Curse

Kaon · Jan 27, 2008, 12:42 AM // 00:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rau

Would love to see you do better on that map vs that guild.

Besides the fact that [Me] played really well ( how can they not? they only play 1 build ) Wurms is by far the best map for them.

We tried to spec a bit after loosing to them on the same map earlier. We tried out a e/d wich we never ran before and by some communication errors it ended up failing.

The new VoD heavily favors split builds and is RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOng ridiculous for sin split as it is nearly impossible to get many of their npc down while they are sure to get atleast some. By the time VoD hits and the npc's reach the stand they do +40% dmg and if u cant aggro them, ball em up and kill em they will end up killing you with the insane dmg bonus and shiney new skills anet decided to give them.

Even now i cant really think of any build that would have secured the victory..

ps. Shroud of silence sins own.

Rau your build choice was the most suprising thing for me. Wurms is unsplittable until vod simply and only because of thief. The only thing you need to make sure then is to get a split that can hold out at lord at vod and fight them 5v5 af flagstand (where ineptitude RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing sucks).

In other words: rawr build. Half your guild has about a dozen (if not more) experience with rawr build vs sineptitude with 100% wins. Why did you run the crap i see on obs right now? If you want to wipe the opponent before vod then why not water ele (also means they'll never get a flag in).

There's a korean saying: If you know your opponent you cannot lose. So i'll say to everyone who lost to an obvious sinsplit: You RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing suck at guild wars.

Oh and DF sad that you didnt get in with 5-2, but next mat i'd run a serious build though instead of the shit you did this time.

Kaon · Jan 27, 2008, 12:48 AM // 00:48

The problem is sinsplit is that it's finally a build that is unforgiving to play against. Instead of noobs being able to RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO up several times and still win, sinsplit requires people to actually play well.

I'd expected cE to get gold, but apparantly that combination of players has been jinxed from Cry to vZ to now.

And for anyone that will comment on Town's matches now. We fail at balanced and the game in general, but we do beat crappy sinsplits.

deya · Jan 27, 2008, 12:50 AM // 00:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaon

Rau your build choice was the most suprising thing for me. Wurms is unsplittable until vod simply and only because of thief. The only thing you need to make sure then is to get a split that can hold out at lord at vod and fight them 5v5 af flagstand (where ineptitude RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing sucks).

In other words: rawr build. Half your guild has about a dozen (if not more) experience with rawr build vs sineptitude with 100% wins. Why did you run the crap i see on obs right now? If you want to wipe the opponent before vod then why not water ele (also means they'll never get a flag in).

There's a korean saying: If you know your opponent you cannot lose. So i'll say to everyone who lost to an obvious sinsplit: You RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing suck at guild wars.

Oh and DF sad that you didnt get in with 5-2, but next mat i'd run a serious build though instead of the shit you did this time.

Never seen so much bs before.

TheHaxor · Jan 27, 2008, 12:52 AM // 00:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rau

Wurms isl.
+ Me have a far superior build then the other 2 guilds
Shroud of silence caught us offguard the first time and after that we had 2 little time to think of a gd counter

I thought Druid's followed by Wurm's was a lame way to end the tourney. You guys played pretty well when all things are considered.

Khanoute · Jan 27, 2008, 12:53 AM // 00:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neo-LD

Pretty much what I thought of todays events as well. Thing is, didnt you guys beat 2 other sineptitude builds in the rounds immedeately prior?

Me is much better at sinsplitting (execution and tactics wise) than the two other guilds cE fought. It was pretty clear that HGH hadn't much experience with the build they ran in the semis.

Think cE would have done better with their HEV mesmer though, the E/D ganker didn't help much in the end.
And I agree with Deya, sinsplit is just the smartest answer to the current VoD splinter farming meta. If you don't want to spend 18 mins headbutting 7vs7 at the flagstand, bring the most mobile build at your disposal. People need to realize that pushing/splitting with the old W/R/Rit team isn't an optimal solution. Works in mirror match, that's about it.

