Curse

phasola · Jun 11, 2007, 12:21 PM // 12:21

Quote:

LEARN TO THINK OF NEW BUILDS TO COUNTER ONES YOUR WHINING ABOUT.

Where's Ian Boyd when you need him ?

zakaria · Jun 11, 2007, 12:56 PM // 12:56

Multiple Goals: after the release of factions, HA started steady decline, it was because Anet introduced variety of options for player (pve or pvp one). Let’s see …they introduced titles, AB, more farming spots, Fort aspenwood/Jade Quarry, challenge missions, heroes, HvH, 3 elite missions, weekend events and HM.
If you just made small comparison between goals when we just had Prophecies and goals for player has 3 campaign now...it will answer a lot of unanswered questions.

Death_From_Above · Jun 11, 2007, 03:22 PM // 15:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xioden

Give points to whoever holds the altar in additional to points for killing, or even going back to a "whoever holds at the end" win condition, and keeping "Altar Capping 2.0".

Correction, it wasnt alter capping 2.0 it was called ELITE ALTER CAPPING THE UNIVERSES BEST MECHANIC EVER EXTREAME OWNAGE, EXTREAME POWER 1.0.

Anyways moving on swiftly.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Calnaion Blackhawk

Now ive been playing guild wars since it came out (look at my registered date), i admit i took a break for like, a few months while i was sucked into wow's vortex of nothingness.
But when i left IWAY was just about fotm, people were still running balanced mass hex builds, ranger int builds and the likely.

Now i don't play HA, or topk as it was anymore because of one main reason;
I don't think that i can get into groups, despite being rank7, as i didnt farm IWAY and get my oh so famous tiger.(and for those wondering, i got every single one of that fame by running balanced builds and ranger spike, Mental Block was STRICTLY anti-IWAY)

I dont particularly think that HA has been destroyed, i just think that people are too lazy to think of counters. The HA changes have ruined the community more than the game itself, people are high rank, think they know everything about the game because they can type /rank and see a pwetty tiger, and shun anyone who doesn't. If a lower rank team beats a high rank team, the rank9's all start whamming local chat with "LOLLNOOB" "Lucky lol", When i played they would generally say "well played" and then go back and discuss where they went wrong (Lol Empty Skillbars anyone?)
People are just getting too lazy to think of counters, AND/OR scared of trying new things incase they get flamed for running "noob" builds.

for those too lazy to read ;

LEARN TO THINK OF NEW BUILDS TO COUNTER ONES YOUR WHINING ABOUT.

Firstly i would like to thank you for the credibility of your post in the first say i think it was 2 paragraphs. You obviously know what your on about, yes under alter capping HA thrived, you had iway but it was only a gimmick which could easily get owned and many people still prefered to play other builds.

NOOW then. You say think of new builds to counter these builds running about in halls but i would like to pose the question for you, ever heard of gameplay. Kill count is seriously a dull boaring mechanic, i suggest you play it in the current HA before you even consider making such a suggestion. Many players have already done so, its dull, repetative and your restricted to certain builds.

Now you can claim your not but please tell me then how far i will get using a heavy hex build or say a full on pressure build. Please tell me who often gets more kills on kill count, spikes or balanced. Pressure or teams with mass AOE. As for the fact your rank 7 and you say its hard to get into teams i dont buy it like water does not buy into tea. You sure you were advertising correctly or looking correctly. Youll find most teams will take you on providing your good. Now if you suck thats a whole totaly different matter but last time i checked rank 6+ was still on a fairly high demand (can some1 please correct me if im wrong on this). As for rank 9s and playing, the majority dont go noob or wamoo or loser or even *die you anet supporter*. Many just say gg or even compliment you depending on how well you fought as i said or how unique your build is.

I believe that judgement is maybe based on a minority of players maybe from personal experiance but yes were ever you are you get losers be whether your in tokyo or Japan, the uk or the usa. Russia or even anets company.

If you go back to the fundimentals you will find the reason people are not playing HA is not because they got owned and they cannot be bothered to sort it out. Its either because its boaring and dull, you cant run proper balanced builds. Your restricted, anet dont give 2 cents about HA aka no skill balances. Its not about skill its about skillbars now, gimmicks kick your butt sometimes. I hear many people have to basically cater for gimmicks now. Pargons have 80+ armour ect.

