Curse

Baba_Beast · Jul 07, 2007, 12:56 AM // 00:56

after reading 4612476124781 whining topics, I think I got what is the problem with HoH.

I started HoH about 1month ago and I have 100 fames atm. I admit that most of these fames were made with an IWAY build. but I dont have the choice. my first fame in heroe's ascent was made with a balance team after
~1hour of shouting in inter 1. 10 minutes after, I leave that group and began to shout: "SS warrior looking for zergway". 2 hours later, I was rank 1.

the problem is that evry new player is trying to get a rank 3+ team at least in order to get better and learn things. but there is ABSOLUTELY no groups r3+ willing to take those guys.So what they're doing? running an easy build to get some fames fast. and because they're doing that, high-ranked teams dont invite them because :"they don't know how to something other than IWAY".

If higher rank people don't take noobs sometimes, 3 things will happen:
1. they won't do HoH anymore.
2. they will become IWAY/heroway addicted.
3. they will stay under rank3 forever trying to get a decent unraked balance group.

no wonder why HoH is dying. older players leave because they are bored/pissed by noob teams and newer players becomes IWAY noobs.

I don't want to make this a flame thread so plz make CONSTRUCTIVE comments and don't insult people. I didn't insult anyone so there shouldn't be flaming

. and don't reply that I don't know what I'm talking about because even if I play IWAY in HoH, I hate it because I can play balance very well since i'm in a rank 200 guild but people just dont consider you if you dont have an emote.

(sry for my english

)

Death_From_Above · Jul 07, 2007, 01:20 AM // 01:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baba_Beast

after reading 4612476124781 whining topics, I think I got what is the problem with HoH.

I started HoH about 1month ago and I have 100 fames atm. I admit that most of these fames were made with an IWAY build. but I dont have the choice. my first fame in heroe's ascent was made with a balance team after
~1hour of shouting in inter 1. 10 minutes after, I leave that group and began to shout: "SS warrior looking for zergway". 2 hours later, I was rank 1.

no wonder why HoH is dying. older players leave because they are bored/pissed by noob teams and newer players becomes IWAY noobs.
(sry for my english

)

Please dont pull statments out of the sky and pass them on as fact. HA is dying because of kill count and overpowered builds which anet need to nurf. NPCs like heros doing elite stuff in HA and anet ignoring the HA community by introducing 6v6 and keeping it for 9 months before going back to 8v8. This annoyed people and they raged.

Also, if your finding difficulty joing a team why not make your own balanced or something? Another thing, no one had it easy when they were a low rank, it take pactients and perserverance. People arnt really bothered about rank its about how you play, and knowledge tells us your rank gives us an indication of how long you have played for and roughly how well. Yes you get some really good low ranks but this is not the case. So rather i would suggest you keep on trying, and try to get better as its a steep learning curve. You wont be the best over night and you wont get into good groups over night. You have to work your way up, always crawl before you climb.

Baba_Beast · Jul 07, 2007, 03:48 AM // 03:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Death_From_Above

Also, if your finding difficulty joing a team why not make your own balanced or something?

yea I know and that's a good point but if I make my own balance team I would have to make an unranked team right? so there will be roughly 2~3 good players on that team if I'm lucky. I will begin and I will probably lost the underworld VS what? IWAY or heroway.

my point is that if some higher-ranked people were helping some noobs, my unranked balance team would have more than 2~3 good players in it. and maybe if I'm lucky I'll beat an IWAY because those unranked people would have train with higher-rank ones.

I'm not asking some rank 12 guy to form a party with 7 unranked people. But if you're a r4-5-6 party and got one room left and there's no one? why not try to help an unranked guy? if alot of teams do that, maybe there will be less IWAY and I don't think some1 here like more to see an unranked IWAY than an unranked balance.

Div · Jul 07, 2007, 06:08 AM // 06:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baba_Beast

If higher rank people don't take noobs sometimes, 3 things will happen:
1. they won't do HoH anymore.
2. they will become IWAY/heroway addicted.
3. they will stay under rank3 forever trying to get a decent unraked balance group.