Also, nerfing splinter or any other way to quickly farm NPCs at VoD is just a nice buff to any split build.

deya · Jan 27, 2008, 12:58 AM // 00:58

Mobility is only one part. Stuff like Ineptitude and Clumsiness many times ends the VoD farming in a different type of slaughter, Warriors killing themselves.

Kaon · Jan 27, 2008, 01:04 AM // 01:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by deya

Never seen so much bs before.

I'd be happy to scrim you on wurms isle when you run sinsplit. If we lose because there was nothing we could do then i'll take back my words and you're right. But i don't think that's going to happen.

I understand you've been away for a year so you have missed the 6months of sinsplit we had before, but never had many problems facing them.

The problem is that everyone is so used to just sit there and use their blockweb and interrupts to kill people, that they've totally forgotten how to play in such a situation. Usual strategies (running the flag all the time, responding with this and those characters) don't work against sinsplit, you cannot use your standard algorithms and people die. People are not adaptive enough (and to me adaptability almost equals skill) and because of that they lose. Next to the fact that all these 8v8 have deteriorated strong leadership and organisation within guilds so when something has to be done different there's usually noone that calls it. That's why I don't lose to sinsplit because i'm exactly such a personality. Randomway right now is already a very effective build and can beat many opponents. Sinsplit optimizes that and will destroy you if you don't use the right strategy.

In all the threads here you see people complaining about "blockway" and now there's a build that relies purely on skill to be effective and to be countered and people say it's overpowered and cry for nerfs.

To me sinsplit is a godsend because it screws over all the disorganized numbed down people and builds and forces them to think. Best thing that happened to guild wars in a long time.

Iotan · Jan 27, 2008, 01:08 AM // 01:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaon

In all the threads here you see people complaining about "blockway" and now there's a build that relies purely on skill to be effective and to be countered and people say it's overpowered and cry for nerfs.

Sineptitude relies "purely on skill"?

12345----run!----12345----run!

deya · Jan 27, 2008, 01:13 AM // 01:13

I know what you are talking about, I do. Your problem just happens to be same as always, you think too much of yourself and underestimate other people. Nothing new in here tho.

Rau · Jan 27, 2008, 01:14 AM // 01:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaon

Rau your build choice was the most suprising thing for me. Wurms is unsplittable until vod simply and only because of thief. The only thing you need to make sure then is to get a split that can hold out at lord at vod and fight them 5v5 af flagstand (where ineptitude RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing sucks).

In other words: rawr build. Half your guild has about a dozen (if not more) experience with rawr build vs sineptitude with 100% wins. Why did you run the crap i see on obs right now? If you want to wipe the opponent before vod then why not water ele (also means they'll never get a flag in).

There's a korean saying: If you know your opponent you cannot lose. So i'll say to everyone who lost to an obvious sinsplit: You RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing suck at guild wars.

Oh and DF sad that you didnt get in with 5-2, but next mat i'd run a serious build though instead of the shit you did this time.

wow my respect* level for u went downhill reading that,
srsly dont talk about stuff u dont kno anything about.

Im not saying our build was perfect but with only 5-10 min to prepare u dont have alot of options, we had a gameplan it failed due to experimental stuff.

but srsly kaon wth ? am i reading it wrong or is your plan for sinsplit to camp to vod and go head to head in a 5v [insert vod non blockable npc army] + 2 enip + clumzi spammers.
While u have 3 ppl back in your base defending vs 2 sins with shroud of silence?
What kind of magical build did u come up with if i may ask?

wow kaon, have u played vod recently ? did u watch our dervish blow up ?
These archers hit u for over 100 dmg on every hit if your a 60 armor target, with only increasing dmg every minut. gtfo

Neo-LD · Jan 27, 2008, 01:44 AM // 01:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaon

In all the threads here you see people complaining about "blockway" and now there's a build that relies purely on skill to be effective and to be countered and people say it's overpowered and cry for nerfs.

To me sinsplit is a godsend because it screws over all the disorganized numbed down people and builds and forces them to think. Best thing that happened to guild wars in a long time.