Many people here such as randomway or nurse with wound if they wanted could go on HA an own some people. But the question you have to ask yourself is, do you play for playings sake or do you play to enjoy yourself. If HA were fixed many of us would be playing and i certainly would be making new builds and running my balanced. But the fact is the mechanics suck and there are more underlying problems than the issue of thinkin players are getting their chop sticks handed to them which is why many of us are not playing. You have seen it before, when heavy hex was what people ran how many people here quit or came 2 complain on the forums? When vimway was the craze how many people and so on and so on. Anyways just go play HA for say an hour then i guess and get back to me on your thoughts being you have played the old one and ull now be playing the new one so you can compare.

Calnaion Blackhawk · Jun 11, 2007, 04:02 PM // 16:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Death_From_Above

Correction, it wasnt alter capping 2.0 it was called ELITE ALTER CAPPING THE UNIVERSES BEST MECHANIC EVER EXTREAME OWNAGE, EXTREAME POWER 1.0.

Anyways moving on swiftly.

Firstly i would like to thank you for the credibility of your post in the first say i think it was 2 paragraphs. You obviously know what your on about, yes under alter capping HA thrived, you had iway but it was only a gimmick which could easily get owned and many people still prefered to play other builds.

NOOW then. You say think of new builds to counter these builds running about in halls but i would like to pose the question for you, ever heard of gameplay. Kill count is seriously a dull boaring mechanic, i suggest you play it in the current HA before you even consider making such a suggestion. Many players have already done so, its dull, repetative and your restricted to certain builds.

Now you can claim your not but please tell me then how far i will get using a heavy hex build or say a full on pressure build. Please tell me who often gets more kills on kill count, spikes or balanced. Pressure or teams with mass AOE. As for the fact your rank 7 and you say its hard to get into teams i dont buy it like water does not buy into tea. You sure you were advertising correctly or looking correctly. Youll find most teams will take you on providing your good. Now if you suck thats a whole totaly different matter but last time i checked rank 6+ was still on a fairly high demand (can some1 please correct me if im wrong on this). As for rank 9s and playing, the majority dont go noob or wamoo or loser or even *die you anet supporter*. Many just say gg or even compliment you depending on how well you fought as i said or how unique your build is.

I believe that judgement is maybe based on a minority of players maybe from personal experiance but yes were ever you are you get losers be whether your in tokyo or Japan, the uk or the usa. Russia or even anets company.

If you go back to the fundimentals you will find the reason people are not playing HA is not because they got owned and they cannot be bothered to sort it out. Its either because its boaring and dull, you cant run proper balanced builds. Your restricted, anet dont give 2 cents about HA aka no skill balances. Its not about skill its about skillbars now, gimmicks kick your butt sometimes. I hear many people have to basically cater for gimmicks now. Pargons have 80+ armour ect.

Many people here such as randomway or nurse with wound if they wanted could go on HA an own some people. But the question you have to ask yourself is, do you play for playings sake or do you play to enjoy yourself. If HA were fixed many of us would be playing and i certainly would be making new builds and running my balanced. But the fact is the mechanics suck and there are more underlying problems than the issue of thinkin players are getting their chop sticks handed to them which is why many of us are not playing. You have seen it before, when heavy hex was what people ran how many people here quit or came 2 complain on the forums? When vimway was the craze how many people and so on and so on. Anyways just go play HA for say an hour then i guess and get back to me on your thoughts being you have played the old one and ull now be playing the new one so you can compare.

perhaps.
And yes the old builds would get creamed in a split second thanks to the new "types" of gameplay introduced into HA (killcount, ect)
But my point was that people dont seem to be willing to think of original builds.
"Gimmick" or now they are called builds were once called by the Guilds name, for example.

when Marvel Superheroes started using ranger spike loads, people referred to it as the marvels build, because they used it the most, and quite obviously had to think of it (which was a lie) but thats not the point, its that guilds ran their own builds, or most of them did at least, now pretty much everyone runs, or trys to run the same stuff over and over. No wonder its become fotm, because no-one wants to try new things. (and yes there probably are people out there trying new builds but thats the minority)

I mean, this is HA, ID1 at 4:58 CET.

the diversity in class is lol!

