Guild Wars Forums - GW Guru
 
Forums Guild Wiki PvX Wiki
 

Go Back   Guild Wars Forums - GW Guru > The Hall of Knowledge > Gladiator's Arena
Reload this Page Why Cap Points Are Bad for HA
Register FAQ Calendar Mark Forums Read

Notices

Closed Thread
Page 3 of 3 < 12 3
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old Feb 06, 2008, 03:53 AM // 03:53   #41
Academy Page
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Netherlands
Guild: Steel Phoenix [StP]
Profession: W/
Advertisement

Disable Ads
Default
Quote:
Originally Posted by elektra_lucia
GVG. I think it was sup.
We never played sup.
Quote:
Originally Posted by elektra_lucia
you are bad player
Make sure you are good yourself first, this holds no value now. Stop flaming already.

A bit more on-topic, cap points are quite cool and fun to play since they require coördination and the players to think for themselves. It also roots out some gay builds on the odd occasion (prolly why "Killed You Man" dislikes it cause his discord spikes get pwnd there) since it requires more ppl than just the caller to have any sence. If you constantly get pwnd by AoE.... move out of it or bring some disruption sources rather than 8 necro's with healing.

I do think it's a problem in halls, since there are more factors involved then your team knowing what to do. You can get some random team full of retarded spastics on one team that does nothing but rush your altar. Or some team that just plays to see you lose, but i guess that's more the problem of halls rather than the cap points mechanic.
Last edited by Whammo; Feb 06, 2008 at 04:49 AM // 04:49..
Whammo is offline  
Old Feb 06, 2008, 04:08 AM // 04:08   #42
Forge Runner
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Default
Quote:
Originally Posted by Whammo
A bit more on-topic, cap points are quite cool and fun to play since they require coördination and the players to think for themselves. It also roots out some gay builds on the odd occasion (prolly why kill dislikes it cause his discord spikes gat pwnd there) since it requires more then just the caller to have any sence.
I do think they are a problem in halls, but that's just the ganking/other team being retarded rather then the Cap points.
I dislike Capture Point because bad players/guilds (StP is ammong those, imo) can get to HoH because they have a 2 braindead Fire ele's who don't mind playing all day... I know of StP's inactivity, but I'm talking in general here.

No matter what you say, you can't deny the fact that it requires more skill and tactics to call a spike on capture points, than saying: Ok fire eles, SPAM your bar empty and we win. It's nothing more than this...
Killed u man is offline  
Old Feb 06, 2008, 04:19 AM // 04:19   #43
Legendary Korean
 
RhanoctJocosa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Guild: The Benecia Renovatio [RenO]
Profession: W/
Default
Quote:
Originally Posted by Killed u man
I dislike Capture Point because bad players/guilds (StP is ammong those, imo) can get to HoH because they have a 2 braindead Fire ele's who don't mind playing all day... I know of StP's inactivity, but I'm talking in general here.
because you're/your guild is so much better, right? besides, that's a pretty stupid thing to say.

i dislike cap pts because for the most part it's just a boring piece of shit until the end, and then it's just whoever can avoid getting raped by wards snares etc
RhanoctJocosa is offline  
Old Feb 06, 2008, 04:23 AM // 04:23   #44
Academy Page
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Netherlands
Guild: Steel Phoenix [StP]
Profession: W/
Default
Calling spikes can hardly be called "skillfull" at all. And yes i def. agree fire ele's are somewhat braindead spam templates. But isn't this what ha is about? The reason we bring 1 fire ele (we use 1 not 2) is cause of it's altar cleaning ability. We bring ONE character to do this rather than 8 so the other 7 characters can be more intresting/do other things. As long as there are altars involved where dumb spiketeam camp on like yours, ppl will bring AoE, be it a fire ele/Splinter/whatever else cause it's effective. If you think this is a bad idea... well you prolly won't be able to read this post so it will hardly matter.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Killed u man
I dislike Capture Point because bad players/guilds (StP is ammong those, imo) can get to HoH because they have a 2 braindead Fire ele's who don't mind playing all day...
First of all, we do 1 or 2 runs if we ever play and we run 1 fire ele. We ran 2 ONCE (nimblepugs are not included in the "we" :P). We don't get to halls because of our fire ele, we get to halls QUICKER because of that fire ele wiping noob spike teams like yours. Reason why we take it, major timesaver.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Killed u man
The ONLY reason why you have EVER beat me, is because the DPS of a Warrior
Right....... so you got pwnd by an axe warrior with shock and you complain about ele's? Make sence man.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Killed u man
bad players/guilds (StP is ammong those, imo)
So must be in one of the best HA guilds(lol) around yeah? I'm guessing no cause saying things like:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Killed u man
bad players/guilds (StP is ammong those, imo)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Killed u man
we play Dervish spike and discordway
kind of cancel each other out and smell of tardness.