Way to discredit yourself.

pitty_sayonara · Jan 27, 2008, 01:52 AM // 01:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rau

wow my reputation level for u went downhill reading that,
srsly dont talk about stuff u dont kno anything about.

Im not saying our build was perfect but with only 5-10 min to prepare u dont have alot of options, we had a gameplan it failed due to experimental stuff.

but srsly kaon wth ? am i reading it wrong or is your plan for sinsplit to camp to vod and go head to head in a 5v [insert vod non blockable npc army] + 2 enip + clumzi spammers.
While u have 3 ppl back in your base defending vs 2 sins with shroud of silence?
What kind of magical build did u come up with if i may ask?

wow kaon, have u played vod recently ? did u watch our dervish blow up ?
These archers hit u for over 100 dmg on every hit if your a 60 armor target, with only increasing dmg every minut. gtfo

qft, playing 3/4 monks and relying on sins that kill your npc + mesmer disable your physical dmg is atm kinda abuse of vod with npc hitting u for 100+dmg :P

Jenny · Jan 27, 2008, 01:54 AM // 01:54

O_o;;
are you on RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing crack or you need glasses to learn to obs a game Kaon?
oh wait ppl didn't teach you how to right... D: i feel sorry for you
first of all, its not the usual bad sin split we used to face 6months ago, u know ppl tweak builds n all ^ _ ^
everyone lost to Me tonight, its sad days for gw we all know that since a while but who cares? this game is dead as never
add the VoD part, say thx to Izzy for making the game as balanced as it is right now kthx

but wait, i don't see how u're trashing ppl because they lost to sin split on Wurms while u didn't even play monthly did you?
also u're in Town... i don't know... i'm not flaming Town but still
you don't play with them much because u say they suck or because they benched you?
also what build u'd play to face these ? eventually Me played sinsplit since they exist
we had 3+5mins to pop a build out of our ass in finals, we didnt expect to go any far with all the practice we had + Oxo (our core W) not being here lol
and afterall its like the match against sup, ppl didn't rly care that much anymore "we made top 16 lets take a break" we knew it wud be RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOd up so why not running a screwed build afterall (it was a mistake id give u that but w/e ?)

u're brave trashing ppl on guru,

Kaon · Jan 27, 2008, 01:54 AM // 01:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rau

wow my reputation level for u went downhill reading that,
srsly dont talk about stuff u dont kno anything about.

Im not saying our build was perfect but with only 5-10 min to prepare u dont have alot of options, we had a gameplan it failed due to experimental stuff.

but srsly kaon wth ? am i reading it wrong or is your plan for sinsplit to camp to vod and go head to head in a 5v [insert vod non blockable npc army] + 2 enip + clumzi spammers.
While u have 3 ppl back in your base defending vs 2 sins with shroud of silence?
What kind of magical build did u come up with if i may ask?

wow kaon, have u played vod recently ? did u watch our dervish blow up ?
These archers hit u for over 100 dmg on every hit if your a 60 armor target, with only increasing dmg every minut. gtfo

My gameplan is that what we've done with vZ for 30 games against sinsplit. Rawr build and camp in front of the base chasing their thief. They won't get any npcs (except probably your footmen). At vod you send bsurge warder+monk back to the base and dervish farm their archers. Shieldsup + soa+guardian should defend him against archers, spiritbond > clumsiness. We did it so many times in vZ it's not even funny.

Now to your defense i must say that shroud of silence is a totally new variable which i have no idea what effect it would have. But then that would be the problem, not the sinsplit. And a month ago we'd hold out with 25/25 vod instead of 15/0, together with their sins having superimpale combos.

There's other (but this would be theorycrafting) more unorthodox options. Perhaps running massive damage and water ele to just push into their faces and destroy them. Though this seems risky and bad to start with.