4. they will play IWAY until they get to rank 3 and start their balanced, playing their way to rank 6+ and getting recognized by higher ranked players.

I started HA after rspike/IWAY died, so you can just imagine how hard it was for me to get fame early on. But as long as you don't suck and you get recognized as a good player the 1-2 lucky times you play with higher ranked players, you'll have a much easier road.

Dodo The Extinct · Jul 07, 2007, 10:40 PM // 22:40

I like the name of this thread. Even though there are more effective ways to improve HA, helping people will always make a tiny difference

Starting out in HA is really hard. I remember that one thing that helped me tremendously, was HA-ing with my guild. If possible, you can always try to get into a guild that HAs, and that doesn't care about your rank.

Also, you can try adding some good people you have played with to your friends list. That way it will be easier to form groups with sensible players.

God Apprentice · Jul 09, 2007, 03:49 AM // 03:49

Best thing to do is make your own groups. Friend List people from those groups who you do well with, continue to make groups with them, and as you get ranked seek other of similar ranks. Also try to join a HA guild. Remember that the one thing most people look for is monks. So if you can monk, more power to you.

huntingtonm · Jul 09, 2007, 02:50 PM // 14:50

I have to agree whole heartedly with the sentiment of this thread.

I have no rants at all about what out A-netical Masters have choosen for our play arena, its not like we have much choice!

What gets me is (i'm sorry to say) the elitest attitude people put up. Yes i accept there are more idiots out there then half-brained people so most deserve the treatment.

I have worked my to R4, and i would say honestly a ratio of 1 in 7 higher then me ranked groups might take me, and please bare in mind -

I dont spam lfg!lfg!lfg! I do pm, I do ask politely and show I am willing to change to suit there needs I even point out that if they only need one more monk, which i can do and if i am not up to scratch they can kick me if we lose !

But still elitism reigns....not R6? no way your getting in our group. The only small pleasure is to see them still there spamming for a r6 a half hour later!

it was indeed through this method i now have friends i know and play with.

But we all need to pug now and then and my experiance of elitism is getting worse as my own rank has gone up! I have seen higher ranked people much worse then myself and lower ranked people equally on par with me.

But the number of elitest snoobs who wont give anyone a chance, i belive this is the real failing. So if you got the heart and someone pm's u asking for a chance, give them that - if they fail u can ditch them.

But we all were of low or no rank at some point, so you cant truly look down on where you came from! Even if its the gutter....

Peace

M/

Gimme Money Plzkthx · Jul 09, 2007, 06:21 PM // 18:21

Well, one major problem is that if you are only r3 or 4 you probably do not have that many skills unlocked. So, unless you're r4.5+, you probably won't even be able to play what people are looking for simply skill(game)/character wise, regardless of whether you know what you're doing...

huntingtonm · Jul 09, 2007, 09:21 PM // 21:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gimme Money Plzkthx

Well, one major problem is that if you are only r3 or 4 you probably do not have that many skills unlocked.

It is a little narrow minded to assume the only place to earn faction is through hero's ascent.

Gimme Money Plzkthx · Jul 10, 2007, 01:30 AM // 01:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by huntingtonm

It is a little narrow minded to assume the only place to earn faction is through hero's ascent.

I'm well aware of that, but the average r0 hasn't done any other PvP other than RA... to get into a GvG guild you usually need rank or champ titles... I'm well aware it's not the only way, but I'm sure you understand what I'm saying.

huntingtonm · Jul 10, 2007, 09:15 AM // 09:15

I understand well enough what you are trying to say, enough QQ'ing now.

Its kind of ironic that the one person who felt the need to talk down to me is basing all of his points/arguments around RANK, which is umm... an elitest thing to do....talking about r0's instead of r3/4/5's now as being worse...need i say more? hmmm.... also how do you then manage to get your post onto gvg guilds in the heroes ascent sub-forum?

A tip if you dont mind - stay away from such massive generalisations. You dont know the whole community personaly so you are not qualified to make sweeping statements; very few of us i imagine, are.

pumpkin pie · Jul 10, 2007, 09:39 AM // 09:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baba_Beast

I'm not asking some rank 12 guy to form a party with 7 unranked people. But if you're a r4-5-6 party and got one room left and there's no one? why not try to help an unranked guy? if alot of teams do that, maybe there will be less IWAY and I don't think some1 here like more to see an unranked IWAY than an unranked balance.