I can see one warrior, and two or three mesmers.

Oh and btw before people claim my build is "Gimmick" its my solo Zaishen Challenge build to farm 2k faction per day. ~(more of a glitch but sssh)

LifesRestorer · Jun 11, 2007, 04:51 PM // 16:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Death_From_Above

As for the fact your rank 7 and you say its hard to get into teams i dont buy it like water does not buy into tea. You sure you were advertising correctly or looking correctly. Youll find most teams will take you on providing your good. Now if you suck thats a whole totaly different matter but last time i checked rank 6+ was still on a fairly high demand (can some1 please correct me if im wrong on this)

LFR6+ Iway warrior, Para spiker, Ritualist. fun fun fun!

Alleji · Jun 11, 2007, 05:17 PM // 17:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gimme Money Plzkthx

Dude, stop writing essays for your responses. No one reads them, they could be accomplished with fewer words, and they often make little sense. Also, try learning some spelling, punctuation, and grammar, and then maybe people will pay attention to you... you just make yourself look dumb mo- all of the time...

I really have no clue what's going on in HA or Guild Wars anymore, but I just wanted to put in my 2 cents under this.

DFA, you're an annoying RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO. Stop posting. Learn to spell. I never read your garbage past the first paragraph anyway.

Death_From_Above · Jun 11, 2007, 05:47 PM // 17:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alleji

I really have no clue what's going on in HA or Guild Wars anymore, but I just wanted to put in my 2 cents under this.

DFA, you're an annoying RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO. Stop posting. Learn to spell. I never read your garbage past the first paragraph anyway.

Sorry what was that. Ooooooh nothing it was just the wind blowing.

Now back to the issue on hand. *Gets coat*

Quote:

Originally Posted by Calnaion Blackhawk

perhaps.
And yes the old builds would get creamed in a split second thanks to the new "types" of gameplay introduced into HA (killcount, ect)
But my point was that people dont seem to be willing to think of original builds.
"Gimmick" or now they are called builds were once called by the Guilds name, for example.

when Marvel Superheroes started using ranger spike loads, people referred to it as the marvels build, because they used it the most, and quite obviously had to think of it (which was a lie) but thats not the point, its that guilds ran their own builds, or most of them did at least, now pretty much everyone runs, or trys to run the same stuff over and over. No wonder its become fotm, because no-one wants to try new things. (and yes there probably are people out there trying new builds but thats the minority)

I mean, this is HA, ID1 at 4:58 CET.

One thing i have noticed is no matter what game type or skills there are there will always be gimmicks. Thats a fact, now lets look at the people who played gimmicks. They often didnt like being original or running there own builds ect, fair enough everyone has there different tastes. It was the really classy and experianced players who ran builds other than gimmicks a majority of the time. With the introduction of kill count 9/10s of these people left along with 3/5 of the gimmikers. So now we are left with a HA full of gimmickers because many of the experianced players who increased the build diversity have disapeared if you understand me so far.

Also as i said earlier, your now forced to place certain types of builds if your to play HA, this limits build diversity. Yes sure i can go invent some new heavy hex build or something but ill get owned on maps like kill count. Paragons as i said before have 80+ armour, you see so people now adays are just going with the flow as being original now adays in most cases gets you not as far as a gimmick would in some cases and you seem to get owned at times. The main problem is alot of the players who have a problem with HA because they liked being classy and making new builds have left. This is because as i stated before, kill count restricts what you can hence we are left with the ones who rather play gimmick.

If alter maps were to come back, and i hear a few minute people complaining about this. (Though i dont understand why, would you prefer alter maps or kill count. If your answer is kill count so please tell me if you were on the forums complaining about alter maps before 6v6 came). I rest my case. Hopefully, though i cant be sure of the reaction. Many people come back to HA, maybe its past glory will be restored, maybe itll be good but not as good as it was before. One things for sure with these new skills out to you will see.

increased play

increased build diversity

increasing HA population

increasing HA guilds

increasing intence battles

elektra_lucia · Jun 11, 2007, 08:17 PM // 20:17

Quote:

I believe that judgement is maybe based on a minority of players maybe from personal experiance but yes were ever you are you get losers be whether your in tokyo or Japan, the uk or the usa. Russia or even anets company.