The thing is rau, half your guild has the same experience with sinsplit as i have, and you'd been doing great against HGH so i was WTFing the moment i saw you run weird shit in wurms isle.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jenny

O_o;;
are you on RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing crack or you need glasses to learn to obs a game Kaon?
oh wait ppl didn't teach you how to right... D: i feel sorry for you
first of all, its not the usual bad sin split we used to face 6months ago, u know ppl tweak builds n all ^ _ ^
everyone lost to Me tonight, its sad days for gw we all know that since a while but who cares? this game is dead as never
add the VoD part, say thx to Izzy for making the game as balanced as it is right now kthx

but wait, i don't see how u're trashing ppl because they lost to sin split on Wurms while u didn't even play monthly did you?
also u're in Town... i don't know... i'm not flaming Town but still
you don't play with them much because u say they suck or because they benched you?
also what build u'd play to face these ? eventually Me played sinsplit since they exist
we had 3+5mins to pop a build out of our ass in finals, we didnt expect to go any far with all the practice we had + Oxo (our core W) not being here lol
and afterall its like the match against sup, ppl didn't rly care that much anymore "we made top 16 lets take a break" we knew it wud be RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOd up so why not running a screwed build afterall (it was a mistake id give u that but w/e ?)

u're brave trashing ppl on guru,

I herd you ragequit cE a day before monthly.

Now to actually answer your questions

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jenny

but wait, i don't see how u're trashing ppl because they lost to sin split on Wurms while u didn't even play monthly did you?
also u're in Town... i don't know... i'm not flaming Town but still
you don't play with them much because u say they suck or because they benched you?

Notice we played and hit top16 inwhich we epicly failed in a match against aptly named uF.

Quote:

also what build u'd play to face these ? eventually Me played sinsplit since they exist

See previous post.

Quote:

we had 3+5mins to pop a build out of our ass in finals, we didnt expect to go any far with all the practice we had + Oxo (our core W) not being here lol

This suprised me, your guild has the best individual strength in gw and does not run shitty builds like americans do.

Quote:

and afterall its like the match against sup, ppl didn't rly care that much anymore "we made top 16 lets take a break" we knew it wud be RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOd up so why not running a screwed build afterall (it was a mistake id give u that but w/e ?)

This makes you brave.

Quote:

u're brave trashing ppl on guru

Thanks. I'm strong boiling points actor that does not give reward.

Rau · Jan 27, 2008, 02:03 AM // 02:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaon

My gameplan is that what we've done with vZ for 30 games against sinsplit. Rawr build and camp in front of the base chasing their thief. They won't get any npcs (except probably your footmen). At vod you send bsurge warder+monk back to the base and dervish farm their archers. Shieldsup + soa+guardian should defend him against archers, spiritbond > clumsiness. We did it so many times in vZ it's not even funny.

Now to your defense i must say that shroud of silence is a totally new variable which i have no idea what effect it would have. But then that would be the problem, not the sinsplit. And a month ago we'd hold out with 25/25 vod instead of 15/0, together with their sins having superimpale combos.

There's other (but this would be theorycrafting) more unorthodox options. Perhaps running massive damage and water ele to just push into their faces and destroy them. Though this seems risky and bad to start with.

The thing is rau, half your guild has the same experience with sinsplit as i have, and you'd been doing great against HGH so i was WTFing the moment i saw you run weird shit in wurms isle.

any comments on the new vod changes or are u still planning to hav monks with over 300 energy with 6 regen to pop out all the preprotting?

and we decided to go for smth completely diff in finals cause we played them earlier same map diff build and we lost that 1 to,

like i said kaon

WURM ISL. new vod
gg

Farin · Jan 27, 2008, 02:08 AM // 02:08

Cursed in any language.

I haven't played vs sinsplit in a long time but with 3 mesmers it sure seems like my rage factor would dramastically increase.

Kaon · Jan 27, 2008, 02:11 AM // 02:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rau

any comments on the new vod changes or are u still planning to hav monks with over 300 energy with 6 regen to pop out all the preprotting?

and we decided to go for smth completely diff in finals cause we played them earlier same map diff build and we lost that 1 to,

like i said kaon

WURM ISL. new vod
gg

Well i must say ive only played bad sinsplits in the new vod, but i cant imagine it being such a difference, as you have archers as well (and opponent has weak armor targets). Next to that it helps your defensive team stay alive!