I agree with this, but I have play with high rank players, they don't stay long enough to help you. they would try, and maybe after 3 fail attempt they leave with reason, got to go eat, guildie called etc.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gimme Money Plzkthx

Well, one major problem is that if you are only r3 or 4 you probably do not have that many skills unlocked. So, unless you're r4.5+, you probably won't even be able to play what people are looking for simply skill(game)/character wise, regardless of whether you know what you're doing...

Wrong, I have all skills unlocked, rank 0. While players in HA are reluctant to invite me into their team, I am approaching level 6 Kurzkiks

, I can run most build. i don't have pve monk, don't have pve mesmer, don't have pve assassin, but all those profession skills are unlocked normal and elite.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dodo The Extinct

Also, you can try adding some good people you have played with to your friends list. That way it will be easier to form groups with sensible players.

This is good advice

Sometime Rank players are not as good as you think they are, some are very bad, as i have observe on the rare occasion that I get to play with rank players in HA, they die more often then me (rank 0) and faster. I suspect its got to do with who you know and how well you mingle.

God Apprentice · Jul 10, 2007, 09:43 AM // 09:43

huntingtomm, Gimme wasn't bashing you in an elitest way. Gimme is only saying that if you do not buy the pvp packs, and do not unlock skills in pve, unranked people have a disadvantage when they start by not being able to roll different builds. Also on the RA point, keep in mind RA/TA/AB/HA and GvG are all different forms of pvp. With Gimmes example of RA for instance the goal is basic annhilation, and you do not need a "set build" to ensure victory (as it is random).

Quote:

Originally Posted by pumpkin pie

I agree with this, but I have play with high rank players, they don't stay long enough to help you. they would try, and maybe after 3 fail attempt they leave with reason, got to go eat, guildie called etc.

I once took an unranked friend of mine who wanted to leanr to play HA and trained him up on how to play Shock Axe, gave him basic info on the maps, how to spike, and most important to not stay Frenzied all the time (took me 10 minutes to get him to stop that

)

huntingtonm · Jul 10, 2007, 10:12 AM // 10:12

Gods Ap, thank you for trying to rephrase gimmie's comments.

I appreciate there is a skill level expected of players when they enter ha, the game type is, as you say far differant from ra/ta/ab etc. That is the nice aspect that people can move on to higher levels of pvp competition when they feel ready, or step back down if things are going badly!

Thanks to pumpkin pie, for being the proof in the pudding re: r0 n most skills unlocked. God Ap, I have been playing GW since its inception so there is no need to teach me to suck eggs please.

Gimmie, sorry for being so aggresive in my arguments, you just appear to have to gone against the grain of this thread, in my view. Also i was a little offended by your saying since your r3/4 you dont have anything unlocked...you wont be able to play what people are looking for. I mean come on how would you know about what i have or dont?

BlackEagle · Jul 10, 2007, 03:40 PM // 15:40

I agree with the point of this thread sort of, but somebody who is a high rank has no reason to take somebody of a low rank. Now, being high rank doesn't mean that you're good, but a higher proportion of high ranked people are going to be good that low ranks. I agree that rank3/4/5+ pugs that won't take unranked is stupid, because a rank 3 is likely to be just as bad as unranked players.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pumpkin pie

Sometime Rank players are not as good as you think they are, some are very bad, as i have observe on the rare occasion that I get to play with rank players in HA, they die more often then me (rank 0) and faster. I suspect its got to do with who you know and how well you mingle.

I agree with your point about some ranked players being terrible, but how often someone dies is really not an indication of how good a player is. There are so many factors that affect who dies, and it is minimal the effect of how good a player is. In a way, it will even work in the opposite way: eg. if a monk is complaining about a mesmer (ie. the mesmer is good) then they're more likely to be spiked. The actual kiting from a player will have a small effect, but really not that much.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pumpkin pie

Wrong, I have all skills unlocked, rank 0. While players in HA are reluctant to invite me into their team, I am approaching level 6 Kurzkiks

, I can run most build. i don't have pve monk, don't have pve mesmer, don't have pve assassin, but all those profession skills are unlocked normal and elite.