Sure you'll get losers. As Einstein said, there are two things which are infinite. Humans stupidity and the universe (not so sure about the latter).

I won't bring up place names, I will just say, A, B, C, D, E, F.

Supposing the education system in country A is such that people are at school for a longer period of time during the day.
Supposing the national wealth is not so high in country B, such that only the adults can afford a computer.
Keep in mind the peak of a male's I.Q is at the age of 26. The majority of the game being males.

Did you know the genetic difference between a Labrador and a Dalmatian is less than the genetic difference between a black male and a white male.

A black male has longer upper legs, on average than a white male. I'm saying that as it won't seem so racist and I know people will just be itching to bring up racism. Did you know that Jewish people for their population do differently than other people? Sure this maybe a religion but actually race is a group of people. Religion is a group; therefore, can kind of be said that Jewish people is a race.

Don't get me wrong, I hate everyone (no joke). So I'm not a racist. I've tried not to put my personal views, to refrain from what I fear will happen; however, my point is:

If one man can have a longer leg, isn't it possible people from country C are generally better at guildwars. Whether it be because they have (on average) older people playing, or what.

Sure everyone fails, but on average, certain groups will fail less than others. Things can not be equal. If they were, country A would be playing the same as country F and they'd have favour equal amounts of time.

Quote:

Also as i said earlier, your now forced to place certain types of builds if your to play HA, this limits build diversity. Yes sure i can go invent some new heavy hex build or something but ill get owned on maps like kill count. Paragons as i said before have 80+ armour, you see so people now adays are just going with the flow as being original now adays in most cases gets you not as far as a gimmick would in some cases and you seem to get owned at times. The main problem is alot of the players who have a problem with HA because they liked being classy and making new builds have left. This is because as i stated before, kill count restricts what you can hence we are left with the ones who rather play gimmick.

If alter maps were to come back, and i hear a few minute people complaining about this. (Though i dont understand why, would you prefer alter maps or kill count. If your answer is kill count so please tell me if you were on the forums complaining about alter maps before 6v6 came). I rest my case. Hopefully, though i cant be sure of the reaction. Many people come back to HA, maybe its past glory will be restored, maybe itll be good but not as good as it was before. One things for sure with these new skills out to you will see.

You can still run hex's and win.

HA would have less people playing whether things were changed or not. People get bored and try other things. Sure, HA maybe bad but if things were made great, don't assume HA would become active again.

Death_From_Above · Jun 11, 2007, 08:35 PM // 20:35

Full heavy hex like old days or mild hex because iv seen some people running mild hex but not full heavy hex builds. And also just outta curiosity, how far can you go?

Mirado · Jun 11, 2007, 09:15 PM // 21:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Death_From_Above

Full heavy hex like old days or mild hex because iv seen some people running mild hex but not full heavy hex builds. And also just outta curiosity, how far can you go?

Every time i have ran my/[ToRe] hex build with GOOD players i have won halls, here il even give u the build so u can try it, but it fails if not everyone knows what they are doing

1 crip slash, 1 water ele, 1 fire ele, 2 migraine, 1 SS, 2 monks

ive also won with this one multiple times
1 crip slash, 2 SS, 2 Migraine, 1 CG, 2 monks this ones har on kill count though, only reason we won with this was skips

bungusmaximus · Jun 11, 2007, 11:24 PM // 23:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mirado

Every time i have ran my/[ToRe] hex build with GOOD players i have won halls, here il even give u the build so u can try it, but it fails if not everyone knows what they are doing

1 crip slash, 1 water ele, 1 fire ele, 2 migraine, 1 SS, 2 monks

ive also won with this one multiple times
1 crip slash, 2 SS, 2 Migraine, 1 CG, 2 monks this ones har on kill count though, only reason we won with this was skips

Seasoned HA players win anyway. I pug a lot, PUGing often leaves 4 options:
-Rit spike
-SF spike
-Zerg
-Paraspike

In such a case I pick the first random team I see and have some fun ^^.