BTW just curious: Did you ever get abused by someone called StP when you were a child or something? I'm just wondering where all the hate comes from.
Last edited by Whammo; Feb 06, 2008 at 04:43 AM // 04:43..
Whammo is offline  
Old Feb 06, 2008, 04:49 AM // 04:49   #45
Jungle Guide
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: USA
Guild: Lack of Talent [Luck]
Profession: P/
Default
Killed you man, while i agree that cap points dont belong in HA, I disagree that just by taking aoe you auto win.

but, there are a few things about cap pts that really bug me, and definatly make me say they need to go.

1) Forgotten shrines/Antechamber do a complete 180 turn on the tactics requires to play them than against halls, wheares altar holding and relic run are teh same in both pre HoH and in HoH

2)Templates that can be easily transported over to RA/TA are stronger than what you will normally find in a balanced build, thus owning ppl on split, taking 'tactics' out of the equation, when you can just face rape someone instead
Kyp Jade is offline  
Old Feb 06, 2008, 08:04 AM // 08:04   #46
Wilds Pathfinder
 
Akaraxle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Italy
Profession: E/
Default
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lorekeeper
i think the popularity of fire eles is explained by several contributing factors including but not exclusive to the fact that HA has 3 capture point maps in it.

They include

1) loss of LoD - HB+Heal party just doesnt come close to LoD's value cos of the energy cost
2) buff to rodgort's invocation making it an extremely powerful spike skill
3) rodgort's invocation on a mind blast ele bar = plenty of energy to regularly spike with a 25 energy spell.
4) dervish lead spikes buffed with splinter weapon and joined with rodgort's invocation = insane aoe dmg spike (and we all know HA scrubs love their 321's).
5) No one interrupts in HA, except the ghost with his always annoying dshot. Getting a rodgort interrupted hurts a lot (-25 for nothing), and a well placed pleak is bound to send a mblast ele into uselessness (= mblast spam warriors on high set) for quite some time. Not to mention diversion but LOLWUTSDAT?
Akaraxle is offline  
Old Feb 06, 2008, 12:36 PM // 12:36   #47
Banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: England
Guild: Leteci is [sexy]
Profession: Mo/
Default
Quote:
Originally Posted by Whammo
We never played sup.

Make sure you are good yourself first, this holds no value now. Stop flaming already.

A bit more on-topic, cap points are quite cool and fun to play since they require coördination and the players to think for themselves. It also roots out some gay builds on the odd occasion (prolly why "Killed You Man" dislikes it cause his discord spikes get pwnd there) since it requires more ppl than just the caller to have any sence. If you constantly get pwnd by AoE.... move out of it or bring some disruption sources rather than 8 necro's with healing.

I do think it's a problem in halls, since there are more factors involved then your team knowing what to do. You can get some random team full of retarded spastics on one team that does nothing but rush your altar. Or some team that just plays to see you lose, but i guess that's more the problem of halls rather than the cap points mechanic.
Maybe it wasn't sup then. I'm surprised you don't remember it. Ward of melee was attempted to be put up, way too late. So it got interrupted. Something wrong was going on with the aegis. The caller was absolutely moronic. The result, you got RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing rolled in the first one minute of the match. You don't remember? The point here is not if it was sup or someone else. It is the fact on VENT you were raging at the wrong people (as always).

I'm flaming? I'm barely flaming. The guy has written loads of crap, it got deleted (some of it) and I was simply replying. IF and IF he did not play in the last four to five months. Then my so called 'flame' won't matter because he won't of played with me. Do you get that? Yes / No?

My point here is:

If I say I have not been to America in 6 months and someone says, they were with me when I bought a CD. I say, They bought this god damn AWFUL dress. That in itself is ADMITTING I was in America. Do you grasp this? If he's going to accuse me of playing nothing but spiritway/heroway/thumper or other such things, in dead hours. Then you expect me not to reply?

He IS a bad player. It doesn't matter if it holds no value to you. ANYONE that has EVER played with him will know he is not that good. Your argument will be to this: Well you aren't that good either. No doubt. Moot point.

As for being good. I'm better than Warcock. That's good enough for me. I'm also more observant than him. A player that thinks he has died when he hasn't. Nice. Real smart.Oh but he didn't play in the last four to five months, so his only memory of me playing was with sOap probably. LoL.

I even defended StP. I said, don't think StP are all morons or bad players just because of warcock. This is true. I think Phe, Nimble and Nurse are cool... I can't help but remember how long you weren't in the top 100. I can't help but remember that the only time you kicked certain out of halls was when one player of the team err7'd.