Wurms isle is pretty awesome the first 18 minutes because it has a thief. I agree in vod it can be a bitch as their healthshrine can make the difference.

My real issue (as i inclined before) is that i was amazingly suprised you didn't run rawr build. I had hoped you guys would win but then you come with such a random build that i WTF'ed out of my chair. Had you run rawr build and lost i'd be standing next to you yelling sinsplit is retarded and izzy is fat.

Then again, you're brave running such a build. Now that the wtfeffect is over i'll give you guys cred +1 for it

.

Quote:

Originally Posted by RaZoO

Cursed in any language.

I haven't played vs sinsplit in a long time but with 3 mesmers it sure seems like my rage factor would dramastically increase.

You know what the most amazing thing is? We faced them in single eliminations on wurms too. They ran dervspike the rounds before so we added them to friendslist and knew they'd run it. We countered it and beat them. But suprisingly their players said:

"We didn't expect to win on this map anyway because our build sucks on this."

Making me believe they only ran one build, and then they suddenly come with sinsplit in later swiss rounds, amazing!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neo-LD

Way to discredit yourself.

Noone cares. You suck.

Rau · Jan 27, 2008, 02:20 AM // 02:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaon

Well i must say ive only played bad sinsplits in the new vod, but i cant imagine it being such a difference, as you have archers as well (and opponent has weak armor targets). Next to that it helps your defensive team stay alive!

Wurms isle is pretty awesome the first 18 minutes because it has a thief. I agree in vod it can be a bitch as their healthshrine can make the difference.

My real issue (as i inclined before) is that i was amazingly suprised you didn't run rawr build. I had hoped you guys would win but then you come with such a random build that i WTF'ed out of my chair. Had you run rawr build and lost i'd be standing next to you yelling sinsplit is retarded and izzy is fat.

Then again, you're brave running such a build. Now that the wtfeffect is over i'll give you guys cred +1 for it

.

amazing theory craft, i suggest you watch the game a few more times first, dont wanna flame u but rly; i cannot disagree more.

Kaon · Jan 27, 2008, 02:28 AM // 02:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rau

amazing theory craft, i suggest you watch the game a few more times first, dont wanna flame u but rly; i cannot disagree more.

Watching that game would not lend any information on the strategy im telling you. You lost 3-4 more archers than you should've. You had to send 3 people back to the base to defend, and your stand team wasn't equipped correctly.

And i wouldnt say its a theorycraft, as i said we did it so many times before, its just that a variable suddenly changed, which means it would have to be tested again versus a good sinsplit. And then again, archer damage would be the problem, not the sinsplit itself. In this case we would agree.

The archer damage and skill buff was RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing retarded.

Lorekeeper · Jan 27, 2008, 02:33 AM // 02:33

whatever happened to sportsmanship? You should applaud them for representing balance in the finals, not lambasting them for their mistakes.

A simple gg unlucky to cE wouldnt go astray... theres always next month to get out there and show everyone what you think people should have done.

And if you cant wait a whole month to walk the walk... at least show some manners and respect and point out errors in cE's performance in a mature manner that doesnt involve flaming them. Or is that kinda of discussion just not possible for guild wars players?

I am not one to talk about GvG but i thought cE's dervish was pushed up way too far forward in Me's NPCs (perhaps misunderestimating the buffed dmg on NPCs and overestimating the tanking power of the form), and cE's mid and backlines werent making good use of the wall that runs down the side of the flag stand, Me's mid and backlines avoided much of the NPC damage by hiding behind that wall. Even when cE attempted a second push towards the stand they still stood out in the open in clear line of sight of all the archers although by that point it was a foregone conclusion.

Its easy to criticise cE for not building against Me's sineptitude build, but how foolish would they have looked if Me pulled out a completely different build for the finals...

The shroud of silence really made things hard for cE to defend their NPCs without risking DP on a monk, so losing the outside archers and footmen was understandable.

I think cE could have done better at VoD, but i hope i didnt come across rude in that observation...

i think it was a good enough achievement reaching the finals... considering how messed up the final 8 turned out to be.

so i say gg overall and good luck for the next monthly.