Lord Mendes · Jun 12, 2007, 12:22 AM // 00:22

Dear Death_From_Above,
You can't spell correctly, you pull statistics out of your ass, all your lengthy posts lack logical thinking and reasoning, and you're ignorant and clueless.

I do however have a challenge for you:
In less than 400 words, tell me why you think altar holding is the ideal game mode for tombs.
Here's the catch:
- You cannot say "HA population decreased therefore it is best!" because there are many variables you have failed to take into account.
- You cannot say "IWAY was the most common build and no one ran holding builds, therefore they were never an issue which makes altars best".
- You cannot say "everyone played balanced builds when HoH was king of the hill, therefore it is best".
- You cannot use any of your "proven statistics".
- You cannot mention Anet, at all.
- You have to use correct spelling and punctuation.
- (Most important one) You CANNOT prove that altars are best by attacking kill-count and proving that it is bad.

I promise to never ever flame you again if you post a sensible response.
I hope you accept this challenge.
Good luck.

Calnaion Blackhawk · Jun 12, 2007, 11:10 AM // 11:10

I take it!
Altar Capping was the bets because it required everything which people enjoyed about pvp.
#1 - It involved strong defense and tactics, not only keeping your team alive, but the ghostly as well.
#2 - It required a fairly strong offense to fight off teams that try to take the altar and/or take the altar from other teams.

In general it was fun, which is what pvp should be about.
The adrenaline rush of seeing the timer tick down to 2:00 then all the teams would scramble like crazy to try and take the altar.

elektra_lucia · Jun 12, 2007, 11:30 AM // 11:30

Quote:

I take it!

You fail, the question says: Dear Death_From_Above.

Quote:

The adrenaline rush of seeing the timer tick down to 2:00 then all the teams would scramble like crazy to try and take the altar.

There is still an end game madness with kill count.

You spelt offence and defence wrong.

Mendes didn't ask for 'the best' he said why would it be the 'ideal game mode'. Not just comparing kill count with altar holding.

You ruined it, I was looking forward to death from above's reply :[.

Calnaion Blackhawk · Jun 12, 2007, 12:56 PM // 12:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by elektra_lucia

You fail, the question says: Dear Death_From_Above.

Hm actually you fail.
Last i checked this forum is open to discussion, i dont see the title of the thread saying "This is for death_from_above only"
So perhaps think of the alternatives instead of jumping straight to the one which makes you look cool by constantly flaming other people on the boards.

heres a suggestion, try posting something that helps people with their reasoning and explain why they are wrong, instead of just jumping the gun and trying to think of a way of putting people down in the most intellectual way you can manage in your oh so fabulous vocabulary.

Either way back to the matter.

Altar maps were what people wanted, its what people played and were used to. Anet simply tried to make the game more interesting by adding more game modes, without realizing what the consequences would be.

Oh and killcount focuses on how fast you can kill as many people as possible.

Altar Holding focuses on how fast you can cap the altar, and how long you can keep it for.

Last time i checked that requires more tactics and, dare i say it.... an actual game plan to win!

Oh yeh one more thing.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defense_%28military%29 (reference to spelling)

Sorry, your wrong again!

elektra_lucia · Jun 12, 2007, 01:30 PM // 13:30

I wouldn't say I constantly flame. I put my point of view and often it strongly disagrees. Many people would not bother, they only post when necessary. I keep getting colds, and so I'm spending a lot of time looking on websites and posting. Maybe too much time.

My post was not entirely serious. Mendes and I were just laughing at Death from above that was all. We were looking forward to his reply. Sure the forum is for everyone but clearly Mendes's question was a personal thing to Death_From_Above.

Regardless, the task had:

Quote:

- You have to use correct spelling and punctuation.

That is why I commented on the spelling. My spelling, punctuation or grammar and what not is atrocious. I don't deny that. xD.

Sorry if I offended you I was only teasing.

Quote:

Last time i checked that requires more tactics and, dare i say it.... an actual game plan to win!

That maybe so but Mendes's task was not just to compare the two but to prove why altar capping is the ideal thing. I believe that a new game mode can be made which will be just as good.