'killed u man' is kind of like calling the pot calling the kettle black... Regardless, as a guild you've played legoway. IF he is honest -IF-, then at least he made those builds he played. They are not the kind of builds I'd want to play, or enjoy (lack of fun skills in there) but hey. He tried.
Last edited by elektra_lucia; Feb 06, 2008 at 12:48 PM // 12:48..
elektra_lucia is offline  
Old Feb 06, 2008, 02:54 PM // 14:54   #48
Jungle Guide
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: USA
Guild: Lack of Talent [Luck]
Profession: P/
Default
Quote:
Originally Posted by Akaraxle
5) No one interrupts in HA, except the ghost with his always annoying dshot. Getting a rodgort interrupted hurts a lot (-25 for nothing), and a well placed pleak is bound to send a mblast ele into uselessness (= mblast spam warriors on high set) for quite some time. Not to mention diversion but LOLWUTSDAT?
I took an interupt based build to HA for a couple months, was quite fun. I ran both a PD mes and a CG ranger, and then a PD/PB/HEV mes and magebane ranger. Lots of shutdown there, and if your ranger is good he can keep 2 mindblast eles crying all day. The problem with builds like this is they are very very powerful in the 1v1, but when you get to HoH, you find yourself lacking tools necessary to win on *gasp* capture points.

You have suffecient utility to take and hold the altar, and relic running in HoH is just a matter of outguessing your opponents (assuming no one ganks). But on capture points if you cant force a team off the altar then your only way to win is to try to split. That tactic is so much fail for reasons already outlined in this thread.

Interrupts keep your team alive, but hardly force kills on the other team, Unless you have some godly ranger who can use the match timer (*GASP* what a novel concept that!!!) and magebane channling on the heal monk all day while still catching mindblast from the fire eles. [The targeting system is still really crap tho, but the timer should be enough to let him know when to be where]
Kyp Jade is offline  
Old Feb 06, 2008, 03:45 PM // 15:45   #49
Forge Runner
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Default
I find that exact problem... And even if you DO manage to push a team of the altar, then the 3th team comes running up, at full HP, full Energy, wiping you in about 5 seconds. (Huray AoE spam) and they get away with the prize. (Swear to God, 1 penny every time this happened to me)

@ Wammo:

Quote:
Right....... so you got pwnd by an axe warrior with shock and you complain about ele's? Make sence man.
Look @ Discussion on the Axe warriors. Axe warriors are broken in such a way, that purely 1 on 1, they punch more DPS than anything. Obviously ONE class needs to be the C+Spacebar class, However, a regular fire ele would need to spam flare 24/7 just to keep up with a warrior attacking. (Proven in that thread)

My point here was that capture points promote too much "Solo Survivability". What's next, mend touch on our Rangers? STOP comparing HA to GvG or AB. If I wanted to run Relic, I'dd ask for a guest as flagger, If I wanted to run around for 10 minutes, getting owned by AoE, I'll play AB, HOWEVER, if I wanted to play a build, with alot of Synergy at 8v8 play, than I WANTED to play HA. Yes wanted, because now, with the introduction, I BARELY see ANY synergy between bars anymore. As much as people hated SoMW (It was overpowered, however, Anet could have nerfed it easily), you can hardly say the build wasn't original... Look at what we have now: Splinter on A/D, everything dies. Brutal on Ranger, everything dies. Rodgorts on that big ball of people, everything dies.

The ONLY skilled people I still see nowadays, are the Non-Migraine Mesmers. (Even monking has become a joke, HB => No interrupts, Every orison/dwayna's is a RoF, HP 1 second, AND often dual HB in 1 team)
I saw some amazing sh*t from Phe, Spartan and even Leeloof. (There obviously is more)

However, A warrior swinging his axe at a Ghostly Hero with splinter weapon on him. Whilst his 2 fire eles are frying the balled-up (They don't have a choice, once again) team, does NOT impress me...


Note: I keep going on about AoE, because Tacics have been discussed. It simply is UNFAIR. Like, there is simply NO way you can make fair. Look at Kyp's first post & mine. It can pretty much be described as a FREE win for BLUE, unless they get ganked (Or have No defence/AoE)
Killed u man is offline  
Old Feb 06, 2008, 04:23 PM // 16:23   #50
Banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: England
Guild: Leteci is [sexy]
Profession: Mo/
Default
I agree with a lot of what you say but I do think it's not hard to disable HB. I also think it's not that hard to interrupt quick spells.

