balanced by their recharge imo and aren't much of a problem. The elite ones seem ok now i think.

pah01 · Apr 12, 2007, 02:13 PM // 14:13

Teleportation is a retarded game mechanic that removes skill from positional play and removes skill from melee at times. In fact everythinmg about the sin either is broken/overpowered or crap. In fact everything about the four new classes is broken/overpowered or crap.

If ANET removed the four new classes from PVP and limited PVP to only the original core 6 classes would they lose money?

No.

In fact if they did that they could go back to relaeasing their stand alone chapters with retarded classes for the PVE carebears while only introducing a few problems into High end PVP with new core skills. Then after 2 weeks or so the game could have a balance update of the core skills and we would be back to a stable balanced metagame.

The reason for this is two fold.

1. The core classes concepts and mechanics are not game breaking in themselves. In fact even soul reaping is not so bad without rit spirits being spammed. This means upon release of any new chapter it is easier to balance the core classes.
If there is a really broken skill for one of the core classes you can simply make it a "PVE" only skill. These kinds of skills will now exist due to GW/eotn.

2. Gimmicky broken mecanincs from broken classes will no longer exist ie teleportation, chants, shouts (except a few warrior ones), spirits, weapon spells. This means that all of this crap will not hinder balancing the core classes skills when the new chapters come out.

This will go a long way towards mollifying PVP and PVE.

PVE get new content/classes and stuff and they will buy some carebears for ANET.

PVP wont have to put up with broken classes and then we will have a much more stable and balanced metagame. Competitve GVG play will start to rock. Maybe players who have left because ANET released broken stuff might even come back.

Last but not least soing this will not only solve the PVP problems in one fell swoop but allow ANET to do the one thing that is most important. MAKE MONEY from new expansions - because who knows GW2 might be 3-4 years way and not 2.

EDIT:Seamus the necromancers primary attribute was made worse by the addition of rits to the game. However necros can be used in a balanced non hex build - its just that the last time they were used as such was in prophecies. An anti melee guy with say draw condys blood rit and mark of subversion is a template that can be used effectivly.

Joe

Thom Bangalter · Apr 12, 2007, 04:51 PM // 16:51

be nice to the necros guys. they still have some ok things going for them. Tainted necros weren't that bad in KGYU builds, and there was a time when people used to take guys with like oob, blood ritual, life siphon, and a few blood nukes. that wasn't that bad was it?

Certainly not as bad as 3 guys rampaging your base that you can't do anything about because if you get too close they teleport across the map, only to repeat ad nauseum until lords have walked.

TheOneMephisto · Apr 12, 2007, 10:10 PM // 22:10

Defensive teleporting is okay, stuff like return and death's retreat are fine.

Offensive teleporting is retarded, and takes the skill out of playing warrior.

Arkese · Apr 12, 2007, 10:10 PM // 22:10

I agree about teleportation being a pain in the ass, and I, as an assassin-95%-of-the-time-player agree it's broken in some cases.
But it must be there:

Spikes with teleportation are not as strong as ones without - the target is given out by just looking around.
Assassins are almost as squishie as casters, and you don't want these on enemy backlines and overextending after the enemy monks without being able to get back for a good heal in time.
Monks positioning is extremely important, and Return does the job very nicely - without it, crapslash wars will just be too powerful (Like they are not already).
Split teams need ranged snares, and cripple is not good enough as it's removed/dodged easily. BoA assassins are already out of the meta, can't really score a kill by spiking with the recent nerf.

Non-GW-base classes just add so much for the PvP world - without it the meta will be EXACTLY same build over and over. There has to be some new abilities and skills to make a variety of builds possible.
It also incrases the builds quality as you have to figure out something that can deal with most of the things around - predictable or not.

Zui · Apr 12, 2007, 10:33 PM // 22:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arkese

Spikes with teleportation are not as strong as ones without - the target is given out by just looking around.

Do not post when you have absolutly no idea what you're talking about. Thanks.

Arkese · Apr 12, 2007, 11:28 PM // 23:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zui

Do not post when you have absolutly no idea what you're talking about. Thanks.

True, mobility for spikes is greater, but as long as they're not as fast you can really see it coming with the Shadow Walk animation.

TheOneMephisto · Apr 12, 2007, 11:37 PM // 23:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arkese

True, mobility for spikes is greater, but as long as they're not as fast you can really see it coming with the Shadow Walk animation.

And you think the shadow walk animation is more obvious than 2 warriors converging on a target? If the warriors are really good shadow walk might be more obvious, but with bad warriors teleporting is way easier.