Unless of course you're replying to the first post.

Quote:

heres a suggestion, try posting something that helps people with their reasoning and explain why they are wrong,

I don't really need your suggestions. Thanks all the same.

As far as I'm aware (from the posts I have seen you written) you don't actually play HA that much. Sometimes it helps to have knowledge of what you are talking about.

The thread mentions rt spike and game balance. I don't think the game balance is as bad as people make it out to be. I have already debated and reasoned this logic.

The lag happens in any game. Especially when people from other sides of the world compete. Ping is the time it takes in milliseconds to send 32 bytes of data if I am not mistaken. If Europe are facing America, go figure

.

The game modes. hmm i offered a suggestion in another thread about a hero battle type game mode to replace kill count.

There is only so much I can debate the topic, which leaves me to debate peoples posts. I too am interested in their reasoning.

When you say 'an actual game plan to win'. Well, so does kill count. Maybe that plan is to run like chickens and to try kill everything at the end, maybe it is to rush in and die from AoE. Whatever it may be, is still some sort of a game plan because you have a goal - to score the most points.

Quote:

http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/1...ythreadeq4.jpg

-------

To make sure i don't get another referral on my account i better write something constructive.

Now ive been playing guild wars since it came out (look at my registered date), i admit i took a break for like, a few months while i was sucked into wow's vortex of nothingness.
But when i left IWAY was just about fotm, people were still running balanced mass hex builds, ranger int builds and the likely.

Now i don't play HA, or topk as it was anymore because of one main reason;
I don't think that i can get into groups, despite being rank7, as i didnt farm IWAY and get my oh so famous tiger.(and for those wondering, i got every single one of that fame by running balanced builds and ranger spike, Mental Block was STRICTLY anti-IWAY)

I dont particularly think that HA has been destroyed, i just think that people are too lazy to think of counters. The HA changes have ruined the community more than the game itself, people are high rank, think they know everything about the game because they can type /rank and see a pwetty tiger, and shun anyone who doesn't. If a lower rank team beats a high rank team, the rank9's all start whamming local chat with "LOLLNOOB" "Lucky lol", When i played they would generally say "well played" and then go back and discuss where they went wrong (Lol Empty Skillbars anyone?)
People are just getting too lazy to think of counters, AND/OR scared of trying new things incase they get flamed for running "noob" builds.

for those too lazy to read ;

LEARN TO THINK OF NEW BUILDS TO COUNTER ONES YOUR WHINING ABOUT.

Back then Orders stacked and ranger spike was over powered. People don't rank discriminate as much as you think. You should try harder to get in groups. I agree that people are too lazy to think of counters but still there is an underlying problem that the game type is asking you to kill quicker than your opponent does

.

P.S. I don't put people down in the most intellectual way I can manage.

Div · Jun 12, 2007, 01:47 PM // 13:47

Reason why HA sucks? Skill balance. 'nuff said.

Lord Mendes · Jun 12, 2007, 02:05 PM // 14:05

I actually agree with death_from_above (read my post at the beginning of the killcount thread), I just think he is destroying all hope of Anet taking us seriously. He proves altars are best for all the wrong reasons, and Anet won't take us seriously when the majority of our posts are attacks towards their ignorance. I also don't believe that HA will be fixed by changing back, I think it will take much more than that, and bringing altars would do very little for HA at this stage.

Mental Leteci · Jun 12, 2007, 04:32 PM // 16:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mirado

1 crip slash, 1 water ele, 1 fire ele, 2 migraine, 1 SS, 2 monks

ive also won with this one multiple times
1 crip slash, 2 SS, 2 Migraine, 1 CG, 2 monks this ones har on kill count though, only reason we won with this was skips

Ok, I just had to react. The build you wrote is nothing new, it has been played many times before (only new thing is water ele instead of a monk, but back then you couldn't play with 2 monks in HA). And you got the meaning of "hex build" totally wrong. When we say hex build it's about heavy hex pressure (not migraine/ss combo).

Calnaion Blackhawk · Jun 12, 2007, 04:35 PM // 16:35

panic was the bane of everyone at that point.