Spartan is crap at observation/fails at interrupting. typical HA mes (finds it hard to disable more than one thing). Phe is decent at both. As for leeloof, he has so much fame that people have formed such strong opinions on him purely out of jealousy or hatred. He is a decent player x). Still rather have lettuice play mesmer than all of the above mentioned xD.

In my opinion (this goes for mesmer especially) They should have a great understanding of what is happening in the match without the need to be told on vent. Some things need quick reactions. It seriously makes me wonder when the opposing teams mesmer can cast every spell and it go un noticed.

To be honest in HA monking is kinda dull now. I tend to switch off (not play my best because of it).

I don't think Axe warriors are broken as there's so much to combat them. Same goes to fire ele. They're like the easiest thing to disable. Granted you could have a spell that was 5 seconds cast and kill everyone in sight. This would be easy to counter with an interrupt and obviously would still be over powered BUT I don't think that fire ele's are so over powered. The HA maps promote fire ele's.

Plus, every time I've gone to halls with a decent prot monk, spamming heal party in 40/40 pretty much kept the team up even if everyone went full on. The problem with this is, the prot monk has to bust his guts, and the fire ele just hits 1234567.

Making a profession so easy to play does I guess make it seem unfair. Then again, so is necro hexing or something.

In my opinion some professions are just much easier to play (depending on skill bar) than others. Each map and mode has sever problems. Look at GVG at the moment. PVE is certainly a joke. It's grind grind grind (which GW was advertised as not being). a-net doesn't fail. I'm sure they coined money, but they tried to make a semi-MMORPG into a competitive game, and in my opinion failed at both.

I do not really know many games that you would play someone other side of the world. The delay is ridiculous, someone has to have an advantage.
If you played some lame spike. I'm sure in a few years you'll be like. Who cares? For me, IWAY, spiritway, r-spike, such things aren't fun to play. so I don't play them. IF you find fun in playing them. Not only must you be absolutely brain dead to enjoy it but I admire you for being amused by such things.

Admire IWAY'ers. Kay?

As for making a build that wins. The satisfaction is there if you make a semi-lame build or a non lame build. Every build that you find extremely easy to win with, that is original, will later be classed as lame. If it wasn't, you would of attempted to make an under powered build. Which would make no sense...
Last edited by elektra_lucia; Feb 06, 2008 at 04:26 PM // 16:26..
elektra_lucia is offline  
Old Feb 06, 2008, 04:49 PM // 16:49   #51
Academy Page
 
t_the_nihilst's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Columbus, OH
Guild: So Goth We Crap [Bats], Friday The [13th]
Profession: Me/
Default
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ekelon

Besides, tactics are good. Even a team with a bad build can win if they have good tactics. It forces communication of the whole team, and really separates the r9+ players from the r3 players.
I disagree. I've seen many a high ranked team get rolled on this map.

I find that I usually do really well when with my guild on this map and really poorly with pugs (It doesn't matter what rank the pugs are).

Winning this map has to do mainly with communication and LISTENING.
t_the_nihilst is offline  
Old Feb 06, 2008, 05:29 PM // 17:29   #52
ǝuoʞoɯ
 
moko's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Default
less player, guild flaming. i don't care about your idiotic HA drama, if you want to have a good topic, don't post or GTFO.

sorry about closing this Kyp -- but i can't be arsed cleaning all the StP vs elektra and whatnot crap out of this.

feel free to remake the thread again, and hopefully the trolls will stay out of it.

usernotes are being handed out, i'm quite sick of this.

WTB Nurse back, this section fails without him.
__________________
Burning for your life
Some day it will burn out
Ready to sacrifice my life
For the perfect dream
moko is offline  
Closed Thread
Page 3 of 3 < 12 3

Share This Forum!  
 
 
           

« Previous Thread | Next Thread »
Thread Tools
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Help Me Farm Sunspear Promotion Points! i pay 1K per 500 points! spacejoop Services Offered 5 Feb 06, 2008 02:51 PM // 14:51
No Reward Points or Qualifier Points for HB Tourney Daily A Snype The Riverside Inn 8 Nov 06, 2007 06:23 PM // 18:23
I make so many sunspear points AND.....lightbringer points find out how here Tide to Go The Campfire 5 Nov 20, 2006 04:10 AM // 04:10
skill points and attribute points after level 20 Monk Here Questions & Answers 14 May 28, 2005 07:05 AM // 07:05


All times are GMT. The time now is 12:26 PM // 12:26.

Contact Us - Guild Wars Guru - Archive - Privacy Statement - Top

Powered by: vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
jQuery(document).ready(checkAds()); function checkAds(){if (document.getElementById('adsense')!=undefined){document.write("_gaq.push(['_trackEvent', 'Adblock', 'Unblocked', 'false',,true]);");}else{document.write("