Just because one low ranked players has most skills unlocked, as a general rule, at lower ranks they're very unlikely to have a large amount of skills unlocked.

Quote:

Originally Posted by God Apprentice

and most important to not stay Frenzied all the time (took me 10 minutes to get him to stop that

)

You should stay frenzied all the time, unless of course you take damage. It's a much better habit to be frenzying a little too much, than warriors that aren't agressive enough and don't frenzy enough.

Killed u man · Jul 10, 2007, 04:13 PM // 16:13

^ Yes, and then u get spiked with frenzy, and then things go B O O M...

Does a "new" guy to HA know what a 40/40 set is? What actually weapon switching is? What Kiting means? What using "Wards" is? What body-blocking is?

U just CAN'T compare a R10+ group with a unranked group...

There is only 1 reason why HA is dead atm, and it has ALWAYS been the same reason...

ANET IS A COMPANY, THEY DO NOT CARE ABOUT THE COMMUNITY, THEY GO FOR THE MONEY... I'm sorry guys, but that's just the way it is... And it's a good thing, because money = motivation... But at the same time: No constant cash flow = NO motivation...

U do NOT pay each month to play GW, so why would Anet be highly motivated? As long as U keep buying their games...

Now that said, I can go the real reason why HA is dead. As I said: Anet goes for money. What game lures more people:
-A game which U buy, and "pwn" everything since day one... (IWAY, Ritspike, Heroway, Aka: "Gimmicks"

-A game which U buy, and it takes about 4-5 months to "pwn" other people?

=> Everyone will go for nr. 1, because NO-ONE will buy a game, when u know it will last 4 months till u actually get in the good groups...

This is the ONLY reason why Anet always allows certain builds to exist... Why did they BOOST ritspike? Why didn't they nerf IWAY till so long? THEY WANT overpowered builds to exist, so NEW PLAYERS HAVE A CHANCE ALSO, at the cost of experienced players getting frustrated because of these new people beating them with "lame" builds...

=> HA = dead because Anet goes for the money, bottom line, U can't deny it...

BlackEagle · Jul 10, 2007, 06:50 PM // 18:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Killed u man

^ Yes, and then u get spiked with frenzy, and then things go B O O M...

Which is why you have a cancel stance.

Killed u man · Jul 10, 2007, 08:48 PM // 20:48

Quote:

Which is why you have a cancel stance.

Which is why it's called a SPIKE...

BlackEagle · Jul 10, 2007, 09:16 PM // 21:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Killed u man

Which is why it's called a SPIKE...

You're telling me you can't hit a cancel stance before/at very least half way through a spike? I mean, if it's a adrenaline spike, then the warriors converging on you should give you some indication and you cancel. Or if it's caster spike, then the fact that the guy you're whacking at suddenly starts a spike skill while looking towards you doesn't give you a clue you're going to take damage? At very worst, no spike is perfect, you can cancel after taking any significant damage. Though, I'd appreciate that often you'll still die from that. But, all the same, against a spike, there is always a threat of death very quickly, so are you suggesting you should half your damage output for when they spike you and you fail to read it?

Killed u man · Jul 10, 2007, 09:52 PM // 21:52

Lol, I'm not gonna argua with u about the fact how he can cancel frenzy... I play spikes, lame and non-lame ones. I've seen r12+ Warriors getting spiked with frenzy... yes, U can get lucky and cancel it before, but if it's a clean spike, gl canceling, and since the warrior is in frenzy, they will often get clean spikes. Also, you're saying that EVERY time the warrior sees them spiknig, he should interrupt his frenzy? I'm not sure what other stance u had in mind, but I'm sure a warrior can NOT maintain it both on energy as on recharge... The key is building up adrenaline, then spike with frenzy, keep gonig on as lnog as u can, if the target won't drop, just get out of frenzy and start over... Keeping frenzy on all the time = GGkthxbai

I know this was off-topic, srry guys